Tares among the wheat

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Lanolin, Apr 19, 2015.

  1. There are churches everywhere these days. Search one out that teaches and preaches from the Bible.
    You will know the ones that do that on your very first visit!!!
  2. That is because you have rejected the Bible doctrine of the Rapture which leads to you not understanding what "The Tribulation" is.

    Matthew 24:21 ........
    "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be."

    Daniel 12:1 ...............
    And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation [even] to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book."

    Revelation 7:14 ..........
    And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

    Jeremiah 30:3-7..............
    ‘For behold, the days are coming,’ says the LORD, ‘that I will bring back from captivity My people Israel and Judah,’ says the LORD. ‘And I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.’ Now these are the words that the LORD spoke concerning Israel and Judah. For thus says the LORD: ‘We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask now, and see, whether a man is ever in labor with child? So why do I see every man with his hands on his loins like a woman in labor, and all faces turned pale? Alas! For that day is great, so that none is like it; and it is the time of Jacob’s trouble, but he shall be saved out of it.’

    Biblically there is THE Tribulation Period which will last 7 years. From the Rapture to Armageddon.
    Then the GREAT Tribulation Period will last 3 1/2 years, from the midpoint of the Tribulation (Jacobs Trouble) to Armageddon.

    Matt. 24:21 ..................
    "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be."

    Deut. 4:30...............
    "When thou art in tribulation, and all these things are come upon thee, even in the latter days, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice."
    Euphemia likes this.
  3. There is no doctrine of rapture.
    If you keep calling it that, which is not even in the bible.

    Jesus said we will be gathered from the ends of the earth AFTER tribulation, not before.
    Lets see, in noahs day...they entered the ark...did they have tribulation? Yes of course they were in the ark whilst the earth was being flooded. When did God send the covenant? The rainbow? After it was all over..the 40th day.

    Where the selected animals drowning .? NO. Not the ones in the ark. But they went through the flood just the same. They saw it happen. Noah was not somehow...whisked away to heaven not to even witness what God did. Revelation says we will not be hurt, those of us who have the seal of God on our foreheads.

    I am not sure what is hard to see about this, but..it seems tthose who believe in the rapture think heaven comes early. No it doesnt. Its only the last day, when Jesus returns. All the believers, those who ever lived, will rise up, with all those who are left who hadnt fallen asleep. Then we will all be together.

    If people think great tribulation is only reserved for people NOW they are wrong because...all those written in the book of life came out of it. Are people saying that those who are written in the book of life are only a select few living in this day and age? I dont think so. Came out of it doesnt mean never knew it! They went throught it!!!! Read your bible. Again. Not just a few verses out of context!!!
  4. Churches that preach from the bible yes. Churches that preach from the whole counsel of God are quite rare. I have been to churches that string a whole lot of verses together from different parts of the bible instead of actually reading the bible straight through like how one ought to read it. And miss bits out.
  5. If you are born again, it doesn't apply to you. You won't be here.
    Grant Melville and Major say Amen and like this.
  6. Maybe, just maybe if you spent more time reading and studying the Word of God instead of being on the internet you might learn about the Tribulation....Rapture.....Trinity and other Biblical precepts such as the doctrine of "Implied Truth". Just a thought.

    Do you believe in the Trinity???? WHY??? It is not in the Bible either.
    Do you believe that housecats lived in Bible days, in Jesus's day? WHY???? They are not mentioned in the Bible either.
    Do you believe that Gabriel is an Arch angel???? WHY???? He is not mentioned in the Bible as one. WHO KNEW????

    The Bible says...."Study to show thy self approved of God, a workman that rightly divides the Word of God".
    Euphemia likes this.
  7. How do you see
    Matthew 24:40 Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left.

    When do you see this taking place if not thru the rapture?
  8. Noah was prepared and left. He entered the ark, so he and his family were left on earth.
    Those who werent were not prepared and taken away by the flood.

    If we as christians have entered into the ark, eg the covenant with Jesus we will be left.

    Also see verse 29 that says 'immediately after tribulation' ...the word AFTER it doesnt say 'before' or pre-tribulation. Its quite clear to me, but if you wanna believe different, i cant stop you. Up to you.
  9. The resurrection at the end of the age. Bible nowhere talks about anything like a 'rapture'. its resurrection, resurrection, resurrection!!! Jesus was not raptured. He was resurrected. If you want to say he was raptured ie. Taken up into the clouds, the better term would be ascended.
    But he was resurrected FIRST.
  10. Your analogy is stinky. We will be taken away, just as Noah and his family were taken away, and some time later were set on dry ground, just as we will come back with our Messiah to earth to live and rule with Him for 1000 years. Jesus is not leaving His spotless Bride to undergo a spoiling by the Antichrist regime.

    Verse 29's "immediately after" is in reference to the Tribulation and the coming of Jesus Christ, with us, His saints.

    Keep studying. Don't stop, thinking you've got it, because you are missing it.
    Major likes this.
  11. The resurrection will occur at the end of the age, and it is a catching away of the saints---"harpazo", or RAPTURE You cannot throw out the teaching in scripture of the event based on an English word we use to describe it. Do you deny the Trinity? Do you ignore the bible? Both "trinity" and "bible" are not in scripture.
  12. Not one single Bible verse is referenced by you to support your opinion. Why is that?
  13. @Lanolin, the Lord says, "Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee out of the hour of trial, which is about to come upon the whole habitable world, to try them that dwell upon the earth." (Revelation 3:10). He says this in the Revelation, so He is speaking about a future time. He is speaking to those who kept the word of His patience, who waited for His coming, and He personally (it is emphatic) will keep them out of the hour of trial. We won't be on the earth, because He will have taken us out of it before the hour of trial, the tribulation.
    Complete and Euphemia say Amen and like this.
  14. Id be interested in where the term or use of the word 'rapture' was first used.
    I would have thought that a more accurate word to use would be "translated" as it was used in the time of Noah with Enoch.
    Who it should be noted was translated BEFORE the great outpouring of Gods wrath and judgment upon the earth .
    and while Enoch was translated before the flood.
    Noah was 'saved' through the flood. and the wicked all perished.
    This is also in line with in the days of Lot ,there was also Abraham .
    and albeit Lot was counted righteous for his "righteous soul was vexed......" and was then effect 'saved' .He walked by sight .while Abraham walked by faith . and was nowhere near the outpouring of Gods wrath and judgement upon the cities of the plain.
    Lot was deaf and blind to the hour in which he lived and had no idea what "God was about to do" While Abraham who walked by faith was in a place with God that God could tell him. That led him to pray for Lot.
    Both Abraham and Lot were as rich in this worlds goods at the beginning .So much so that the land could not bare them and there was strife .
    But while Abraham suffered no loss . Lot lost all but the saving of his own soul "as through fire" Rev
    So then the Bride and the foolish virgins or those who are spewed out"...... into the great tribulation"
    "They will suffer loss as through fire" Their works but stubble and straw . but their soul saved .
    The Bride however whos works will also be tried will have works of gold and silver as it were .

    in Christ
  15. Then I suggest you read the letters to the Romans and the Hebrews in particular .
    Paul used whatever scripture proved his case in an ARGUMENT much like a lawyer will use an argument that starts with the truth and with each step speaks the truth to lead us and his readers to the same conclusion and or judgement that he has .That as he was so led he then seeks to lead us in the same way that the Holy Spirit led him to come to or arrive at the truth .

    Not all scriptures pertain to redemption or sanctification or grace or the law or any other subject .
    But each sound doctrine has its parts through out all of scripture and to get some idea of the depths and hights and breadths of a doctrine even as to any understanding .You need to go through the Bible taking those scriptures that speak of it .
    Not all meals are made up of turkey or lamb or anything. Indeed if you only eat but one thing all the time it will do you no good.
    and as you said there is the WHOLE council of God .
    God in sundry times and in divers WAYS spake by the prophets hath in these last days spake to us by his son" Hebrews 1:1
    he then elucidates why Jesus is the Son of God and the fullfilment of what God spake of before at divers times .
    Even in the garden of eden where he is first mentioned .
    Was it not Paul who wrote to Timothy who said "ye have all the scriptures able to make you wise unto salvation"? he then only had the Old testement.
    and what of the Lord himself with the two on the road to Emaus "who beginning at Moses ..........." showed them all the scriptures that pertained and taught about his suffering and death of The Christ .
    Not all scriptures does so . But he clearly went through all the scriptures that did .

    in Christ

  16. I agree with the word rapture, that translation is best understood. Rapture was coined from the Latin root word, rapio, which means to be seized, snatched and carried away...with the unspoken connotation that it is being done because of ownership. However, today, people just don't use that sort of lingo and get confused and then become unteachable because they have a false idea that becomes set in. Jesus, the Bridegroom, in accordance with ancient wedding model, will come at an unknown time to gather/snatch/seize His Bride to Himself (something that belongs to Him) and take her to His Father's house. That we are translated (physically) as Enoch and Elijah was is secondary. The point is, we are spirited away to be with our Saviour!

    Noah was never translated. He was saved from the flood, lifted up and away from it and the wicked generation he was a part of... and died as any other man. You must be careful not to mingle and miss certain metaphors in scripture. Not everything pertains to the end. Some of it pertains to salvation. Most all point to the Saviour and His salvation.

    In this life we will suffer tribulation, but we are not on track to suffer The Tribulation that the unbelieving world will suffer. Only our works will be tried by fire and that occurs immediately after the Rapture at the Bema Seat judgment of Christ.
  17. The Wheat and the Tares
    (Matthew 13:24-30, 36-43)

    'Another parable put He forth unto them, saying,
    "The kingdom of heaven
    is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
    But while men slept,
    his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
    But when the blade was sprung up,
    and brought forth fruit,
    then appeared the tares also.
    So the servants of the householder
    came and said unto him,
    "Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field?

    from whence then hath it tares?
    He said unto them,
    "An enemy hath done this."
    The servants said unto him,

    "Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?"
    But he said,
    "Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares,
    ye root up also the wheat with them."
    Let both grow together until the harvest:
    and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers,
    "Gather ye together first the tares,
    and bind them in bundles to burn them:
    but gather the wheat into my barn."'

    - - - - - - - >

    'Then Jesus sent the multitude away,
    and went into the house:
    and His disciples came unto Him, saying,
    "Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field."
    He answered and said unto them,
    "He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
    The field is the world;
    the good seed are the children of the kingdom;
    but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
    The enemy that sowed them is the devil;
    the harvest is the end of the world;
    and the reapers are the angels.
    As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire;
    so shall it be in the end of this world.
    The Son of man shall send forth His angels,
    and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend,
    and them which do iniquity;
    And shall cast them into a furnace of fire:
    there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
    Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun
    in the kingdom of their Father.
    Who hath ears to hear, let him hear."'

    Hello Lanolin,

    This parable is only recorded in the gospel of Matthew, therefore refers exclusively to the Kingdom of Heaven and it's subjects,
    not to the Church. So this parable cannot be used as a template to determine end-time events relating to the Church.

    With love in Christ Jesus

    Euphemia likes this.
  18. Thanks for the info. It is always far better to use scripture to interperate scripture.
    But you suggest that the Bride will not be physically caught up to meet the Lord in the air. I see no where in scripture that suggests its all 'spiritual' for even as the |Lord was Physically resurected and then physically rose up into the air. So too will he also physically return "in like manner"
    This mortal body then will be changed in an instant in the twinkling of an eye from mortal to immortal corrupt to incorruption., But physical it will be . It is not then secondary but as important as the bodily resurection of the Lord and the bodily being caught up in the air also.
    I am now aware that I said Noah was translated at all .I said Enoch was . and that Noah was saved through the flood .Enoch was translated before it.
    I do not count the Salvation of God to be but BORNagain. That is but the 'S' as it were of salvation. The getting out of Egypt.
    The translation of the Bride is as much about the S alvation of God as being BORN again is.
    Indeed I know of no new born being or getting married .though they might be betrothed.
    The Spirit saith to the CHURCHES and of one in particular which in its own eyes is "rich increased in goods and in need of nothing " but which in Gods was Poor wretched and blind and in need of eye salve " and did not even know it .Who were called to repent lest they be spewed out into the great tribulation.
    The 10 virgins is not 5 sinners but all are 'saved' as you put it . But not all were ready having not thier vessels full.
    The world and the unbeliever are not looking for the coming bridegroom nor have their lamps lit .
    When the Lord is OUTSIDE the church knocking on the door its a call to ALL WITHIN THE CHURCH to repent .The promise however is only to those who have an ear and opened the door "to THEM.........." is the promise given.
    I dont hold that scripture ever speaks in metaphors .It does however speak in terms of "likeness" and of shadows or "foreshadows"

    in Christ
  19. No I don't, because we will.

    Yes He will return physically, but that occurs seven years after He gathers His ready and waiting Bride and whisks her off to His Father's house for the wedding!

    We will be changed to incorruptible flesh at the very instant that He calls us, and then we will be just like Him.

    Jesus doesn't knock on the Church. He is not on her outside. One is not of the Church, the Body of Christ unless he/she does repent, at which occasion we are forgiven of all our sins---past, present and future.

    As for the virgins, we are to make sure we are among the ready, filled and rich with the oil of the Holy Spirit---spiritually vital and revealing the light of Jesus Christ until the end.

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