Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Brother_Mike_V, Oct 9, 2014.

  1. What do we KNOW about Heaven?
  2. I know all I need to know!!!!

    John 14:
    "In my Father's house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you? 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. 4 And you know the way to where I am going.”

    God lives there!
    Jesus lives there.
    The Holy Spirit lives there.

    I am going to live there.

    Nothing else needs to be know for me!
    Heart_for_Christ, JG27_chili and Brother_Mike_V says Amen and like this.
  3. I believe the parable of the rich man and Lazarus (Luke 16:19-31) gives us a little bit of information as well. One thing we see is that it is a place of comfort.
    JG27_chili likes this.
  4. Traditionally, the principal attribute of heaven is eternal union with God, while hell is eternal disunion (or separation) with/from God.

    I personally hold that heaven and hell are the same place, and would akin the state to be like a bright light penetrating the darkness of one's soul. If they have prepared themselves, revealed their hearts to God and allowed God to deal with them in this life, there will be nothing hidden to torment them. But, for those who hide sins from God, once they are revealed those things will torment them.

    Though, important to note, Biblical doctrine holds that upon death we receive a foretaste of either state. It is not until the actual resurrection, and general judgment, that we enter heaven, as reported in Daniel.
  5. I am going to start here:

    Luke 23:43
    And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.

    2 Corinthians 12:4
    How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

    Revelation 2:7
    He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

    What is paradise to God; in the Bible? (Genesis 1:31)
  6. Before we get to far off the rails: the intent of this thread is not about 'how to get to heaven'; rather it is to explore what the place of heaven is and what it will be like. (and why we should be excited enough about it to preach about it as part of the Gospel!)

    Isaiah 65:17
    For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

    Isaiah 66:22
    For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

    2 Peter 3:13
    Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

    Revelation 21:1
    And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
    Major likes this.
  7. Yes Major! This is a wonderful piece of information for us believers who NEED to believe in what Heaven is; how about:

    Revelation 3:12
    Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

    Read all of Revelation 21

    2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

    10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, 11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; 12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels...

    If we believe what scripture says: Heaven is the eternal-PHYSICAL location where we will reside with God. Heaven and Earth are ONE realm where God dwells with His people. There is a NEW Earth, a NEW Heaven, a NEW Jerusalem.

    And we dirty sinners are NEW in body, mind in spirit-rather; ALL THINGS are renewed; cleansed.
    JG27_chili and Major say Amen and like this.
  8. God's Word is eternal-not some temporary state: so we carry over the principles of Scripture from this life to the next:

    Psalm 51:10
    Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

    Psalm 104:30
    Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth.

    Isaiah 40:31
    But they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

    Lamentations 5:21
    Turn thou us unto thee, O Lord, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.

    Romans 12:2
    And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

    2 Corinthians 4:16
    For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.

    Ephesians 4:23
    And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

    Colossians 3:10
    And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

    Titus 3:5-8
    Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.
    KingJ and Major say Amen and like this.
  9. Amen my brother!
  10. #10 Brother_Mike_V, Oct 14, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2014
    Revelation 21:4-7
    And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

    God is going to 'fix'; remake, rebuild, remodel-what was broken in sin and curse for eternal holiness. This list includes:

    The Earth (Continents, Plants & Animals, Atmosphere, etc...)
    The Heavens (Stars, Moons, Planets, Comets, etc...)
    Our bodies (The spirit, mind and body of His People!)
    His Capital City Jerusalem ON EARTH!

    His physical and spiritually eternal relationship with mankind as it was meant to be in Genesis 1&2

    How do we loose sight of this? How are we not excited by this?

    Matthew 19:28
    And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
  11. Yes. The "Paradise" side of Hades/Sheol is where all of the Old Test. saints went to waiting of Christ to take them with Him to their heavenly home.
  12. Friends;

    We know that we live in a fallen, sin filled cursed world: on the day of our death we will be released from this life and pass through God's judgmental fires. The 'Saints' will be cleansed and renewed as the stubble from this life fades away and our sins are removed like the dross of gold.

    For the lost, we know that they will be separated at the throne and eternally separated from the renewed Creation designed for fellowship between mankind and God. They will be cast off into the fires of hell, with a great gulf fixed between us and them.

    Brothers: we can know where we are going-we do KNOW where we are going- just as we rely on the Holy Scriptures and the Holy Ghost for assurance of salvation; the same applies to the place of Heaven. God gave us this glimpse into Heaven for the sakes of our faith-even though we have a peak into heaven-there is SO MUCH MORE!

    1 Corinthians 2:9 (Isaiah 64:4)-Read 2 Corinthians 2
    But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

    It's okay to 'imagine' the things of God; because you will not be able to comprehend the full magnitude of what God has planned for us in Heaven anyway! Heaven isn't some boring place where we are stuck in an eternal Church service; or floating around disembodied on the clouds: it is our Universe-our Earth, RENEWED in Holiness without Sin living WITH God's presence around us.

    We need to live this truth-only second to the Gospel message of Christ-IT IS OUR REWARD! And it isn't because of anything Good we have done-it is because of the Glory and Nature of God; who in His Grace and Mercy loved us enough to pay the price for us to: GO TO HEAVEN!

    For far too long have we dissociated the doctrine of Heaven from the Gospel message. How about we get excited about this New Life that we tell someone about Jesus Christ today and the rewards He has planned for us?
    KingJ, JG27_chili and Major says Amen and like this.
  13. Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
    Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

    Col 1:12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
    Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

    Php 3:20 But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

    Col 1:21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
    Col 1:22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

    Is Jesus in Heaven? If he is, so are you, if you are in him.
  14. Brother Mike, you should have quoted the next verse that goes along with 1 Cor 2:9

    1 Corinthians 2:9 (Isaiah 64:4)-Read 2 Corinthians 2
    But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

    1Co 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

  15. You are probably correct!

    What amazes me is that there is so little interest generated on forums like this on the subject of 'Heaven'. I just don't think Christians truly believe it -or are just plain ignorant. This should fire us up - DAILY! That's what we are looking forward to isn't it? Eternity with Christ?

    But most people are to consumed with finding ways to 'get around' God's Word to solve their temporary earthly problems...

    I am guilty of this too.

    Maybe we should repent, confess and BELIEVE it!
  16. Brother Mike, I can tell you why there is not a lot of discussion on Heaven anywhere is because very few people actually believe they are sitting there right now. Some how we think we will believe when we get there. That is how the "world" works, but for a born again Christian we believe first then experience it. Even salvation was given to us this way. God saved us and called before the world began. But this salvation did not do us any good until we first believed it then experience it.

    2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
  17. Hmmmm...

    Not sure how to respond to that? Would you mind elaborating this point:

    Though I would agree that we are included in what is to come; that we are currently 'surrounded' -if you will- by God's presence; there is still a future change that has to occur before we are in the 'eternal Heaven' as we will know it: spiritually AND physically.
  18. Yes, we are going to receive new supernatural bodies someday for sure. But for right now spiritually we are already sitting on the right hand of God in Christ Jesus. This can not be experienced until we first believe it. If we don't then it will not become a reality until after you die or when Jesus returns. The question can be asked, did Jesus, when he walked this earth, was he absent from the father in Heaven? Christ has always been with the Father, even while here on earth. Somehow we think God the Father was sitting on his throne in Heaven while Jesus was here on earth. The truth is God the Father was not only sitting on his throne in Heaven, he was also in Jesus Christ reconciling the world unto himself at the same time. Jesus said this about himself....

    Joh 3:12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
    Joh 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

    Not only was Jesus doing the will of His Father on earth, he was also with his Father in Heaven at the same time. In the same way we also are doing the will of our Father here on earth, and also sitting in Christ in Heaven.
    Very, very few Christian believe this, which is why they are not experiencing it in their life.
  19. Okay; I think I am following you on this: It seems to me we are dealing with the issue of whether or not we have the 'Holy Spirit' access in this present earth. Which would stem from a 'true saving knowledge of Christ'; or whether or not we believe in said access. Thus this lack of faith would deter us from 'seeing' the hope in our future.

    I guess it would be hard to talk about the place of Heaven without examining this; we need to believe it, to have it, to see it. And we are given that sight as children of God via the Holy Spirit upon acceptance of Jesus Christ. (As you noted in 1 Corinthians 2:10). So am I understanding your point correctly?

    But I don't want to turn this thread into a spooky 'are you really saved' bantering; I would like to focus on the "place" of Heaven itself. Although it would be noteworthy to continue this path.
  20. Mike, I know alot of believers would not agree with me on this, but that is OK. The Kingdom of God is a place where all believers have been translated into once becoming a child of God though the new birth. As we grow in the Lord and the power of his might we should be becoming more aware of our spiritual surroundings that is not of this world.
    The Apostle Paul knew all about this, and he prayed for the Church to God to give us this insight of what exactly we have today, so we could see it!!!

    Eph 1:15 Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,
    Eph 1:16 Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;
    Eph 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
    Eph 1:18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
    Eph 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,

    The word, "know" means "to see". to see what? the Hope of his calling. When the Lord "enlightens" your eyes, you see
    something. All light brings vision wether to our physical eyes or spiritual eyes.

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