Heart of the Matter

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Abdicate, Feb 6, 2016.

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  1. Yes grace is better than any healing. Jesus needed Him as he was to be more effective in delivering the gospel, as he obviously was. God acts on His purposes to bring to fruition what is best for you. Healing may not be what is best for you right now.
     
  2. Fiddle faddle.
     
  3. Whatever that means.. Answer the question. Is it a lack of faith if God CHOOSES not to heal their cancer? A believers faith in having confidence that God heals, guarantees no healing apart from Gods Sovereign choice in physically wanting to heal them. Does not death come to these bodies? As a result of sin? Until the new heaven and new earth (Rev.21:4), we will suffer certain effects that sins brings here and now. The new age sorcery of "the word of faith" movement and doctrine, promotes SELF deification. And heretically says or demands God to do as the wretched sinner wants out of selfish worldly pleasures and comforts.
     
  4. God is Sovereign! This is what all self righteous sinners HATE.. Positive confession or gnostic thought that "CREATES" what you want to come about, is witchcraft. And how would you explain Job and his situation? Word of Faith promoters are like Jobs self righteous friends who accused Job of sin, for having all that happened to him.. All the while Job stood faithful and humble! The Lord gives and the Lord takes, blessed be the name of the Lord!..
     
    crownoflife likes this.
  5. Word of Faith haters have it all wrong. It's all about faith in God through Jesus Christ the Saviour, His great grace and His wonderful word of truth.
     
  6. God's will is always to heal.
     
  7. A thorn in the flesh is a nagging pain. It is a steady reminder to self that obedience is key to finding favor with God; least a greater curse come upon me through my disobedience.
    When we do, what we should not do, and don't do, what we know we should do, there is consequences for our actions. We have delivered our own self before the Judge.
    What! now I WANT to cry about my thorn? Did I not believe the Word? Maybe I did not fear God properly and now I do. And maybe that thorn is God's thorn that keeps me in His righteousness, not my own. A constant reminder, my life is not my own (go do what I want, when I want, with who I want), I gave my life to Him, for Him to use for His will and His glory.
    Many are missing the mark. They come to God in selfishness, wanting the abundance of this life; God will bless us with our heart's desire, and if we settle for these treasures, we have our reward. We can not serve God and mammom.
    Many are called, but few are chosen. Amen
     
    Big Moose likes this.
  8. My objection is that by what has been said already the belief is that it is the a mans own words 'of faith' that heals them. This is wrong for reasons already stated .For man of and" by himself can do nothing"
    It is faith in GOD and the promises of God that "do the work" The glory then is no to the one who believes the promise but to the one who promises and does the work according to the promise.
    I do not object at all to the promise that God can and does heal people today according to the promise and it it is STILL disputed .
    PAUL in his letter to the Hebrews gives as part of the MILK of the Word "the laying on of hands" and any reasonable search of that phrase in the New testament let alone the Old .Will prove that it is a false teaching that those signs and wonders are not for today.
    Even as it is a false teaching that it is the man that "doeth the work"
    neither of which gives God any glory.
    The Sovereignty of God issue is another truth taken out of context of all scripture and missapplied.
    in Christ
    gerald
     
  9. God does the work by the power of Holy Spirit in whose gifts we walk. Denying Him and His power freely given to us by God's grace is a bad choice...and the reason so many Christians live powerless lives with no victory. Paul proves this to be true.
     
  10. "word of faith" movement and doctrine is new age gnostic heresy.
     
  11. Powerless lives? No victory? You mean your promotion of health wealth and Luxurious lifestyles?!! My victory is in the merits of Christ alone! And the glorification to come!
     
  12. He wasn't sick, he was attacked by the devil for pride. Grace would have removed all that except when in persecution.
     
    Euphemia likes this.
  13. Has everything to do with Gods Supremacy! And why the core doctrine that spews forth all these humanistic man centered SELF deification teachings exist today.. And that doctrine is the false belief of " free will". Mans will above Gods will.. No ones volition is free! You are either a slave and in bondage to sin or a slave to righteousness in Christ. Saved by Gods grace and mercy through the merits of Christ Alone
     
  14. Paul left Trophimus sick. Did he forget to speak faith? Or are some sicknesses for a reason? 2 Tim 20Erastus remained at Corinth, but Trophimus I left sick at Miletus.
    Timothy, Paul tells, to use strong drink or wine for his illness. He didn't direct him to speak words of faith.
     
    Coop likes this.
  15. That's a bold-faced, malignant lie.
     
    Abdicate likes this.
  16. More ignorance.
     
  17. Yes he did. Trophimus may not have humbled himself and repented of sin or he didn't believe. There was nothing left for Paul to do. There is NO promise of God for immediate instant healing, only the promise of healing. Jesus over and over said "let it be done as you believe". Instant healings happen, it's just not a promise to be instant because we doubt and must increase our faith to actually obtain. Sicknesses come from sin giving the devil the right to execute judgement. That's not changed since established by God. Whatsoever a man sows, that is what he'll reap. Sow to the flesh you reap corruption. Sow to the spirit and of the spirit you reap life. It's not a hard concept really if you don't theologize everything to uselessness. Everything is in balance and every objection to this teaching is in the extreme. Since one wasn't healed immediately, ALL healing is fictitious then they say. That's what all these objections are about. Due 28 spells it out. It is continued throughout the scriptures. But we in Christ do not need to remain there! Yes, we get sick, but we don't have to live there! Deal with the sin, repent and be healed. That's God's promise! You're wanting to dismiss the promise rather than understand why it's not working. Doubt is sin. "Trying" is sin. Speaking negative is sin. The Kingdom of God is taken by violence. So fight for it! Be the soldier God wants you to be! Live free of sin as Jesus commands. Then you'll have long life and prosper. That is God's promise.
     
  18. Paul would have ministered healing to Trophimus, and Trophimus would have appropriated the healing he had received in the atonement. He came back to join Paul in Jerusalem later. Meanwhile, Paul had to get going.
     
  19. BELIEVE, Faith speaks forth the Word of God and believes what is spoken; my faith and confidence (IN HIM) to do the work that I spoke into existence.
    Now, what does our mouth speak?
    Confident in God, or self?
    Faith in God, or self?
    Obedient to God, or self?

    Self, your life, is dead and gone; crucified with Him on the cross. When will we believe that we have died, already? When will we believe we are resurrected in Him, already? When will we believe our life is not our own?
    When will we believe that right now we have been given power and authority to speak in power and authority to every unclean spirit, walking in the unrighteousness of God?
    The world doesn't care they are offensive to us because they deny Him. So, why do we not address those unclean spirits with the spoken Word of God?
    Yes, we must work. Just like Nineveh worked when Jonah preached against the city. The city BELIEVED, and REPENTED. God saw their works and repented of His wrath He was going to send upon them.
    Well, Jonah knew God is merciful and Jonah got mad at God because what he preached against the city did not manifest. Jonah appeared to be a false prophet. But, was he? Jonah believed it was better for him to die, then to live, and continued to be mad. So God blessed Jonah with His love and placed a gourd leaf to give him shade but Jonah repented not of his mad toward God, so God sent a little worm to destroy the plant He produced for shade. Jonah was still mad.

    Seek out our SALVATION with fear and trembling.
    Jesus said we are to only fear God.
    Do we not fear Him yet?
    So when will we believe?

    God is bringing me around to His way, His Truth, and His Life; suppling me daily with His wisdom and understanding by revelation knowledge of Jesus Christ.
    Now, What He has freely given to me, who do I freely give it too? God's people in the house are just as busy wanting God to bless their precious little life with more money, as the people outside the house. And not for a second have we questioned ourself, " wait! It isn't about me, but Lord what have I done for you today?"
    As we live, move and breath; have our very being, we do so unto God.
    Is God pleased with us? No, but He is pleased with His Son; and because of His love for Jesus, He blesses us with gifts; gifts, freely given. How have we used the gifts He has given us to freely bless others?
    We can't get there of our own accord. We better be in one accord with Him and have entered in. He has a baptism to be baptized with.

    An open door, in heaven, was set in front of me before I ever received His baptism. An open door that no man can shut. I wanted to walk through that door. Everything is solid gold. Physically I could not climb the steps, they didn't come all the way to earth; only in spirit can I climb the Lord's steps and enter in. He is the Bridge in the gap, and only through Him will we enter in.

    Many have fought against the testimonies I have spoken. These are freely given to me to speak forth, whether one believes or not is not my call. My calling is to speak forth the revelations of Jesus Christ He has given me.
    Yes, the heart of the matter... God has not given us a spirit of fear, but one of love, understanding and a sound mind. Amen
     
    Abdicate likes this.
  20. BELIEVE, Faith speaks forth the Word of God and believes what is spoken; my faith and confidence (IN HIM) to do the work that I spoke into existence.
    Now, what does our mouth speak?
    Confident in God, or self?
    Faith in God, or self?
    Obedient to God, or self?

    Self, your life, is dead and gone; crucified with Him on the cross. When will we believe that we have died, already? When will we believe we are resurrected in Him, already? When will we believe our life is not our own?
    When will we believe that right now we have been given power and authority to speak in power and authority to every unclean spirit, walking in the unrighteousness of God?
    The world doesn't care they are offensive to us because they deny Him. So, why do we not address those unclean spirits with the spoken Word of God?
    Yes, we must work. Just like Nineveh worked when Jonah preached against the city. The city BELIEVED, and REPENTED. God saw their works and repented of His wrath He was going to send upon them.
    Well, Jonah knew God is merciful and Jonah got mad at God because what he preached against the city did not manifest. Jonah appeared to be a false prophet. But, was he? Jonah believed it was better for him to die, then to live, and continued to be mad. So God blessed Jonah with His love and placed a gourd leaf to give him shade but Jonah repented not of his mad toward God, so God sent a little worm to destroy the plant He produced for shade. Jonah was still mad.

    Seek out our SALVATION with fear and trembling.
    Jesus said we are to only fear God.
    Do we not fear Him yet?
    So when will we believe?

    God is bringing me around to His way, His Truth, and His Life; suppling me daily with His wisdom and understanding by revelation knowledge of Jesus Christ.
    Now, What He has freely given to me, who do I freely give it too? God's people in the house are just as busy wanting God to bless their precious little life with more money, as the people outside the house. And not for a second have we questioned ourself, " wait! It isn't about me, but Lord what have I done for you today?"
    As we live, move and breath; have our very being, we do so unto God.
    Is God pleased with us? No, but He is pleased with His Son; and because of His love for Jesus, He blesses us with gifts; gifts, freely given. How have we used the gifts He has given us to freely bless others?
    We can't get there of our own accord. We better be in one accord with Him and have entered in. He has a baptism to be baptized with.

    An open door, in heaven, was set in front of me before I ever received His baptism. An open door that no man can shut. I wanted to walk through that door. Everything is solid gold. Physically I could not climb the steps, they didn't come all the way to earth; only in spirit can I climb the Lord's steps and enter in. He is the Bridge in the gap, and only through Him will we enter in.

    Many have fought against the testimonies I have spoken. These are freely given to me to speak forth, whether one believes or not is not my call. My calling is to speak forth the revelations of Jesus Christ He has given me.
    Yes, the heart of the matter... God has not given us a spirit of fear, but one of love, understanding and a sound mind. Amen
     
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