The Sin Nature

[crossnote]

Before regeneration…
And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. --Ephesians 2:1-4

Regeneration:
But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),
— Ephesians 2:5

 

[Papa Smurf]

Papa.....the guilt of Adam, to us today comes from the fact that he was humanity’s federal (covenantal) head.

The original covenant God made with Adam in the garden carried with it both stipulations (the command not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil) and sanctions (the warning of death in the case of disobedience). Adam’s decision to reject the word of God brought both himself and his posterity into a state of guilt before God. As the covenantal head of all humanity, Adam’s guilt is imputed, or credited, to his posterity. Human sin resulted in divine judgment and placed humanity in need of divine grace.

Hello again Brother (et al), and thank you for your reply

First off (just to be clear), my question doesn't concern the validity of the doctrine of Original Sin (including its teaching concerning imputed guilt) as I, in fact, embrace all of it as truth (IOW, I'm not some sort of stealthy EO priest who's trying to secretly press the doctrine of Ancestral Sin here at CFS instead, or anything else like that ).

Rather, the question that I am hoping to have answered is practical in nature (a rubber meeting the road kind of question). Let me try asking it in this way, if what is passed along from Adam to us includes 1. a fallen nature that is inclined toward sin + 2. decay and death, but NOT the guilt of his sin, what practical effect, if any, would the lack of Adam's imputed guilt have on us?

This question usually comes up (in my mind anyway) when I end up in a conversation about the eternal fate of those who die as infants, because the Bible makes it clear that the end-times judgment of those who remain outside of Christ when they die will be based upon 1. their level of personal knowledge and understanding of right and wrong, and 2. what they did with that (knowledge and understanding) in this life.

IOW, their judgment and condemnation at the Great White Throne will be based upon their (actual/personal) guilt, not upon their nature or the inherited guilt that they received from Adam, so again, what does the "guilt" part of Original Sin mean for us in the rubber meeting the road sort of way? My only thought about this is that imputed guilt puts the final nail in the coffin of anyone who thinks that they are somehow "good enough" to merit Heaven on their own, apart from the imputed righteousness of our Savior.

Thanks for your help with this brother

God bless you!!

--Papa Smurf

 

[Major]

Hello again Brother (et al), and thank you for your reply

First off (just to be clear), my question doesn't concern the validity of the doctrine of Original Sin (including its teaching concerning imputed guilt) as I, in fact, embrace all of it as truth (IOW, I'm not some sort of stealthy EO priest who's trying to secretly press the doctrine of Ancestral Sin here at CFS instead, or anything else like that ).

Rather, the question that I am hoping to have answered is practical in nature (a rubber meeting the road kind of question). Let me try asking it in this way, if what is passed along from Adam to us includes 1. a fallen nature that is inclined toward sin + 2. decay and death, but NOT the guilt of his sin, what practical effect, if any, would the lack of Adam's imputed guilt have on us?

This question usually comes up (in my mind anyway) when I end up in a conversation about the eternal fate of those who die as infants, because the Bible makes it clear that the end-times judgment of those who remain outside of Christ when they die will be based upon 1. their level of personal knowledge and understanding of right and wrong, and 2. what they did with that (knowledge and understanding) in this life.

IOW, their judgment and condemnation at the Great White Throne will be based upon their (actual/personal) guilt, not upon their nature or the inherited guilt that they received from Adam, so again, what does the "guilt" part of Original Sin mean for us in the rubber meeting the road sort of way? My only thought about this is that imputed guilt puts the final nail in the coffin of anyone who thinks that they are somehow "good enough" to merit Heaven on their own, apart from the imputed righteousness of our Savior.

Thanks for your help with this brother

God bless you!!

--Papa Smurf

Well...I could repeat what Ezekiel said in 18:20 & 19-32
"The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment of the father's iniquity; nor will the father bear the punishment for the son's iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be on himself."

Though there are many passages that contradict the doctrine of original sin, I can think of none that do it stronger than these verses in Ezekiel. By that then Any doctrine that says we are judged by the conduct of our ancestors, including Adam's, is clearly wrong.

Do we simply remove Psalms 51:5 from our Bibles............
“Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.”

Or, In Romans chapter 5, the Apostle Paul makes the following observations:
“Through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin” (v. 12).
“By the one man’s offense many died” (v. 15).
“Through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation” (v. 18).
“By one man’s disobedience many were made sinners” (v. 19).

Taken out of context, this verse in Ezekiel 18:20 might seem quite helpful to the position against Original Sin. However, Once we read it in context, though, such a view of the verse collapses, for the verse is part of a larger rhetorical message, namely, if you repent, you will be saved – regardless of the sins of your parents or children.

Ezekiel is speaking of the guilt of the father’s sin never being held against his sons. The same idea was from Moses when he was referring to the consequences of the fathers’ sins being passed on to their children. Unfortunately, if a father is a drunk, the children can suffer abuse and even poverty. Likewise, if a mother has contracted AIDS from drug use, then her baby may be born with AIDS.
All sin has consequences. If you want to call it guilt, that is OK. But actually it is consequences from what was done.