Rightly Dividing

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Noblemen, Jul 4, 2016.

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  1. Yes, salvation was sent to the Gentiles, and they did indeed hear it, and by hearing, believed and received all that was for them to receive in Christ Jesus their Lord, to the glory of His grace.

    Yet that 'church' (of Ephesians 1:21,22) was a new creation: it's hope, it's blessings, and the sphere in which those blessings were to be enjoyed was all quite different from what had gone before. This company was now a unity, Israel had no prior claim here. It's blessings were spiritual, it's hope heavenly, and it's state one of acceptance in the Beloved, being made complete in Christ Jesus their Lord. No water baptism was required of them, no ritual of any kind, for all was of the Spirit and in spirit, the flesh counted for nothing.

    This was not accepted by many who formerly followed Paul, and he found himself deserted by most at the close of his life. For this truth, made known by revelation, was not searchable, it not having been the subject of Old Testament prophecy, it was made known only to the Apostle Paul.

    In Christ Jesus
  2. The gifts of the spirit should be seen in us today. That is correct that we do Not follow after signs and wonders However signs and wonders should be following every born again believer,especially in these days.

    Signs and wonders are literally what is seen of God working or God's power through us.

    They are for the lost to see and should encourage the believer.

    God's word is the same today as it was in acts. We are under the same new covenant.

    We today have white washed religious beliefs being in twined into What is being taught as God's word and ways.

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  3. #23 Complete, Jul 4, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2016
    Hi @Fish Catcher Jim,

    How is the power of God manifested within us, if not by a change of life? A life lived within the assurance of a life which is hid in God. A life lived within the assurance that sin no longer has dominion over us, and that it's power manifested in death has been vanquished where we are concerned. We having the hope of resurrection life, in Christ- 'Praise God!'

    The covenant was made with Christ before the foundation of the world, and that is the only covenant we acknowledge. Not the new covenant spoken of during the Acts, which replaced that made previously, which was to Israel - both new and old. Gentiles shared in the blessings of this covenent during that period, which had a hope and blessings which relate to the earth and are to be enjoyed in the earth. That changed following the laying aside (temporarily) of Israel in unbelief at Acts 28.

    Our life should be a witness to the joy and thanksgiving of sins forgiven and complete assurance in the finished work of Christ on our behalf.

    The church which is His Body, is known of God, and it's witness is to those in heavenly places, to whom the wondrous grace of God is being revealed through us. (Ephesians 3:10)

    The power of God is being manifested through us, for He is faithful and will do it.

    Praise His Name!

    In Christ Jesus
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  4. God trying to reach the jews all through the book of Acts, even through their understanding of the law was stopped, Acts 28:28, and now the gospel was going to the Gentiles and they would receive it.
    Ananias and Sapphira is a prime example of God trying to reach the Jew through the law. He does'nt take people out under grace.
    No book of the Bible is closed, God can use a donkey if he will.
    The way God handled people, human beings, changed, Acts 28:28.
    I have known many people that have sold all and joined together for a good cause, like they did in the book of Acts,all to no avail, that is not the way we operate as a Christ person. It worked for them, the church was getting its roots, they were finding their way but it's not the way for us to live we are not a commune.

  5. You totally missed the point that was being made when talking about selling and giving. We the church should be providing. Not the government but the church. No Christian should ever be in lack either.

    Remove the commune from your thinking. Replace it with God's way of doing things. :)

    The problem with the replies in this thread come from replies confusing the issue.

    People before Pentecost are being compared to believers after Pentecost and making a doctrine from it. :) as to prove a point.

    Before Pentecost only the Priest and Prophet and kings were given the Holy Spirit but after all that receive Jesus, well the Holy Spirit is given.

    Lying to the Holy Spirit or trying to deceive is what got the two killed.

    My dear friend I am not trying to argue with you at all. I believe this thread could bring out some good truth. I am saying that from the replies being posted the issue is being confused and the thread is going all over the place.

    I so enjoy what you bring to the table my friend. Don't stop !
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  6. Hi Chris, :)
    Here is a quote from your reply.
    ((The covenant was made with Christ before the foundation of the world, and that is the only covenant we acknowledge. Not the new covenant spoken of during the Acts, which replaced that made previously, which was to Israel - both new and old. Gentiles shared in the blessings of this covenent during that period, which had a hope and blessings which relate to the earth and are to be enjoyed in the earth. That changed following the laying aside (temporarily) of Israel in unbelief at Acts 28.))

    My question is where in His written word do you find this ?

    The new covenant was made when Jesus finished His work here on earth via the cross.

    The curtain was torn or destroyed as a sign that the old way was done and now there is One cleansing of Blood forever more and that is through the blood of Jesus.

    This new covenant which includes Grace is on going. This new covenant preached in acts or any other book or gospel is still in effect and is for All.

    Now then if I totally misunderstood what you were saying then I apologize for going on here.
    Hugs and love in Christ
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  7. Hi @Fish Catcher Jim ,

    I acknowledge your post, but it is too late at night to respond properly now, I will come back to you on this (God willing).

    No offense taken. :) Your request for confirmation understood and appreciated.

    With love in Christ Jesus
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  8. Well see, you cannot provide any scripture to establish that it's for the apostles only. It's an excuse for those to not require the power as a demonstration of who they are in Christ. And why don't you look for signs or wonders or manifestations as proof? The power of God is manifested all throughout the word of God and it's only because the church is so weak they dismiss it or they're not mature enough to experience it to know that it's for them too. I've experienced many signs and wonders and in the flesh. Yet, my testimony isn't enough for some and I'm dismissed as a false teacher! As I said, many use the word of God as a historical book and do not see it as applicable to them today. What is it to walk in the spirit or to have faith if they're not manifested? A false religion, of which we have in abundance. I can't help with that and why I stated what I stated. Yet you confirmed it with different words meaning the same thing. God bless.
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  9. Thank you Chris and may God bless you with sound and peaceful rest, awakening renewed for the day.
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  10. #30 Complete, Jul 5, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2016
    Hi @Fish Catcher Jim,

    It's late but I must try to answer if only in part.

    1) Titus 1:2 says that eternal life was 'promised before the world began'. 2 Timothy 1:9 says that the believer was called according to the Lord's own purpose and grace 'which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began'. Ephesians 1:4 says that such were chosen in Him before the foundation of the world'. Here are covenants, agreements, promises, but they were not made with or to us - they were made with Christ. - Praise God!

    So, when we examine 2 Corinthians 3 and 4 we see that everything turns on two mediators - Moses and Christ. How thankful we should be, to think that so far as the Church of the One Body is concerned there are no contractual agreements, no covenants, no testaments, that involve the believer, he finds all in his completeness in Christ.

    2) While the people of Israel dominated the scene, as they did during the Acts of the Apostles, the Gentile could receive this initial blessing, the forgiveness of sins, in association with the covenant People for 'salvation is of the Jews', but the remaining promises of the New Covenant, unquoted in Hebrews 8, and still awaiting fulfilment, refer exclusively to the restoration of Israel, and of Israel alone. No Gentile has a place in the second and future half of the New Covenant. (Jeremiah 31:35-37). This phase of the New Covenant, echoed in many other places where the restoration of Israel to their land and the fulfilment of all the promises made to the fathers will be accomplished, is the burden and glory of these prophetic Scriptures.

    Any attempt to obtrude the New Covenant into the dispensation of the mystery which intervenes from Acts 28:28, until Israel repents, must be false, and have a blinding effect upon all who perpetuate such teaching.

    With the onset of complete blindness upon Israel, warned of by Paul in Acts 10, and which came into force in Acts 28, the dispensation of the mystery begins. The New Covenant and the dispensation of the mystery cannot, and do not, run together.

    Only when this parenthetical dispensation of the mystery is finished can the New Covenant come into operation, as it surely will do. Praise God!

    Forgive the length, and incompleteness of my response, FCJ.

    In Christ Jesus
    Our risen and glorified
    Saviour, Lord and Head

  11. @Complete Hi,
    Wow thank you for taking the time to reply. However now it is late here and after some unexpected events I am way to sleepy to think so I copied your reply and will read and respond tomorrow.
    Have a wonderful day
  12. Hello @Fish Catcher Jim ,

    Thank you for your kind response. We may not agree on this, but we are both within the love of Christ, and precious in His sight.

    Hoping you too had a restful sleep.
    In Christ Jesus
  13. I did not say the power of God was for the Apostles only, where did you get that idea, @Abdicate? It is the power of God which works within us, in Christ Jesus, and will lift us up into resurrection glory.

    I believe we are misunderstanding each other. Regarding your testimony concerning the power of God in your life, I praise God for it my friend. I will visit your webpage to see if you have spoken of this there, so that I will know what you are referring to.

    Within the love of Christ.
  14. @Noblemen,

    Forgive me for having so much to say, and for derailing your thread.

    Praise God, for His infinite mercy and grace.
    In Christ Jesus
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  15. I
    I understand Jim, we are all trying to express and write on here a life time of learning and it comes out sounding strange at times, I get that.
    Just out of curiosity what is your take on Ananias and his wife.
    I do a whole lot better setting in a group with our bibles open and looking at the scriptures.
    This online stuff is tuff to express what is really going on.
    But at the same time we are able to fellowship all over the world, I personally see it as a God thing.
    I have always maintained that I'm not a writer, but I love to write.
    When I was first born again, I started writing in note books for years. So through the years it has just kind of transpired into the online thing now.
    I still have my note books never shared them with anyone, it was just something I like to do.
    I'm saying that because when I read those that seem to have a gift for writing, I don't see the same thing in myself.
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  16. In reply #20 you said:

    dispensation: a system especially as existing at a particular time.

    You're saying that the gifts of the spirit were only for the time of Acts. God is unchanging, it's only man that keeps changing God. Everything written in the word of God is for us today. In fact, John says:

    1 John 4:17 (KJV)
    Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

    Here and now, in THIS world. How is Jesus now? Sitting on the right hand of God the Father. Is He sick and powerless? Nope. So why are we? Undealt with sin. Jesus paid for all our sins and through Him we are dead to the law which gives birth to sin and we are raised like Jesus! Yet, because WE have not dealt with the old man, we're left sick and many sleep, like Paul says. We must believe in God's promises.

    Hebrews 3:12 (KJV)
    Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. ​

    In the Greek, "evil heart" is actually a heart full of labours, annoyances, hardships. This is why Paul says:

    Romans 4:20-22 (KJV)
    He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God; And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. ​

    It's a matter of belief! How fully persuaded we are in God's promises is the level we receive those promises. Through Jesus,

    2 Corinthians 1:20 (KJV)
    For all the promises of God in him [are] yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us. ​

    Yes both in Greek and Hebrew! :D
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  17. @Complete @Noblemen

    Greetings and blessing to you both.
    I wanted to let you both know that I am going to reply to your replies to me and I wanted to let you know my day just got Full and I may not get a chance to do so today.

    I just did not want you to feel that I did not value these replies and know that I do and have not forgotten you. I just do not Desire a quick retorte as a reply to you but rather take the time to relax and listen for guidance from the Holy Spirit as I sit down to reply.

    Thank you and have a wonderful day.
    Cturtle, Complete and Noblemen says Amen and like this.
  18. #38 ozarks, Jul 5, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2016
    I am not sure what you are saying by having more, more.

    There is the correct teaching of the law and the perverse teaching of the law, right?

    When you refer to legalistic teachings, what you state is considered false teaching and also, on the part of those listening and defending such false teaching, laboring in vain?

    Those teaching and those listening may not be familiar with all Scripture. NT Scripture has an example of Peter and another not knowing/understanding Scripture detailing The Risen Christ.

    Luke 24:4-7, 44

    And it came to pass, as they were much perplexed thereabout, behold, two men stood by them in shining garments:

    And as they were afraid, and bowed down their faces to the earth, they said unto them, Why seek ye the living among the dead?

    He is not here, but is risen: remember how he spake unto you when he was yet in Galilee,

    Saying, The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.

    Luke 24:44

    And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

    John 20:9

    For as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead.

    False teaching is a serious violation of Jesus' Gospel. The Holy Spirit is our teacher and we search Scripture to conclude whether we are listening to the Spirit of Truth whenever we listen to our Pastors and teachers. For plain Ol' me, the following verses are helpful in all aspects of my life. For Pastors and teachers, these verses are helpful too.

    Luke 22:39-40

    And he came out, and went, as he was wont, to the mount of Olives; and his disciples also followed him.

    And when he was at the place, he said unto them, Pray that ye enter not into temptation.

    The challenge of looking up each listed Scripture Smith lists for each chapter of his book keeps me busy.

    In The Covenantal Structure of the Bible, author Ralph Allen Smith wrote what the law was and was not.

    4. The law of Moses, like every other covenant administration, included the threat of the curse for disobedience and the promise of blessing for obedience, but it was not, nor could it have ever been, a “legalistic” covenant. The Pharisaic interpretation of the law was, as both Jesus and Paul taught clearly, a perversion of the law’s true meaning. The law was given as a blessing for Israel to lead her in the way of joy, prosperity, and peace (Deu. 6:10-11, 24; 8:7ff.;10:13; 12:7, 12, 18; 14:26; 16:11, 14, 15; 26:11; 29:9; 30:5, 9, 15). The greatest blessing of the law was the tabernacle, a God-given sanctuary, His dwelling place among His people. The promise of the covenant that God would be with His people found concrete fulfillment in the gift of the tabernacle sanctuary. However, this too was clearly temporary, since the law looked forward to a more permanent sanctuary to be established in the future in an unspecified location (Deu. 12:5, 11, 14, 18, 21, 26; 14:23-25; 16:11, 15, 16; 17:8, 10; etc.).

    This book may freely be copied and distributed under the conditions that the content is not altered and credit is given to the author.
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  19. Well there could be a really big problem...NOT looking for the spiritual manifestation in the flesh.
    How do we recognize another Christian? Or a demonic spirit?
    I mean it is only by the way they look, right? Or is it by the spirit that speaks?
    The spirit is manifested in the flesh!
    Glory be to God. Amen
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  20. We "know we no man after the flesh" Second Corinthians 5:16.
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