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Love Among People -- What Isn't It? What Is It?

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by TezriLi, Aug 12, 2014.

  1. I see it. People in a supposed relationship -- whether a couple, a parent and child (young or adult), siblings, etc. -- but one of them is completely disrespectful. I also see it acted out. They're walking down the street, and one is way ahead of the other, while the one behind is double-stepping to try to keep up or they seem to be trying to keep up a conversation. Still, one or more will whine, "But I love him/her!"

    One is physically or emotionally abused by the other, and they will both protest, "But I love him/her!"

    One is commanding, controlling. Yet the one under command says, "But I love him/her!"

    One pays no attention to the other, or even to the family. But they say, "But I love him/her!"

    What is love, if it accepts these abuses? I cannot accept that this is what unconditional love is. This, to me, looks more like something very unhealthy. Infatuation? Addiction? Emasculation?

    Certainly, I know that old saying that love is a verb, but another definition is an intense feeling of deep affection.
  2. Too deep a subject for a discussion here, but as to abuse - it has nothing to do with "love".

    Back when I was a barfly - One evening I was at my favorite dive and a young woman (20 or so) was complaianing about the spat she had with her boyfriend in which he pushed her out of a moving car, luckily her injuries were very minor. I asked why she would tolerate such a violent and insensitive oaf, her reply "I love him". I would suggest that the poor girl had esteem issues that lent her to believe that she deserved this type of abusive behavior and only reinforced the emotional dependency she had on the abuser. None of this insanity had anything to do with love.

    I would venture that there are very few who actually know how to love or to be loved.
    people just go through the motions.
    God is Love and TezriLi say Amen and like this.
  3. What is described in the OP is not "unconditional love". Unconditional love is still loving someone, despite their wrong or inappropriate acts, by responding progressively appropriately to continuing wrongful acts. It does no good or benefit to either the wrong doer or the victim to tolerate it's continuance. Anyone, in my life, that I started loving, I still love, though I'm no longer with them. In any relationship "break-off" I strongly advise looking on your own contribution to the failure, exclusive to the other, so you will learn - go - and sin no more. :).
    God is Love and TezriLi say Amen and like this.
  4. Yet I hear it all the time -- people calling this love....
  5. I think the closest thing we as human's get to unconditional love, outside of G-d, is with many (obviously not all) parents. Someone once said that we seek the love our parents taught us.
    TezriLi likes this.
  6. Because there are 'get gets' and 'give givers'.

    'Get gets' are looking for all they can get.

    There are many reasons for 'give givers', some are seeking acceptance, and even 'getting' by pacifying. Some are true givers, givers of unconditional love.
    TezriLi likes this.
  7. 4 Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud 5 or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged. 6 It does not rejoice about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out. 7 Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance

    Based on above definition of love, if someone is physically abused and still wants to stay with the abuser, wouldn't that be based on love?

    16 “For this is how God loved the world: He gave[a] his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life

    It was love for which Christ came down to earth and suffered. He was abused for us. Because of His love for us.. And when Lord says, love your neighbor as you love yourself, what is He expecting from us?
    TezriLi likes this.
  8. I apologise to all of the people on this forum upfront as what I am about to say you will not like, nor want to hear.

    There is NO unconditional love.


    Not even God gives that, because he has clear and concise limits to what he will love.

    No human loves unconditionally, even of their children.
    No animal loves unconditionally either.

    There is always a limit somewhere in love. It may take a long time to present itself, but it is there.

    We have to be honest with ourselves, that if we look we will find that we all set conditions. Some more lenient than others.
    autumn oddity likes this.
  9. What is the condition for God to love us?
  10. Not doing as we must by him. When we call lord lord he will say he doesn't know us. That is where there can be no more mercy shown in love.
  11. I don't know if that answers the question. On what condition God chooses to love a person?
  12. I used to agree with your premise. I used to say and believe that I was incapable of unconditional love. Used to. Up to a couple days ago, when I realized: I have loved unconditionally. While this is not a guarantee I can do it in the future, I have a history I can look back on that I am capable of unconditional love.

    (I'm going to whisper this to you only -- you alone. So don't tell anyone. Okay?) When my husband and I became engaged, I was so blatantly honest with him. I wanted him to have no surprises. I thought he did the same thing, but he didn't. He had a lot of very bad secrets that, if I had known, I would not have married him. No way, mister. No stinkin' way. Further, I could not get along with his son. At ALL!

    This was my second marriage, and I had two children from my first. When my daughter was in her mid-teens, she was led by a church family to do things she should not have done. Very bad stuff.

    Here's what happened:
    As the truth came out, developing over @ 10 years -- correction: over more like 18 years -- , I stayed with my husband. I hated him with my whole heart for a couple years, but I had learned that love is an action, so through that time I acted out love but felt none. Meanwhile, in the early years, there was my daughter. In spite of her actions and attitude, I just loved her. Her occasional verbal abuse of me did not change that one bit. Her horrible actions did not change that. I loved that girl. My husband's son? I tried to learn to love him, but all I could muster was a love-in-action thang. My son and his daughter? They were easy to love.

    Here's what developed:
    My daughter realized she was acting outside of her own wishes, doing what she did not want to do, and she repented. Love won out.
    My husband's son grew up. Love won out.
    My husband? I put up with, put up with, put up with, but I stayed and served. Then I gave him my final ultimatum. Straighten it all up, admit it ALL, repent, because you have used up all your chances, and I am through. I am not ghoing to put up sith any more. Period. He heard me. Was that love? Yes, it certainly was, because I knew he would understand the deal and start living right if I stood my ground. I wanted him to live right before G-d, and I would not coddle him anymore.

    Here's where they are today:
    My daughter is a beautiful believing mother, wife, and worker who could not be better.
    My husband's son is a father, husband, and worker who is developing well, especially over the last year.
    My husband, as I told him last night, is all of the man I thought I was marrying over 27 years ago. I can hold my head up and love him with everything that I am now.
    My son? He's just traveling along, making me happy with the father, husband, son and worker that he is.
    My husband's daughter? Well, there's a problem there. We don't see her but I never quit loving her.

    Now. Let me write something about G-d. You are wrong about Him. He provided every opportunity for people to be saved, and He accepts our pitiful little efforts toward Him as though we have done great exploits. How? By His Son. Do you think I would give my son for you? NO STINKIN' WAY! I don't have that kind of love for you, but G-d has proven His love for you that He already did it. That is unconditional love, because He completely provided everything for salvation before the foundation of the earth. If we reject that, we're just stupid. Period.
    autumn oddity, dUmPsTeR, God is Love and 1 other person say Amen and like this.
  13. Unconditional love also lords over staying in love with someone.

    The classic definition is to love them despite the ills they cause.

    God will not accept a willful sinner.
  14. Had your daughter not change her ways would you still feel the same as now? If you say no, then it is conditional.
    If the son had not grown up, would you love?
    If the husband had not repented?

    You held the standard, change or else. God does the same.

    Repent and change your ways or else face destruction.

    Conditional love.

    Unconditional love is a mythical ideal that we'd like to live by. An aspiration, but not realistic.
  15. Consequences to your choices, has nothing to do with consigning "conditions" - God still loves the sinner.
    TezriLi likes this.
  16. Said more plainly, you cannot earn God's love - it is there - freely given with no strings attached. The consequences of your rejecting this grace is a condition YOU choose.
    TezriLi likes this.
  17. I do not consider it love at all when the unrepentant sinner is destroyed.

    Love has limits. Repent or die. It is pretty clear.

    If God was unconditional in love we would not be sinners. He'd just look past and say oh well they are fallible you know.

    The boys will be boys argument.

    Sinners will be sinners, oh well, got to love 'em. Nutzy sinners you!

    No there are clear constraints on God's love. Or else he'd even forgive the enemy as well.
  18. If I sit in a prison cell, was it the police or the warden that put me there? Or was it something I did? If you are a parent, did you let your kid play on a freeway? C'mon. What exactly do you see as love? Love is not about sitting by when someone you claim to love entangles themselves in self-destruction. Or worse, join them in it. Do you know for a fact that God wouldn't forgive a truly repentant Lucifer?
    TezriLi likes this.
  19. #19 LysanderShapiro, Aug 13, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2014
    If Jack loves Jill but Jill wants nothing to do with Jack, Jack cannot force Jill to love him. And if Jack means what he says, then he will love her enough to leave her alone because that is what she has decided.

    Those who go to hell are not put there against their will -- they have made a decision not to accept God. And God loves them enough to not force them into His presence since that is what they don't want.

    Unconditional love.
    TezriLi and Silk say Amen and like this.
  20. I'm right, you're wrong. You'll get over it! :D Bwahahahahahahaha!
    Abdicate and Silk say Amen and like this.

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