Would MUCH rather be in the heavenly blessings side then the earthly Kingdom side though!
Any here hold to Covenant Theology then?
- Thread starter YeshuaFan
- Start date
Only the bible. eh?
There are many ways to systematize the learning of the things of God. Some things are easier to understand using a dispensational view or a covenant view, or a simple historical view, etc.
Where these aid one in understanding God and His dealings with man, great. But just as a map is not the territory it depicts, there is always a gap between the system (the map) and the knowledge (the territory).
The problem becomes more accute when the description is mistook to be the definition.
A description simply tells one about the thing described while a definition also tells one what it is not.
Use whatever systematization aids in understanding, but do not presume that the system is the truth.
Where these aid one in understanding God and His dealings with man, great. But just as a map is not the territory it depicts, there is always a gap between the system (the map) and the knowledge (the territory).
The problem becomes more accute when the description is mistook to be the definition.
A description simply tells one about the thing described while a definition also tells one what it is not.
Use whatever systematization aids in understanding, but do not presume that the system is the truth.
That’s what it says on here( first paragraph) I was just checking you all agreed.
Covenant theology - Wikipedia
and that is how i believe we been grafted into the vine.
nothing wrong with the name/denomination provided its backed by the Bible.. we all have standard of belief we stand by and on. even if we subscribe like music man there still is a basic core of Belief.. so hold to osas some osnas some hold to baptism of the spirt evidence of speaking in tongues . i have a friend that is a woman Pentecostal preacher . i dont argue with her can she or can she not.
i told her her stuff belonged to her and mine belonged to me . even though there are areas we dont agree on. we learn to avoid them .
years ago in another church i was pastor at. she happened to be in on mothers day weekend.. i asked her to do the mothers day service. you know she never preached she sang songs and talked about mothers.. nothing doctrinal come up
Do you baptise infants like most CT do?
No, as reformed baptists do not hold to that aspect of it, as we do see a brand new Covenant, and only those saved into it are to be water baptized!
There are groups that still baptize babies? Why?
1 Corinthians 7:12-16
12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.
13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such [cases]: but God hath called us to peace.
16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save [thy] husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save [thy] wife?
Given that the best one can ever expect for an unbeliever is that they are sanctified through marriage to a believing spouse, salvation is only bestowed if and when the Lord gives to one that grace on the basis of faith rather than works, lest one may boast as is the case in some religions purporting to be Christian.
Oh, that's right! There are those out there who believe that baptism saves anyone. I forgot about that until now. After all, are not the very words of Jesus written:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and is baptized, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
What? You mean that's not what that verse actually says?
Ok, ok. I'll post what it REALLY says:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Whew. That's better.
Faith is the one element that keeps any and all formulas from ever working through which salvation could be bestowed upon anyone.
Amen
MM
Sorry, I thought you said you held to Covenant Theology. You are Reformed Baptist holding to TULIP but without the Covenant part?
Do you realize Calvin never wrote on Predestination until the Third volume of his Institutes? Shows what little priority he put on that topic.
I hold to reformed Baptist Covenant theology, which means believers baptism, and that national israel still has some place in future plans of God, as per Spurgeon!
Would be like Dr MacArthur, save post trib view!
Lutherans, Presbyterians, Anglicans , and maybe some Methodists still.
Why? Best ask them.
Maybe it is partly from tradition and an ancient Church growth technique under thw old Church/State empires.
We never see an example of it in Scripture.
Depends on if one sees the NC as being the continuation and fulfillment of the OC, or else as a brand new one!There are groups that still baptize babies? Why?
1 Corinthians 7:12-16
12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.
13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such [cases]: but God hath called us to peace.
16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save [thy] husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save [thy] wife?
Given that the best one can ever expect for an unbeliever is that they are sanctified through marriage to a believing spouse, salvation is only bestowed if and when the Lord gives to one that grace on the basis of faith rather than works, lest one may boast as is the case in some religions purporting to be Christian.
Oh, that's right! There are those out there who believe that baptism saves anyone. I forgot about that until now. After all, are not the very words of Jesus written:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and is baptized, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
What? You mean that's not what that verse actually says?
Ok, ok. I'll post what it REALLY says:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Whew. That's better.
Faith is the one element that keeps any and all formulas from ever working through which salvation could be bestowed upon anyone.
Amen
MM
Some of them see it as being the entry way into the Kingdom, others as being circumcision sign now in the NC!
The NC is the reality of the types and shadows of the OC. At least, that's what we're told in scripture to some extent:
Colossians 2:16-19
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ.
18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God.
So, if some are puffed up with things not seen in scripture, such as baptism of babies, thus inventing doctrine from sources not of the Bible, then it must be for the emotional benefit of the parents and family, as well as the religionists who perform such, for none of it has any meaning in relation to salvation.
So, yes. I agree with living and let live for those who wish to practice such.
MM
There are groups that still baptize babies? Why?
1 Corinthians 7:12-16
12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.
13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such [cases]: but God hath called us to peace.
16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save [thy] husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save [thy] wife?
Given that the best one can ever expect for an unbeliever is that they are sanctified through marriage to a believing spouse, salvation is only bestowed if and when the Lord gives to one that grace on the basis of faith rather than works, lest one may boast as is the case in some religions purporting to be Christian.
Oh, that's right! There are those out there who believe that baptism saves anyone. I forgot about that until now. After all, are not the very words of Jesus written:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and is baptized, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
What? You mean that's not what that verse actually says?
Ok, ok. I'll post what it REALLY says:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Whew. That's better.
Faith is the one element that keeps any and all formulas from ever working through which salvation could be bestowed upon anyone.
Amen
MM
Whew!......I am glad I read the whole post.
Salvation is FAITH in Christ plus nothing.
That's why their churches are filled with wet tares.
They would see water baptism as same as OT circumcision, as the sign of now being in the new One!
Yes, but sad to say all churches have that to some extent!