ABORTION by any name is MURDER!

[Major]

We like to call it ABORTION instead of MURDER because of aesthetics. MURDER sounds bad! That is because it is. Abortion "sounds" cleaner, easier to swallow.

So then we call it FREDOM OF CHOICE!

Now pay attention!! If the church of the living God stood up and based it political votes on what God says, there would not be such a problem with this issue.
But too many "Church Members" are NOT born again and they do and think and vote what they think instead of what God says!!!! Yes I said that!

Dr. Billy Graham once said that only 25% of church members were actually Christians and I think that he was way to high with his estimate.
Some will say..........YOU are being very judgmental! YEP, I am and I do that by 50 years of observation.

Now then........for those who choose to argue, lets do some Christian Doctrinal study.

Lets Find an honest answer to the question “is abortion murder?” and it takes courage for those who have performed abortions or have had one. The Bible is clear about the fact that murder is wrong in Exodus 20:13............
"Thou shalt not kill."

The literal Hebrew meaning of the word 'kill' in this context is 'to slay/MURDER' but this does not include capital punishment, for referring to capital punishment as murder would contradict other aspects of God's law for both pre-Cross and post-Cross believers.
Source: https://dailyverse.knowing-jesus.com/exodus-20-13

However, in some cases, the Bible does not forbid killing. Soldiers representing their country were expected to kill soldiers on the opposing side. That is not murder. Animals were killed for food and for sacrifice. That is not murder either.

Now folks.........it does not matter what the law of the land is. That can not be the excuse of a Christian, a Church member, YES, a Born Again Believer---NO!!!

Murder is defined as “the unlawful, premeditated killing of one human being by another.” Murder is unlawful killing—that is, killing that is done by the judgment of one human being against another, for personal (rather than national) reasons. The Bible condemns murder repeatedly as a characteristic of a wicked society (Deuteronomy 5:17; Isaiah 1:21; Hosea 4:2; Matthew 5:21).

Determining whether or not abortion is murder involves two considerations: ..........
#1. whether or not a fetus in utero is actually a human being,
#2. and, if a fetus is a child, whether or not abortion can be rightly called murder since it is legal in most countries.

So, is a fetus a human? Or is it something else? If it is not a human fetus, then what is it???? A turkey, A coconut, a bird, a fish, a tree?
The difference between a fetus and any one of us is one of age, location, and level of dependence. When a mother aborts the process of fetal development, she is destroying a unique life.

The Bible clearly points to conception as the beginning of human life. Samson said in Judges 16:17... “I have been a Nazirite to God from my mother’s womb” He refers to his unborn self as having already been what God planned him to be—a Nazirite.

David says in Psalms 139:16........ “You formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother’s womb”.

Again, we see David referring to himself as a person in the womb. Then, he says in Psalms ........, “Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them”.

David is saying that God had all of his days planned out for him while he was still in the womb. Again, this evidence points to personhood beginning at conception, rather than at the moment of birth. We see God had a similar plan for the life of the pre-born Jeremiah in Jeremiah 1:5........
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations”.

Now, for the uninformed and confused---------The Bible considers a fetus to be an unborn child, a planned human being that God is forming from the moment of conception. This being the case, it doesn’t really matter what human jurisprudence says or how socially or politically acceptable abortion is. God’s law takes precedence. A mother who decides to abort her child is unilaterally making a decision to end another person’s life—and that is and always has been the definition of murder.

Keep this in mind when you vote next month. Vote as if someones life depends upon YOU!

 

[Hopefull]

See a lot of political ads with women screaming, my body my choice. Remember when some work places were forcing covid shots on people or they couldnt work? Funny how they didnt have a choice. Another thing, the unborn isnt the womans body is it?

 

[Cosia]

We are entrusted to look after that baby from the second it conceived. God gave life to the new baby and it belongs to Him. No person owns a child, only God does. We are temporary parents. They àre lolling a child of God.
I have read of the dreadful pain the baby goes through. It breaks my heart to even see or hear the word. The women do not receive enough counselling and information. They have to carry the knowledge of what they have done for the rest of their life.
They need much prayer both the baby and mother before that precious baby loses it life.
If they do not want the baby there are plenty of people more than eager to adopt him or her.

 

[Musicmaster]

If that baby were a part of a woman's body, then killing it would kill EVERY mother rather than all those who have died as a result of botched procedures; but generally speaking, because that baby is an individual rather than a part of the mother's body, that alone is reason as to why killing the babies doesn't ALWAYS kill the mother.

That alone renders null and void the claim that it's her body. It clearly isn't.

MM

 

[crossnote]

Here in California, Gov Newsom is begging for God's judgment...

"California Gov. Gavin Newsom just paid for another billboard touting California’s abortion laws – the latest in Austin, Texas features a woman sitting with her arms crossed over her knees, looking at the words “Need an abortion? California is ready to help,” Fox7Austin reported Sunday. Newsom’s billboard also features California’s dedicated abortion website, abortion.ca.gov, as well as a Bible verse quoting Mark 12:31, “Love your neighbor as yourself. There is no greater commandment than these.”

California Pastor Chastises Gov. Newsom for Bible Verse on Abortion Billboards – California Globe

californiaglobe.com

Notably, abortion.ca.gov also guides out-of-state minors how to get an abortion in California without parents’ permission.

abortion.gov website instructing minor how to get an abortion in CA. (Photo: abortion.ca.gov)
It is indeed “twisted” and evil how Gov. Newsom’s campaign chose to include bible verses on the abortion billboards. Abortion.ca.gov also says California law allows minors to “independently consent to their own abortion care” despite any objections from their parents. The website links to TeenHealthRights.org, which tells minors, “Your doctor cannot tell your parents about your health care unless you give them permission to do so,” and you “do not need your parents’ or caregivers’ permission to get an abortion if you are under 18.”g

 

[Major]

See a lot of political ads with women screaming, my body my choice. Remember when some work places were forcing covid shots on people or they couldnt work? Funny how they didnt have a choice. Another thing, the unborn isnt the womans body is it?

NO.

John Jefferson Davis states:

"It is a well-established fact that a genetically distinct human being is brought into existence at conception. Once fertilization takes place, the zygote is its own entity, genetically distinct from both mother and father. The newly conceived individual possesses all the necessary information for a self-directed development and will proceed to grow in the usual human fashion, given time and nourishment. It is simply untrue that the unborn child is merely “part of the mother’s body.”

 

[Major]

We are entrusted to look after that baby from the second it conceived. God gave life to the new baby and it belongs to Him. No person owns a child, only God does. We are temporary parents. They àre lolling a child of God.
I have read of the dreadful pain the baby goes through. It breaks my heart to even see or hear the word. The women do not receive enough counselling and information. They have to carry the knowledge of what they have done for the rest of their life.
They need much prayer both the baby and mother before that precious baby loses it life.
If they do not want the baby there are plenty of people more than eager to adopt him or her.

It is just this simple..........If a woman chooses to have unprotected sex, then there is NO more choices to be made!

The argument of Rape and Incest is a totally irresponsible argument. The fact is that in nearly all abortions, rape and incest are not factors at all. Rather, healthy babies are killed simply because they’re inconvenient.
Now the rest of the story is that from the AMA, 0.5% of all recorded abortions are from rape or incest!

Most people, including sexual assault victims who have never been pregnant, and women who were not involved in incest are therefore forming opinions based on prejudices and fears which are disconnected from reality.

 

[rtm3039]

We like to call it ABORTION instead of MURDER because of aesthetics. MURDER sounds bad! That is because it is. Abortion "sounds" cleaner, easier to swallow.

So then we call it FREDOM OF CHOICE!

Now pay attention!! If the church of the living God stood up and based it political votes on what God says, there would not be such a problem with this issue.
But too many "Church Members" are NOT born again and they do and think and vote what they think instead of what God says!!!! Yes I said that!

Dr. Billy Graham once said that only 25% of church members were actually Christians and I think that he was way to high with his estimate.
Some will say..........YOU are being very judgmental! YEP, I am and I do that by 50 years of observation.

Now then........for those who choose to argue, lets do some Christian Doctrinal study.

Lets Find an honest answer to the question “is abortion murder?” and it takes courage for those who have performed abortions or have had one. The Bible is clear about the fact that murder is wrong in Exodus 20:13............
"Thou shalt not kill."

The literal Hebrew meaning of the word 'kill' in this context is 'to slay/MURDER' but this does not include capital punishment, for referring to capital punishment as murder would contradict other aspects of God's law for both pre-Cross and post-Cross believers.
Source: https://dailyverse.knowing-jesus.com/exodus-20-13

However, in some cases, the Bible does not forbid killing. Soldiers representing their country were expected to kill soldiers on the opposing side. That is not murder. Animals were killed for food and for sacrifice. That is not murder either.

Now folks.........it does not matter what the law of the land is. That can not be the excuse of a Christian, a Church member, YES, a Born Again Believer---NO!!!

Murder is defined as “the unlawful, premeditated killing of one human being by another.” Murder is unlawful killing—that is, killing that is done by the judgment of one human being against another, for personal (rather than national) reasons. The Bible condemns murder repeatedly as a characteristic of a wicked society (Deuteronomy 5:17; Isaiah 1:21; Hosea 4:2; Matthew 5:21).

Determining whether or not abortion is murder involves two considerations: ..........
#1. whether or not a fetus in utero is actually a human being,
#2. and, if a fetus is a child, whether or not abortion can be rightly called murder since it is legal in most countries.

So, is a fetus a human? Or is it something else? If it is not a human fetus, then what is it???? A turkey, A coconut, a bird, a fish, a tree?
The difference between a fetus and any one of us is one of age, location, and level of dependence. When a mother aborts the process of fetal development, she is destroying a unique life.

The Bible clearly points to conception as the beginning of human life. Samson said in Judges 16:17... “I have been a Nazirite to God from my mother’s womb” He refers to his unborn self as having already been what God planned him to be—a Nazirite.

David says in Psalms 139:16........ “You formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother’s womb”.

Again, we see David referring to himself as a person in the womb. Then, he says in Psalms ........, “Your eyes saw my unformed substance; in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them”.

David is saying that God had all of his days planned out for him while he was still in the womb. Again, this evidence points to personhood beginning at conception, rather than at the moment of birth. We see God had a similar plan for the life of the pre-born Jeremiah in Jeremiah 1:5........
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations”.

Now, for the uninformed and confused---------The Bible considers a fetus to be an unborn child, a planned human being that God is forming from the moment of conception. This being the case, it doesn’t really matter what human jurisprudence says or how socially or politically acceptable abortion is. God’s law takes precedence. A mother who decides to abort her child is unilaterally making a decision to end another person’s life—and that is and always has been the definition of murder.

Keep this in mind when you vote next month. Vote as if someones life depends upon YOU!

Not rendering an opinion here; however, your argument also makes capital punishment murder, right?

As you know, we just had a jury decision regarding the death penalty vs. live in prison. Again, not rendering an opinion, but I did find it interesting how many of the parents gave interviews and made the comment: "I pray that he suffers every day of his life."

Rtm

 

[crossnote]

Not rendering an opinion here; however, your argument also makes capital punishment murder, right?

I'll render an opinion (not necessarily Major's), capital punishment is sanctioned by God whereas private killing of individuals would be murder.

And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man. Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man. (Gen 9:5-6)

Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. (Rom 13:1-4)

 

[Musicmaster]

Not rendering an opinion here; however, your argument also makes capital punishment murder, right?

As you know, we just had a jury decision regarding the death penalty vs. live in prison. Again, not rendering an opinion, but I did find it interesting how many of the parents gave interviews and made the comment: "I pray that he suffers every day of his life."

Rtm

Hmm. Capital punishment is not murder, except to those who would call God a murderer since He is the originator of how to handle capital crimes such as murder.

I like how J. Vernon McGee put it...when an convicted murderer is executed, he is simply being sent to God for Him to judge since mankind isn't qualified to extend to the murderer his just sentence.

MM

 

[Major]

Not rendering an opinion here; however, your argument also makes capital punishment murder, right?

As you know, we just had a jury decision regarding the death penalty vs. live in prison. Again, not rendering an opinion, but I did find it interesting how many of the parents gave interviews and made the comment: "I pray that he suffers every day of his life."

Rtm

NO! Not in anyway Ray! I have no problem in giving my opinion as my opinion is exactly what God said.

Capital punishment was instituted and ordained by God for the protection of the innocent!

If we make Capital punishment murder, then we call God a sinner since murder is sin.

Remember, it was God who destroyed humanity by the flood. That was Capital punishment.
Remember Sodom and Gomorrah. That was capital punishment.

Was God acting improperly when He slew Er, Judah’s firstborn, because he was wicked (Genesis 38:7), killed his brother Onan, because he refused to submit to the Levirate marriage law and perpetuate his brother’s name in Israel (Genesis 38:8-10), or when “it came to pass at midnight that the Lord struck all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh who sat on his throne to the firstborn of the captive who was in the dungeon, and all the firstborn of livestock?” (Exodus 12:29).

Is not God sovereign over all that is? Is He not the source of life? Does He not retain the right to decide when life should end? Is it possible for God to act in a manner inconsistent with His own nature?

Genesis 9:6.........
“Whoever sheds man’s blood, by man his blood shall be shed; for in the image of God He made man.”

Exodus 21:12......
“He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death.”

So the answer is again, Capital punishment is ordained by God. God intends for the death penalty to occupy a permanent place in society for as long as the world stands. Opposing the death penalty is an act of defiance against God, the nature of God, and the will of God. Those who manifest aversion to capital punishment are refusing to think right about both God and sin.

 

[AtomicSnowflake]

The argument of Rape and Incest is a totally irresponsible argument.

Um, just let's not even go there, please.

(Personally speaking, I find this whole discussion disgusting.)

 

[Cosia]

Um, just let's not even go there, please.

(Personally speaking, I find this whole discussion disgusting.)

I find it heart breaking.

 

[AtomicSnowflake]

I find it heart breaking.

In more ways than one.

 

[Major]

Um, just let's not even go there, please.

(Personally speaking, I find this whole discussion disgusting.)

So do I.

However, what we think is not in the equation and the reality of the situation is that The National Right to Life Committee (NRLC), the nation's oldest pro-life organization, estimates that 63,459,781 abortions have taken place since 1973.

THAT is what is disgusting and if anyone things that this is not going to bring the judgment of God, think again!

Then consider this........in 1991, the 1st 1,269,195 humans aborted would have turned 18 years old. That means that they would have begun to work and PAY TAXES. Then for the next 50 years we come to 63,459,781 which is exactly why Social Security will run dry in 2035. That is the economic situation.

The Roosevelt administration never contemplated the USA of killing so many people voluntarily due to birth control.

 

[Major]

I find it heart breaking.

So do I!

However.........The church made NO effort in 1973 to oppose the ruling!

in 1973, The SBC was hardly uniform in its evangelical commitment, but even more conservative SBC leaders such as W.A. Criswell, pastor of First Baptist Dallas, were supportive of abortion rights.

It was not until 1976 when Dr. Jerry Fallwell openly condemned the ruling.

All that is needed for evil to grow is for good people to do nothing! And that is what the church did!

 

[Major]

Um, just let's not even go there, please.

(Personally speaking, I find this whole discussion disgusting.)

I am very sensitive to rape. My niece was a victim of rape and had a little boy. That little boy is now 39 years old and is on Broadway playing in Hamilton today!

Also.....I have a 1st cousin that was a victim of incest. I am very aware of these concerns but ignoring them does not make them nonexistent.

The only reason I mentioned those two examples as they are the Abortionists claim to fame argument. They use them to beat Pro Life people over the head as a guilt weapon when in fact the actual numbers are so minuscule that they should not even be considered.

 

[Dave F.]

I find it odd that the same politicians who say we need to follow the science regarding climate change, don't want to listen to the science that says life begins at conception. My body my choice only applies so long as the government says so. When the Israelites sacrificed their children to Moloch, God was angry with them.

 

[Musicmaster]

I find it odd that the same politicians who say we need to follow the science regarding climate change, don't want to listen to the science that says life begins at conception. My body my choice only applies so long as the government says so. When the Israelites sacrificed their children to Moloch, God was angry with them.

Good points.

Every expression of hypocrisy are clear indication of the involvement of not only fallen humanity in government, but also the enemies of our souls.

The sheer insanity of many phenomenon we see playing out, evil that is called good, and the good that is called evil in media and the classrooms across America and the world, it all points to the powers and principalities of the air at work to the extent that Lord allows them.

No amount of prayer that the Lord not allow the gates of Hell to withstand our assaults through our prayers against the strongholds of evil, none of that will ever make one dent in the end-times flow of the things we see all around us today. Pitting our faith and the word of God against the Lord Himself is wrong, just as false prophecy through presumption is wrong. I've long since learned to balance my prayers with, "Thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven."

What's more wearisome are those preachers out there, some of whom are very famous, proclaiming gloom and doom upon America, as if they are prophets of God speaking at the level of "Thus saith the Lord...."

There seems to be no fear of God in the preachings along that line, as if the Lord must be doing as they claim, regardless of the fact that the Lord is not bound by what He has done to other nations in the past when they fall into evil. America will continue to serve the purposes of the Lord regardless of how He handled other nations in the past, for the Lord is Sovereign.

He will allow evil to flourish so long as it serves His purposes, and no preacher or commentator in social media will ever take from the Sovereign Lord His sole authority over all the world and all the nations. In the midst of the evil flourishing, the Lord can and will protect His saints, all in accordance with His Perfect Will.

MM

 

[Major]

Good points.

Every expression of hypocrisy are clear indication of the involvement of not only fallen humanity in government, but also the enemies of our souls.

The sheer insanity of many phenomenon we see playing out, evil that is called good, and the good that is called evil in media and the classrooms across America and the world, it all points to the powers and principalities of the air at work to the extent that Lord allows them.

No amount of prayer that the Lord not allow the gates of Hell to withstand our assaults through our prayers against the strongholds of evil, none of that will ever make one dent in the end-times flow of the things we see all around us today. Pitting our faith and the word of God against the Lord Himself is wrong, just as false prophecy through presumption is wrong. I've long since learned to balance my prayers with, "Thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven."

What's more wearisome are those preachers out there, some of whom are very famous, proclaiming gloom and doom upon America, as if they are prophets of God speaking at the level of "Thus saith the Lord...."

There seems to be no fear of God in the preachings along that line, as if the Lord must be doing as they claim, regardless of the fact that the Lord is not bound by what He has done to other nations in the past when they fall into evil. America will continue to serve the purposes of the Lord regardless of how He handled other nations in the past, for the Lord is Sovereign.

He will allow evil to flourish so long as it serves His purposes, and no preacher or commentator in social media will ever take from the Sovereign Lord His sole authority over all the world and all the nations. In the midst of the evil flourishing, the Lord can and will protect His saints, all in accordance with His Perfect Will.

MM

God could remove all evil. However there would not be any freewill to make choices.
God to judge and remove those who choose to commit evil acts.
The problem with this possibility is that there would be no one left, for God would have to remove us all. We all sin and commit evil acts . While some people are more evil than others, where would God draw the line? Ultimately, all evil causes harm to others.