The Bible Speaks Of Only One Way To Eternal Salvation

Major said:
And if you read the rest of that story from verse 20 on, Jesus tells this say young man to sell everything he owns so that he can enter heaven.

So the lesson then by your understanding is that rich people cannot be saved.

Verse 23-26 then says that the disciples were shocked at that teaching...."Who then can be saved"?

This is what happens when the Bible is not correctly understood and we add into it what we want it to say.

Actually, the imperative "Keep the commandments" was intended to drive home to this young man the point of his pride, and self righteousness. Jesus did not believe that the mere keeping of the law brought anyone salvation.

He had already told Nicademous that in order to enter the kingdom of God.....He had to be born again. He did not tell Nicky that he then had to keep the commandments. So why did He say this to this man here????????
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In 1John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him

Again...clean cut words from the Bible!!
 
Major said:
"Are we to believe that as soon as we accept Jesus in our lives that our salvation is secure? "

Evidently YOU do not. I on the other DO! YES. The moment I believed upon and asked Jesus to be my Saviour I WAS SAVED!
Glory to God, because I am born again I am saved to the uttermost in Christ Jesus. I did not have to do anything to be saved and I do not have to do anything to stay saved. THAT MY FRIEND IS HOW GREAT GOD IS.
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According to the Bible, the first thing you have to do is repent, the lord don't hear sinners. John 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth. Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Again...(1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts.
 
Bro.tan said:
In 1John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him

Again...clean cut words from the Bible!!
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And just what is Christ's commandment (not plural) to us? I think it is: Believe in Him as Savior - and you are saved. Too simple for you?
 
Major said:
"Are we to believe that as soon as we accept Jesus in our lives that our salvation is secure? "

Evidently YOU do not. I on the other DO! YES. The moment I believed upon and asked Jesus to be my Saviour I WAS SAVED!
Glory to God, because I am born again I am saved to the uttermost in Christ Jesus. I did not have to do anything to be saved and I do not have to do anything to stay saved. THAT MY FRIEND IS HOW GREAT GOD IS.
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Don’t allow yourself to be deceived into believing that once you believe in the Lord that your work is finished, it has just started. (Heb. 10:35-39) (v.35) Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompense of reward. (v.36) For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise. People you must have patience when dealing with the word of God. And you must do the will of God, which is the keeping of his law, if you expect to receive the promise, which is eternal life in the kingdom of God, which will be established on this earth. NO ONE IS GOING TO HEAVEN. And it’s strange that most people who consider themselves “once saved always saved” are the same ones that tell you that God’s commandments were nailed to the cross. (v.37) FOR YET A LITTLE WHILE, AND HE THAT SHALL COME WILL COME, AND WILL NOT TARRY. (v.38) NOW THE JUST SHALL LIVE BY FAITH: BUT IF ANY MAN DRAW BACK, MY SOUL SHALL HAVE NO PLEASURE IN HIM. What does Paul mean by if any man draw back? You mean that once you are quote “saved” that you can draw back. According to the apostle Paul you can. Like I said earlier that just as you choose by your own free will to start serving the lord, you can by that same free will stop serving the lord or as Paul put it draw back. (v.39) But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul. That’s what you must do, you must have faith (believe) unto the saving of the soul. And your soul is not saved as soon as you start to believe on Jesus, salvation is works in progress, not a one step solution
 
Bro.tan said:
According to the Bible, the first thing you have to do is repent, the lord don't hear sinners. John 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth. Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Again...(1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts.
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OR because we are ALL sinners - law or no - He came for us all. God heareth everyone.
 
You want to make it hard to do the Lord's will? Have fun with that...ooops - you can't can you? For you it's work.
 
Bro.tan said:
In 1John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him

Again...clean cut words from the Bible!!
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Bro.tan, I don't think anyone here is suggesting that we now have a free ticket to sin as we please. As far as I can tell, all anyone here is saying is what you already referred to as "clean cut words from the Bible":

And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

This is the attitude Paul says we should have in Phil 3:
To not regard ourselves yet as "perfect," but to forget what is behind, and strive toward the goal, but be sure to hold to whatever standards we have already obtained.

12Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. 13Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, 14I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. 15Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. 16Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

If we haven't yet attained the goal, but we are striving for it, we are completely following what Christ commands us to do. Absolutely no one here is saying that we shouldn't be striving toward that goal, but that where we fail, we have an advocate.

So yes, absolutely, we are in a process of being made perfect, but our salvation doesn't depend on our ability to achieve perfection, but on Christ's ability to advocate on our behalf through His atonement.

Paul doesn't say we will be damned for failing to meet that goal of perfection. He just says that it is ours to strive, and ours to look to the Saviour (v20, 21).
 
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Bro.tan said:
Don’t allow yourself to be deceived into believing that once you believe in the Lord that your work is finished, it has just started. (Heb. 10:35-39) (v.35) Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompense of reward. (v.36) For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise. People you must have patience when dealing with the word of God. And you must do the will of God, which is the keeping of his law, if you expect to receive the promise, which is eternal life in the kingdom of God, which will be established on this earth. NO ONE IS GOING TO HEAVEN. And it’s strange that most people who consider themselves “once saved always saved” are the same ones that tell you that God’s commandments were nailed to the cross. (v.37) FOR YET A LITTLE WHILE, AND HE THAT SHALL COME WILL COME, AND WILL NOT TARRY. (v.38) NOW THE JUST SHALL LIVE BY FAITH: BUT IF ANY MAN DRAW BACK, MY SOUL SHALL HAVE NO PLEASURE IN HIM. What does Paul mean by if any man draw back? You mean that once you are quote “saved” that you can draw back. According to the apostle Paul you can. Like I said earlier that just as you choose by your own free will to start serving the lord, you can by that same free will stop serving the lord or as Paul put it draw back. (v.39) But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul. That’s what you must do, you must have faith (believe) unto the saving of the soul. And your soul is not saved as soon as you start to believe on Jesus, salvation is works in progress, not a one step solution
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God bless you "tan". I do pray for the Lord to encourage you and speak to your heart.

We disagree on this and that is not going to change for me.
 
Bro.tan said:
According to the Bible, the first thing you have to do is repent, the lord don't hear sinners. John 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth. Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Again...(1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts.
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God love ya my brother , but I have to question where you learned some of the things you say.

John 9;31 for example. The correct understanding it seems to me is not what you have stated. CONTEXT!

The Pharisees had been angered by the fact that their authority had been questioned by a "beggar". The Jews made the distinction between the followers of Christ who broke the Sabbeth and the followers of Moses who obey the law.

It is then the blind man who rubs salt in his wound. AMAZING is his response. HE argues that the religious leaders did not know where Christ came from when He had performed such a miracle. How could these leaders be knowledgeable and yet not know something so important as that.

Then in the rest of the verse you did not post (32-33) the blind man continues his argument as follows:
1. God only listens to those who do His will and not sinners.
2. This man performed a miracle that no one else had ever done.
3. Therefore, Christ IS NOT A SINNER for if He were, He could do nothing!!!!

Luke 5:32
" I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance"

Here we see of course Jesus not dealing with the question of whether there are in fact righteouse people who need no repentance at all. The CONTEXT is the fact that Jesus has sat down with publicans and sinners to eat a meal in verse #30.

By "righteous", Jesus is talking to the Pharisees who thought that they were righteous. They felt no need to repent because THEY were truly self-righteous.

1 John 3:4

The verse means literally........."Everyone who sins is indulging in unlawful behavior." Sin is an act of lawlessness.

I do agree with you that it is what GOD says and not what we think.
 
Bro.tan said:
In 1John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him

Again...clean cut words from the Bible!!
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Yes they are clear! It is what we say in our opinions that we have a problem.

It is always about CONTEXT to obtain the correct lesson that those Scriptures do in fact say.

IN 1 John 2:1, John is assuming some threat that would lure the believers away from Christ. False doctrine is one thing, false teaching would be another. obviously, when we read chapter #1, John is not saying that his writing will enable them to avoid committing their first sin.

" BUT....IF ANY MAN SIN".........that is if any believer who has already acknowledged that he was a sinner, and has already been cleansed of his sin by the Lord Jesus shed blood, IF ...IF this person should be led off into sin, would he be eternally lost????

He could sin and does sin, BUT would not be lost BECAUSE HE ALREADY HAS ACCEPTED AN ADVOCATE, The Lord Jesus Christ.

And HE is the propitiation for ALL of our sins, past, present and future!!!!

CONTEXT!
 
Major said:
God bless you "tan". I do pray for the Lord to encourage you and speak to your heart.

We disagree on this and that is not going to change for me.
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Of course it won't, and thank God. Bro tan is saying Jesus alone doesn't save us but that it's a "works" in progress!! That's what Mormons believe as well.

How can people be so deceived in this?
 
Roads said:
Bro.tan, I don't think anyone here is suggesting that we now have a free ticket to sin as we please. As far as I can tell, all anyone here is saying is what you already referred to as "clean cut words from the Bible":

And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

This is the attitude Paul says we should have in Phil 3:
To not regard ourselves yet as "perfect," but to forget what is behind, and strive toward the goal, but be sure to hold to whatever standards we have already obtained.

12Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. 13Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, 14I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. 15Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. 16Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.

If we haven't yet attained the goal, but we are striving for it, we are completely following what Christ commands us to do. Absolutely no one here is saying that we shouldn't be striving toward that goal, but that where we fail, we have an advocate.

So yes, absolutely, we are in a process of being made perfect, but our salvation doesn't depend on our ability to achieve perfection, but on Christ's ability to advocate on our behalf through His atonement.

Paul doesn't say we will be damned for failing to meet that goal of perfection. He just says that it is ours to strive, and ours to look to the Saviour (v20, 21).
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Again...Paul said in (1Cor. 9:24-27) (v.24) Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. (v.25) And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown: but we an incorruptible. Paul says that when you run in a race every body is running for a prize. But this prize that he is referring to is eternal life, that’s what he means by an incorruptible, he’s talking about an incorruptible body, a heavenly body. (v.26) I therefore so run, not as uncertainly, so fight, not as one that beateth the air: (v.27) But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. You see Paul knew exactly what was going on that why he says he has to bring his body under subjection. Under subjection to what? To God’s Law, Paul knew that if he didn’t continue to keep Gods law that even after he had preached to many that he himself could still become a castaway. This doesn’t sound like Paul thinks that he has guarantee salvation.
 
Paul said in (Gal. 6:3-5, 7) (v.3) For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself. (v.4) But let every man prove his own work, and then shall he have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another.
The book says let every man prove his own work, and if your work is good then you will rejoice in it. (v.5) For every man shall bear his own burden. That’s right; every man must bear his own burden. You mean you thought that all you had to do was confess the name of Jesus and that was it? Brothers and sisters you must work to get salvation. (v.7) Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. God is not to be played with. Whatsoever you plant, that’s what you are going to reap. Be it good works unto eternal life, or evil works unto eternal damnation. The choice is yours, and your works belong to you.
 
Bro.tan said:
Again...Paul said in (1Cor. 9:24-27) (v.24) Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. (v.25) And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown: but we an incorruptible. Paul says that when you run in a race every body is running for a prize. But this prize that he is referring to is eternal life, that’s what he means by an incorruptible, he’s talking about an incorruptible body, a heavenly body. (v.26) I therefore so run, not as uncertainly, so fight, not as one that beateth the air: (v.27) But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. You see Paul knew exactly what was going on that why he says he has to bring his body under subjection. Under subjection to what? To God’s Law, Paul knew that if he didn’t continue to keep Gods law that even after he had preached to many that he himself could still become a castaway. This doesn’t sound like Paul thinks that he has guarantee salvation.
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The problem with competing in a race is that only one wins the prize - by dint of his own steam. I have never heard this scripture so much as I have in this forum. First time the entire verse shows it's head. So go ahead and run to get a corruptible crown. Eternal life is not a "prize" and it is NOT of the flesh. Paul is keeping his flesh under subjugation of the "Spirit" not the Law.
 
Bro.tan said:
Paul said in (Gal. 6:3-5, 7) (v.3) For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself. (v.4) But let every man prove his own work, and then shall he have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another.
The book says let every man prove his own work, and if your work is good then you will rejoice in it. (v.5) For every man shall bear his own burden. That’s right; every man must bear his own burden. You mean you thought that all you had to do was confess the name of Jesus and that was it? Brothers and sisters you must work to get salvation. (v.7) Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. God is not to be played with. Whatsoever you plant, that’s what you are going to reap. Be it good works unto eternal life, or evil works unto eternal damnation. The choice is yours, and your works belong to you.
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Every man must bear his own burden does not equal therefore you are not saved by accepting Christ. It is saying that the work is internal for the individual to be happy - not to prove it to some negator who wants to prove that no one is "saved" but himself. Planting "abiding by the law" seeds saves no one.
 
Silk said:
The problem with competing in a race is that only one wins the prize - by dint of his own steam. I have never heard this scripture so much as I have in this forum. First time the entire verse shows it's head. So go ahead and run to get a corruptible crown. Eternal life is not a "prize" and it is NOT of the flesh. Paul is keeping his flesh under subjugation of the "Spirit" not the Law.
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We are NOT in a race for salvation! This is the type of doctrine that misleads people into comparing faiths, and judging who is the "better" and "best" Christian. It becomes a competition among ourselves and leads nowhere. God meant for ALL of us to get back to Him.
 
Bro.tan said:
Paul says that when you run in a race every body is running for a prize. But this prize that he is referring to is eternal life, that’s what he means by an incorruptible, he’s talking about an incorruptible body, a heavenly body.
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Is the 1 Cor 9 "runner" analogy communicating something different from the Phil 3 "runner" analogy? In Phil 3, Paul says that "as to the righteousness which is in the Law," he was "found blameless..." (v6)

7But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ.8More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ,9and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,10that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death;11in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead.

In this passage, Paul says that any "righteousness" he had through blamelessness over the Law, he counts as loss/rubbish compared with the righteousness "which comes from God on the basis of faith," and it is through this latter righteousness that Paul can hope to attain to eternity, not though the "righteousness" he attained through obedience to the Law, even though he was found blameless in that regard.

So when I read the 1 Cor 9 "runner" analogy, I don't read the goal/prize the same way that you have, but how Paul describes it Phil 3. The goal is righteousness/perfection, the prize is "the upward call of God is Christ Jesus," and the runner brings himself under the subjection of being a disciplined runner so he can effectively run toward the goal, he does not run as if he has already obtained the goal.

12Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus.13Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead,14I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.15Let us therefore, as many as are perfect, have this attitude; and if in anything you have a different attitude, God will reveal that also to you;
 
Again - race as competition among believers is not correct. Accepting Christ makes us "perfect" before God. I am not disagreeing with scripture - I am disagreeing with the doctrine that we have to "work" for our salvation, after accepting Christ. I am particularly disagreeing with the doctrine that if you do not follow all 614? tenets (minus the animal sacrifice laws) of the Mosaic Law = you are not saved. I am disagreeing with sculpting scripture to prove misleading doctrines.
 
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