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What happened when you believe?What happened when you believe?

Discussion in 'Bible Study' started by Jeremiah mosomi, Jul 27, 2011.

  1. What happened when you were saved? If something really changed; why do we find ourselves sinning after salvation?
  2. I think Romans 7 gives a good explanation to this question.

    Although we are still imperfect because we are trapped in physical bodies that are weak, we are no longer prisoners of the law and sin.

    But still there is a change in our behavior. We can more easily resist temptation. Yet when we sin, we are not held accountable as are the unsaved.
  3. Ginger is correct!

    Romans 7:15-20............................
    "For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. 16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. 17 But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. 19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. 20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. "

    Every child of God has this experience in his/her Christian life. We do something, and then hate ourselves because we have done it.

    Then we cry out to God........"O God, I have failed you again, please forgive me"!!!!

    WHY DO WE DO IT I think is your question.

    Paul learned what we all need to learn, and that is "In me (the Old Nature) dwells no good thing".

    The fact is this.............WE NEVER EVER GET RID OF THE OLD NATURE OF SIN!!!
    There is no GOOD in the old nature and there is no POWER in the new nature. The NEW NATURE wants to serve God but the Old Nature (Carnal) is at enmity against God, it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can it be. (Rom. 8:7).

    Romans 7:23....
    "But I see another law in my members warring against the law of my mind and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members".

    You see....you do not get rid of the old nature when you are saved my friend. Yet there is no power in the new nature. "I SEE A DIFFERENT LAW" is the enmity of the old nature against God. It causes all of us to cry out to God .........O WRECHED MAN THAT I AM, WHO SHALL DELIVER ME FROM THE BODY OF THIS DEATH " (verse 24)

    Verse 25
  4. I appreciate all who replied quoted Romans 7. you conluded that as long as the old nature exists sin is here to stay. now i am not solving anything in this reply but to supply verses which seem to teach the opposite.Romans 6:14-"for sin has no dominion over you...." Is that verse reffering to the person of romans7? 2corinthians 5:17-"..if anyone is in christ he is a new creature; the old things the old things passed away;" What really became new when we believed?1john 5:18-"no one who is born of God sins"
  5. When I confessed Romans 10:8-13 I was born again. I was a new creature in Christ. My sins were placed as far as the east is from the west. They are no longer held against me. I have been made the righteousness of God in Him. When He looks at me He sees not what I used to be, He sees Jesus. When I falter I have an intercessor with the Father. He is there to say "I died for him." God cannot look upon sin. He looks at His Son, the mediator between man and God. I go to 1 John 1:9. I agree with what is written there. I confess what I have done. HE is faithful and just to forgive me and cleanse me, restoring our fellowship. Therefore, Romans 6:14, 2 Corinthians 5:17, and 1 John 5:18 are true.
  6. It's not a contradiction in my opinion. We are living in two Worlds, one foot in the physical and one foot in the spiritual.

    We are still effected by the physical even tho we are now spiritual beings. We still stub our toes and catch colds. But we are no longer under the law of sin. We don't go out and intentionally sin, but if we do fall to temptation, there is no blame in us. We are innocent in God's eyes because we are already forgiven - we are not under the law. It is the law that condemns us.

    As for not sinning, we have not yet received the perfect bodies to compliment our perfect souls.

    There are things we cannot do....sins that we are prevented from because the spirit of God holds us back. But there are other times when our humanity wins out and God allows this because it can be used for the kingdom.

    One time a woman came to my door and asked me to pray for her. She didn't want to tell me what to pray for, and I said I didn't need to know. I sat and talked with her for awhile, I didn't know why at the time, but I shared an experience I had with her. She felt such relief in hearing my story that she opened up to me and told me her issue because she knew I would understand!!!!

    So you see, sometimes out failures and trials can be used to relate to others and witness Christ.

  7. Thanks for the reply.However,what makes me falter? It is sin. Which part of me then became a new creation? Are we suggesting that the dominion or mastery of sin remained after salvation?
  8. Thanks ginger.It is true that we live in two worlds.That is to say man has a spiritual part and a physical part.Which of the got saved? The spritual or the physical? When you suggest that God allows us to sin and uses our failings for His glory i doubt.
  9. If being saved means it is impossible to make a mistake, then no one is saved. The Scriptures say God uses all things to work together toward His good and perfect will.

    I wrote quite a lengthy dissertation and then reconsidered.....

    Some will tell you that if you get sick, then you must not be right with God, but the Scriptures tell us that as long as we are physical beings in a physical world, we are subject to the same hazards as the unsaved, however, their lives are left to chance whereas, God intervenes in the lives of Hid children and doesn't allow us to suffer without some good purpose for it.

    May I suggest you read Matthew 5? I believe that is where it says God allows the rain to fall on both the just and injust.

    There was a distinct change in me, but I still make mistakes.

    Can I ask, are you struggling with some behavior that you can't quite control? If this is more than a hypothetical discussion. My responses might be a little different..... perhaps we should be discussing practical application?
  10. Jeremiah .... I don't want to interrupt your conversation with Ginger. I'm also interested in your response to her last question. You most certainly can choose to respond to her privately, however.

    I just want to drop in to clarify the sinful nature and the spiritual nature.

    Read 1Thessalonians 5:23: Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your WHOLE SPIRIT, SOUL, and BODY be preserved blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Concerning the importance of knowing the difference between the spirit and the soul, Watchman Nee said this:

    Is it a matter of any consequence to divide the spirit and soul? It is an issue of supreme importance for it affects tremendously the spiritual life of a believer. How can a believer understand spiritual life if he does not know what is the extent of the realm of the spirit? Without such understanding how can he grow spiritually? To fail to distinguish between spirit and soul is fatal to spiritual maturity. Christians often account what is soulical as spiritual, and thus they remain in a soulish state and seek not what is really spiritual. How can we escape loss if we confuse what God has divided? (The Spiritual Man, vol. 1, p. 22).

    Three Classes of People
    In 1 Corinthians 2:14-15 and in 3:1, Paul distinguishes between three classes of people. First there is the "natural man" in verse 14. Here the word "natural" in the original Greek is "soulish." So in verse 14 we have the "soulish man." In verse 15 we have the "spiritual man," and in 3:1 we have "fleshy men" or "infants in Christ." The three verses according to the Greek read this way: "But a soulish man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. But the spiritual man discerns all things...and I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to fleshy men, as to infants in Christ." Here Paul clearly distinguishes between "the soulish man," "the spiritual man," and "fleshy men." A person who lives in the psychological part of his being (the Greek word psuche [soul] is the origin of the English word psyche) does not accept and does not understand the things of God. The reason is clear: the soul is not the part of man which receives and understands spiritual things. In 1 Corinthians 2:12-13 Paul says, "that we might know the things freely given to us by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, interpreting (or communicating) spiritual things to spiritual men" (Margin, NASV). It is quite clear from this passage that spiritual things can be communicated only to men who know the spirit, and that those who live in the soul can never accept or understand the things of the spirit. The fact is that in the realm of the spirit men can receive, communicate, be taught, accept, understand, and discern the things of the Spirit; while in the realm of the soul spiritual things can neither be received nor understood. There is also a third class of men referred to by Paul as having the Holy Spirit yet their spirit is overwhelmed by the flesh. They neither submit to the Spirit nor are they ruled by the Spirit. They may pretend to be very learned, yet in depth of understanding they perceive very little. The Corinthian believers were in this class. Paul calls them "infants in Christ," yet considering themselves, they thought that they were complete in the spiritual realm.
  12. I am sorry Dok and every one else i want every body to contribute.From now i will never include a name in my replies.Thanks for for your reply.
  13. It's okay to address a specific individual. I think Dok, was just being polite. I certainly wasn't trying to cut anyone out of the conversation, but I was just curious if you were asking this question because you were concerned about a specific person.

    We really need to include names or quotes in our posts, otherwise people become confused and think we are responding to someone or something we are not responding to.
    You are just fine, Jeremiah, :)

  14. Jeremiah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE continue to include names in your posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was only saying that I did not want to interrupt your discussion with Ginger! My long post was an effort to clarify the sinful and spiritual natures for everyone in these forums. Please accept my humble apologies for the misunderstanding. Continue to post and feel most welcome here!
  15. Don't confuse "justification" with "sanctification". "Justification" is a legal term that, in simple terms, means "DECLARED 'righteous'". We are "justified" by faith in Jesus Christ and "the just shall live by faith" are good scripture references. "Sanctification" is the PROCESS of being "MADE RIGHTEOUS". This is WHY we confess our sins one to another and also WHY we come boldly into the thrownroom of God to get these things resolved. Perhaps I've oversimplified things here, but then GOD uses the simple tings to confound the wise.....


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