Politics,religeon And The Beast

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by calvin, Mar 15, 2013.


Have beast like persecutions occured throughout the church age?

  1. yes but not on the scale the Bible foretells

    5 vote(s)
  2. Yes, each period of time has had challenges for Christian survival

    3 vote(s)
  3. No, there will only ever be one period where the beast persecutes People

    3 vote(s)
  1. There is plenty of discussion about who the beast is, when he is and where he is..or will be.
    There seems to be a definite time when the beast will appear. For example he doesn't seem to get a mention til Rev 13. and his mark is then mentioned in chapter 13,14,16.19 and 20. Never before chapter 13.
    The beast only has seven heads, yet throughout history there have been way more than seven candidates for beast-hood. Probably starting with Nero, ranging up to Hitler, Mussolini, Gadaffi and probably any and every other bad guy.
    These have been political /military figures, but there have been a number of religious people who have had the honor of being considered as beast candidates too. There have been too many suggestions that the Popes are the beast or the Antichrists but that is nonsense and I sincerely ask that people refrain from making such allegations. It may be that the beast will try to operate out of a Christian religion at some time in the future, maybe a protestant, southern baptist mega Church, whatever, but until and unless that happens it is not good to make baseless allegations.
  2. I think people show their ignorance when they accuse the pope. I don't see it being any of the evil guys from the past, purely because of 2 Thess 2:6-7. We need to be looking for the guy talking the biggest 'bs' and getting everyone's approval ;) . The leader of a liberal mega church or politician is my bet.
    calvin likes this.
  3. The beast is not an individual.

    The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits. They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for a little while. The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction. The ten horns you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but who for one hour will receive authority as kings along with the beast. They have one purpose and will give their power and authority to the beast. …The beast and the ten horns you saw will hate the prostitute. They will bring her to ruin and leave her naked; they will eat her flesh and burn her with fire (Revelation 17:3-16).

    A prostitute in Biblical symbolism is a false religion. For example the New Age philosophy being pushed by the UN, the like of Oprah (and other celebrities), and the modern western culture. The ten kings will be regional rulers of the UN (the UN has divided the world into 10 administrative areas) These are Daniel's "ten toes of iron mixed with miry clay". The "beast" is the New World Order system, which will be ruled by the Anti-Christ. The beast is "unlike the others and will trample the entire world". There is only one worldwide governing group, they are developing absolute authority, and that is the UN.
    Rusty likes this.
  4. Well...This is a huge topic, one I have been reading on for over a decade. There is no way I can capsulize my opinion in a few posts, but I will say the following to start off:

    Glomung: This is spot on, IMO:
    Certainly New Age (or even more likely I think an occult form of this that looks Christian ) and a miracle, power oriented religion is what is meant. I think for the whole world to be sucked into this, it cannot be as overt as the occult circles are now. It will have to appeal to billions, and what is popular in the West now is not what the world accepts as "religion".

    KingJ: I agree...mega church and politcal must be welded together. Popularity is vital for the Devils' plan to work, and both of these arenas are very much based on "a feel good what's in it for me in the here and now"...but it must appear Christian, IMO.

    Calvin: I think in a way you are right: all the megalomaniacs of the past however I think, are test runs by Satan: he is not all-wise or a demigod. He does not know how much man will swallow, nor God will tolerate...so he experiments.
  5. I wonder how long it will be before this thread is shut down??

    Rev. 13 is the "un-veiling " of Daniel 7.

    IMO there will be a "Beast System" which will be the Re-vived Roman Empire and it will be headed by the Beast who is the A/C.

    It will be a religious system because Rev. 13 tells us that the False Prophet will lead the world in worship of this beast.

    IMO, after the Rapture takes place, the world will be full of religiouse people looking for an answer for what just took place.
    With out the Holy Spirit here to guide and teach the world will be open for the Son of Perdition, "The law less man" who will come in peace with the answers that men what to hear.
  6. As A baby Christian; I have come to the opinion that the multifaceted nature of the Bible dictates that scripture not only outlines world events (past, present, future) but also generational events AND individual (personal) events to include the pattern of the 'beast' in all growth of the 'Body' through out time.

    Does that make sense? I wrote it and I don't even know if that makes sense?

    I guess I see the Bible as map for all generations AND individuals.... (with "end times" specific events-but to who or what's end??????)

    In my brain I can't fathom the extent of which the Word really is; how do you open a window into eternity and completely understand all you see in THIS (carnal) body?
  7. I can never get my head around the book of revelation - an anti christ is anyone who doesn't believe in Christ? The beast is a man who will have world power and go to war against christians?
    Politictians and religeon don't mix in this world. Our future Prime Minister at the time was asked a question during his election campaign because of his Jewish heritage' Do you believe in God? He stumbled. Neither a yes or no. I knew New Zealand was doomed right there and then, he won the election 56 seats to 24. Just goes to show how many NZers don't beleive in God. Once in PM John Key hit the poor hard,blaming the underclass for debts in NZ. Put his henchmen in as ministers and attacked the sick as in accident compensation Corp ltd (ACC) no payouts or will have to fight ther hardest for a meesly payout.

    Now NZ is worse of than it was before he became PM.:mad:. We did have one Christian Minster who was moving up the ladder in politics but then 4 or so yrs ago he got busted for child abuse so that was that this made all the anti Christians come out of the wood work saying why NZ should no longer be a Christian nation. Oh and the elected National Party are tryin to bring in Gay marriage remove the rights of the title husband and wife cause this is not nice to Gaydom, you can view tons of photos of our PM posing in shots with gay men.:rolleyes: Jesus will be weeping how NZ has ended up as this.

    John Key self made millionaire known as the smiling Assasin. And then America has Obama:D

    Sorry went of topic
  8. Kia ora surviver, bringing down a Christian is what makes the beast's day.
    We have Julia Giliar.........scary
  9. My vote's for Oyama on that note! He's gotten away with more double talk than any other president and yet he is still in office....

    And the people chose Barabbas!

    I know ---nobody knows WHO it will be (yet).

    Who gets a Nobel Peace Prize 2 months into the office of the Presidency for 'talking'?
  10. you welcome me in Maori:)

    Gidday mate
  11. I think it would be wise to be looking at an apostate Jew maybe from the area of Syria. Just an opinion!
  12. Before you try to understand the Revelation, start first with Daniel.
  13. Yeah, I am ASSUMING that the big AC will be from the ME after the USA is DOA. (No Rusty, I am not saying it is pivotal to end times-I just don't think the USA will be in existence during end times...at least not the USA of today. So really what I am saying is the end times ruler of whatever is left of the USA probably won't be the big AC.)
  14. Please guys...let's avoid politics...THAT and bad manners (they always come in pairs) could get this thread closed, as Major said.
  15. I meant above "partisan politics"...The thread is about political/religious persecution, so I didn't mean to mangled the OP. Sorry.
  16. Taking in the facts that all of you guys have posted, I come up with this:

    The beast is an amalgamation of church& state (pagan Rome's religion wasn't called a "church" but bear with me) that has persecuted Christianity in past history as it feels threatened by it's non-conformity to the hybrid's plans. Whether Roman, Byzantium, medieval, the Massachusetts Bay Colony or Nazi Germany....whenever a merging of absolute political and religious power has centre-stage, ALL Bible savvy Christians have suffered, banishment, prison and death.

    What is coming will make all of these religious deformations look like child's play.....but how?

    How will the endtimes "beast" be so powerful that "if possible even the elect" will be swallowed up?

    Sorry.....but I must put in a personal note: I have many many personal friendship dealings with ambassadors and diplomats from many countries. Powerful countries. The idea that any political nation, as they are today, or any combination such as the flaccid UN, can do what they Book of the Revelation says that the beast will do is just wishful thinking.
  17. Rusty, you just said.............
    "The idea that any political nation, as they are today, or any combination such as the flaccid UN, can do what they Book of the Revelation says that the beast will do is just wishful thinking."

    Forget politics my brother. Focus on what the Scriptures do say.

    You are saying in effect that there is nothing or not any combination of nations or events that will fulfill the Biblical prophesy of the Bible?

    Now........do I believe that the walls of Jericho fell down because the Jews walked around it 7 days?


    Do I believe that the Jordon River parted because the priests put their foot in the water?


    Do I believe the Red Sea parted because an old man put his stick in the water???


    What I am saying is that with God anything and everything is possible. Is it 100% clear what will happen and when. NO!!!

    But I do know that God has always done the impossible and all He has ever asked of us is to believe. So I do.
  18. I'm not following you...Major...I was asking others to stay off the partisan politics jag; simply seen if you go back and read.
    I am focusing on the Word and not American, Australian or Israeli politics. That is obvious. You are creating a straw man argument.

    The miracles of the Bible are not in question: I have never said I doubt any of them. That is pure conjecture on your part and I wish you would stop projecting this libel against me.

    I am saying that what I read in the Word no human government now in existence could pull off as depicted in the Revelation....There are supernatural elements involved that do not involve Congresses, Parliaments or tanks and guns.

    I hope that this is clear to you now.
  19. The UN is more than what most folks are aware of. The various power players use the UN to decide which nations die.
    Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, next Syria and Iran all have the UN to thank for rubber stamping their own annihilation.
    The UN controlled IMF controls who gets bailed out and who gets fleeced, this has been a weapon of mass despoiling used on many 3rd world nations. The UN through the WTO can determine who sells what and to whom, that is the power to destroy or support economies, and as Kissinger has noted, also the power to starve out those who they wish to persecute. With a couple of more treaties passed, the UN will control the worlds largest standing army, and will control all laws. The globalists have decided that the age of nation states is over.
    to quote James Paul Warburg:
    "We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it.
    The only question is whether World Government will be achieved
    by conquest or consent."
    February 17, 1950, appearance before the U.S. Senate Committee on Foreign Relations
  20. Never was unclear Rusty. I responded to your comment.

    You said clearly:

    "Sorry.....but I must put in a personal note: I have many many personal friendship dealings with ambassadors and diplomats from many countries. Powerful countries. The idea that any political nation, as they are today, or any combination such as the flaccid UN, can do what they Book of the Revelation says that the beast will do is just wishful thinking".

    You said that there are no combination of nations or people such as the UN that can do what they (I assume you meant the) Revelation says that the beast will do is just wishful thinking".

    Rev. 17:17
    "For God hath put in their hearts to fulfill his will and to agree and give their kingdom unto the beast until the words of God shall be fullfilled".

    You said that there is no way that anyone can do anything to anything to fulfill the will of God.

    But that is not what the Scriptures say and I would like to hear your explination of Rev. 17:17.

    Seems to me that it is an explination of the divine side of human events and how God uses people to accomplish His purpose. Just like He used Moses and Joshua and the priests who crossed the Jorden River.

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