List of Totally and Partially Omitted Passages in the Modern Translations

netchaplain

netchaplain

These need to be referenced with a modern translation by comparing them.


Totally Omitted Passages
Matthew 17:21
Matthew 18:11
Mat 23:14
Mark 7:16
Mark 9:44
Mark 9:46
Mark 11:26
Mark 15:28
Luke 23:17
Acts 24:7


List of omitted Bible phrases
3 Matthew 1:25
4 Matthew 5:22
5 Matthew 5:44
6 Matthew 6:4
7 Matthew 6:6
8 Matthew 6:13
9 Matthew 6:18
10 Matthew 9:13
11 Matthew 15:8
12 Matthew 15:6
13 Matthew 16:3
14 Matthew 16:20
15 Matthew 18:35
16 Matthew 19:9
17 Matthew 19:17
18 Matthew 20:7
19 Matthew 20:16
20 Matthew 20:22, 23
21 Matthew 21:12
22 Matthew 22:13
23 Matthew 23:4
24 Matthew 23:8
25 Matthew 23:19
26 Matthew 24:7
27 Matthew 25:13
28 Matthew 26:28
29 Matthew 26:60
30 Matthew 27:24
31 Matthew 27:35
32 Matthew 27:64
33 Matthew 28:2
34 Matthew 28:6
35 Matthew 28:9
36 Mark 1:2
37 Mark 1:14
38 Mark 1:31
39 Mark 3:15
40 Mark 4:24
41 Mark 5:36
42 Mark 6:33
43 Mark 6:11
44 Mark 6:51
45 Mark 7:8
46 Mark 8:26
47 Mark 9:23
48 Mark 9:29
49 Mark 9:45
50 Mark 9:49
51 Mark 10:21
52 Mark 10:24
53 Mark 11:10
54 Mark 12:23
55 Mark 12:29-30
56 Mark 12:33
57 Mark 13:8
58 Mark 13:33
59 Mark 13:14
60 Mark 14:22
61 Mark 14:27
62 Mark 14:68
63 Mark 14:70
64 Luke 1:28
65 Luke 2:33
66 Luke 2:40
67 Luke 2:43
68 Luke 4:8
69 Luke 4:4
70 Luke 4:18
71 Luke 4:41
72 Luke 5:38
73 Luke 6:10
74 Luke 7:31
75 Luke 8:43
76 Luke 8:48
77 Luke 8:54
78 Luke 9:10
79 Luke 9:54
80 Luke 9:55
81 Luke 9:56
82 Luke 9:57
83 Luke 10:19
84 Luke 11:2
85 Luke 11:11
86 Luke 11:29
87 Luke 11:44
88 Luke 11:54
89 Luke 12:31
90 Luke 12:39
91 Luke 17:3
92 Luke 17:9
93 Luke 18:24
94 Luke 19:45
95 Luke 20:13
96 Luke 20:30
97 Luke 20:33
98 Luke 21:4
99 Luke 22:31
100 Luke 22:64
101 Luke 22:68
102 Luke 23:23
103 Luke 23:38
104 Luke 23:42
105 Luke 24:1
106 Luke 24:42
107 Luke 24:49
108 Luke 24:53
109 John 1:14
110 John 1:18
111 John 1:27
112 John 3:13
113 John 3:15
114 John 3:16
115 John 4:42
116 John 5:16
117 John 6:11
118 John 6:47
119 John 8:9
120 John 8:59
121 John 9:35
122 John 11:41
123 John 12:1
124 John 16:16
125 John 17:12
126 John 19:16
127 John 20:29
128 Acts 2:30
129 Acts 2:31
130 Acts 3:11
131 Acts 3:26
132 Acts 7:30
133 Acts 7:37
134 Acts 9:5,6
135 Acts 10:6
136 Acts 9:29
137 Acts 10:21
138 Acts 10:30
139 Acts 15:18
140 Acts 15:24
141 Acts 15:37
142 Acts 16:31
143 Acts 17:5
144 Acts 18:17
145 Acts 18:21
146 Acts 20:15
147 Acts 20:24
148 Acts 20:25
149 Acts 20:32
150 Acts 21:8
151 Acts 21:22
152 Acts 21:25
153 Acts 22:9
154 Acts 23:9
155 Acts 24:6
156 Acts 24:8
157 Acts 24:15
158 Acts 24:26
159 Acts 25:16
160 Acts 26:30
161 Acts 28:16
162 Romans 1:16
163 Romans 8:1
164 Romans 9:28
165 Romans 10:15
166 Romans 11:6
167 Romans 13:9
168 Romans 14:6
169 Romans 14:21
170 Romans 15:29
171 1 Corinthians 2:4
172 1 Corinthians 4:6
173 1 Corinthians 6:20
174 1 Corinthians 7:29
175 1 Corinthians 10:28
176 1 Corinthians 11:24
177 1 Corinthians 11:29
178 1 Corinthians 15:47
179 1 Corinthians 16:22-23
180 2 Corinthians 4:4
181 2 Corinthians 4:10
182 Galatians 3:1
183 Galatians 4:7
184 Galatians 5:21
185 Galatians 6:15
186 Ephesians 3:9
187 Ephesians 3:14
188 Ephesians 5:30
189 Ephesians 6:10
190 Philippians 3:16
191 Colossians 1:2
192 Colossians 1:14
193 Colossians 2:2
194 Colossians 2:18
195 Colossians 3:6
196 1 Thessalonians 1:1
197 1 Thessalonians 5:27
198 2 Thessalonians 1:8
199 1 Timothy 3:16
200 1 Timothy 4:12
201 1 Timothy 5:16
202 1 Timothy 6:5
203 2 Timothy 1:11
204 2 Timothy 2:9
205 2 Timothy 4:22
206 Philemon 1:12
207 Titus 1:4
208 Hebrews 1:3
209 Hebrews 2:7
210 Hebrews 7:21
211 Hebrews 10:9
212 Hebrews 10:30
213 Hebrews 10:34
214 Hebrews 11:11
215 Hebrews 11:37
216 Hebrews 12:20
217 1 Peter 1:22
218 1 Peter 4:1
219 1 Peter 4:14
220 1 Peter 5:5
221 1 Peter 5:10-11
222 2 Peter 1:21
223 2 Peter 2:17
224 2 Peter 3:10
225 1 John 1:7
226 1 John 2:7
227 1 John 4:3
228 1 John 4:9
229 1 John 4:19
230 1 John 5:7,8
231 1 John 5:13
232 2 John 1:9
233 Jude 1:25
234 Revelation 1:8
235 Revelation 1:11
236 Revelation 1:20
237 Revelation 2:13
238 Revelation 2:15
239 Revelation 5:14
240 Revelation 6:1,3,5,7
241 Revelation 11:17
242 Revelation 12:12
243 Revelation 12:17
244 Revelation 14:5
245 Revelation 15:2
246 Revelation 16:17
247 Revelation 18:20
248 Revelation 20:9
249 Revelation 20:12
250 Revelation 21:24
251 Revelation 22:19
 
netchaplain said:
These need to be referenced with a modern translation by comparing them.


Totally Omitted Passages
Matthew 17:21
Matthew 18:11
Mat 23:14
Mark 7:16
Mark 9:44
Mark 9:46
Mark 11:26
Mark 15:28
Luke 23:17
Acts 24:7


List of omitted Bible phrases
3 Matthew 1:25
4 Matthew 5:22
5 Matthew 5:44
6 Matthew 6:4
7 Matthew 6:6
8 Matthew 6:13
9 Matthew 6:18
10 Matthew 9:13
11 Matthew 15:8
12 Matthew 15:6
13 Matthew 16:3
14 Matthew 16:20
15 Matthew 18:35
16 Matthew 19:9
17 Matthew 19:17
18 Matthew 20:7
19 Matthew 20:16
20 Matthew 20:22, 23
21 Matthew 21:12
22 Matthew 22:13
23 Matthew 23:4
24 Matthew 23:8
25 Matthew 23:19
26 Matthew 24:7
27 Matthew 25:13
28 Matthew 26:28
29 Matthew 26:60
30 Matthew 27:24
31 Matthew 27:35
32 Matthew 27:64
33 Matthew 28:2
34 Matthew 28:6
35 Matthew 28:9
36 Mark 1:2
37 Mark 1:14
38 Mark 1:31
39 Mark 3:15
40 Mark 4:24
41 Mark 5:36
42 Mark 6:33
43 Mark 6:11
44 Mark 6:51
45 Mark 7:8
46 Mark 8:26
47 Mark 9:23
48 Mark 9:29
49 Mark 9:45
50 Mark 9:49
51 Mark 10:21
52 Mark 10:24
53 Mark 11:10
54 Mark 12:23
55 Mark 12:29-30
56 Mark 12:33
57 Mark 13:8
58 Mark 13:33
59 Mark 13:14
60 Mark 14:22
61 Mark 14:27
62 Mark 14:68
63 Mark 14:70
64 Luke 1:28
65 Luke 2:33
66 Luke 2:40
67 Luke 2:43
68 Luke 4:8
69 Luke 4:4
70 Luke 4:18
71 Luke 4:41
72 Luke 5:38
73 Luke 6:10
74 Luke 7:31
75 Luke 8:43
76 Luke 8:48
77 Luke 8:54
78 Luke 9:10
79 Luke 9:54
80 Luke 9:55
81 Luke 9:56
82 Luke 9:57
83 Luke 10:19
84 Luke 11:2
85 Luke 11:11
86 Luke 11:29
87 Luke 11:44
88 Luke 11:54
89 Luke 12:31
90 Luke 12:39
91 Luke 17:3
92 Luke 17:9
93 Luke 18:24
94 Luke 19:45
95 Luke 20:13
96 Luke 20:30
97 Luke 20:33
98 Luke 21:4
99 Luke 22:31
100 Luke 22:64
101 Luke 22:68
102 Luke 23:23
103 Luke 23:38
104 Luke 23:42
105 Luke 24:1
106 Luke 24:42
107 Luke 24:49
108 Luke 24:53
109 John 1:14
110 John 1:18
111 John 1:27
112 John 3:13
113 John 3:15
114 John 3:16
115 John 4:42
116 John 5:16
117 John 6:11
118 John 6:47
119 John 8:9
120 John 8:59
121 John 9:35
122 John 11:41
123 John 12:1
124 John 16:16
125 John 17:12
126 John 19:16
127 John 20:29
128 Acts 2:30
129 Acts 2:31
130 Acts 3:11
131 Acts 3:26
132 Acts 7:30
133 Acts 7:37
134 Acts 9:5,6
135 Acts 10:6
136 Acts 9:29
137 Acts 10:21
138 Acts 10:30
139 Acts 15:18
140 Acts 15:24
141 Acts 15:37
142 Acts 16:31
143 Acts 17:5
144 Acts 18:17
145 Acts 18:21
146 Acts 20:15
147 Acts 20:24
148 Acts 20:25
149 Acts 20:32
150 Acts 21:8
151 Acts 21:22
152 Acts 21:25
153 Acts 22:9
154 Acts 23:9
155 Acts 24:6
156 Acts 24:8
157 Acts 24:15
158 Acts 24:26
159 Acts 25:16
160 Acts 26:30
161 Acts 28:16
162 Romans 1:16
163 Romans 8:1
164 Romans 9:28
165 Romans 10:15
166 Romans 11:6
167 Romans 13:9
168 Romans 14:6
169 Romans 14:21
170 Romans 15:29
171 1 Corinthians 2:4
172 1 Corinthians 4:6
173 1 Corinthians 6:20
174 1 Corinthians 7:29
175 1 Corinthians 10:28
176 1 Corinthians 11:24
177 1 Corinthians 11:29
178 1 Corinthians 15:47
179 1 Corinthians 16:22-23
180 2 Corinthians 4:4
181 2 Corinthians 4:10
182 Galatians 3:1
183 Galatians 4:7
184 Galatians 5:21
185 Galatians 6:15
186 Ephesians 3:9
187 Ephesians 3:14
188 Ephesians 5:30
189 Ephesians 6:10
190 Philippians 3:16
191 Colossians 1:2
192 Colossians 1:14
193 Colossians 2:2
194 Colossians 2:18
195 Colossians 3:6
196 1 Thessalonians 1:1
197 1 Thessalonians 5:27
198 2 Thessalonians 1:8
199 1 Timothy 3:16
200 1 Timothy 4:12
201 1 Timothy 5:16
202 1 Timothy 6:5
203 2 Timothy 1:11
204 2 Timothy 2:9
205 2 Timothy 4:22
206 Philemon 1:12
207 Titus 1:4
208 Hebrews 1:3
209 Hebrews 2:7
210 Hebrews 7:21
211 Hebrews 10:9
212 Hebrews 10:30
213 Hebrews 10:34
214 Hebrews 11:11
215 Hebrews 11:37
216 Hebrews 12:20
217 1 Peter 1:22
218 1 Peter 4:1
219 1 Peter 4:14
220 1 Peter 5:5
221 1 Peter 5:10-11
222 2 Peter 1:21
223 2 Peter 2:17
224 2 Peter 3:10
225 1 John 1:7
226 1 John 2:7
227 1 John 4:3
228 1 John 4:9
229 1 John 4:19
230 1 John 5:7,8
231 1 John 5:13
232 2 John 1:9
233 Jude 1:25
234 Revelation 1:8
235 Revelation 1:11
236 Revelation 1:20
237 Revelation 2:13
238 Revelation 2:15
239 Revelation 5:14
240 Revelation 6:1,3,5,7
241 Revelation 11:17
242 Revelation 12:12
243 Revelation 12:17
244 Revelation 14:5
245 Revelation 15:2
246 Revelation 16:17
247 Revelation 18:20
248 Revelation 20:9
249 Revelation 20:12
250 Revelation 21:24
251 Revelation 22:19
Click to expand...
You sure put a lot of work into that posting!
 
netchaplain said:
These need to be referenced with a modern translation by comparing them.


Totally Omitted Passages
Matthew 17:21
Matthew 18:11
Mat 23:14
Mark 7:16
Mark 9:44
Mark 9:46
Mark 11:26
Mark 15:28
Luke 23:17
Acts 24:7


List of omitted Bible phrases
3 Matthew 1:25
4 Matthew 5:22
5 Matthew 5:44
6 Matthew 6:4
7 Matthew 6:6
8 Matthew 6:13
9 Matthew 6:18
10 Matthew 9:13
11 Matthew 15:8
12 Matthew 15:6
13 Matthew 16:3
14 Matthew 16:20
15 Matthew 18:35
16 Matthew 19:9
17 Matthew 19:17
18 Matthew 20:7
19 Matthew 20:16
20 Matthew 20:22, 23
21 Matthew 21:12
22 Matthew 22:13
23 Matthew 23:4
24 Matthew 23:8
25 Matthew 23:19
26 Matthew 24:7
27 Matthew 25:13
28 Matthew 26:28
29 Matthew 26:60
30 Matthew 27:24
31 Matthew 27:35
32 Matthew 27:64
33 Matthew 28:2
34 Matthew 28:6
35 Matthew 28:9
36 Mark 1:2
37 Mark 1:14
38 Mark 1:31
39 Mark 3:15
40 Mark 4:24
41 Mark 5:36
42 Mark 6:33
43 Mark 6:11
44 Mark 6:51
45 Mark 7:8
46 Mark 8:26
47 Mark 9:23
48 Mark 9:29
49 Mark 9:45
50 Mark 9:49
51 Mark 10:21
52 Mark 10:24
53 Mark 11:10
54 Mark 12:23
55 Mark 12:29-30
56 Mark 12:33
57 Mark 13:8
58 Mark 13:33
59 Mark 13:14
60 Mark 14:22
61 Mark 14:27
62 Mark 14:68
63 Mark 14:70
64 Luke 1:28
65 Luke 2:33
66 Luke 2:40
67 Luke 2:43
68 Luke 4:8
69 Luke 4:4
70 Luke 4:18
71 Luke 4:41
72 Luke 5:38
73 Luke 6:10
74 Luke 7:31
75 Luke 8:43
76 Luke 8:48
77 Luke 8:54
78 Luke 9:10
79 Luke 9:54
80 Luke 9:55
81 Luke 9:56
82 Luke 9:57
83 Luke 10:19
84 Luke 11:2
85 Luke 11:11
86 Luke 11:29
87 Luke 11:44
88 Luke 11:54
89 Luke 12:31
90 Luke 12:39
91 Luke 17:3
92 Luke 17:9
93 Luke 18:24
94 Luke 19:45
95 Luke 20:13
96 Luke 20:30
97 Luke 20:33
98 Luke 21:4
99 Luke 22:31
100 Luke 22:64
101 Luke 22:68
102 Luke 23:23
103 Luke 23:38
104 Luke 23:42
105 Luke 24:1
106 Luke 24:42
107 Luke 24:49
108 Luke 24:53
109 John 1:14
110 John 1:18
111 John 1:27
112 John 3:13
113 John 3:15
114 John 3:16
115 John 4:42
116 John 5:16
117 John 6:11
118 John 6:47
119 John 8:9
120 John 8:59
121 John 9:35
122 John 11:41
123 John 12:1
124 John 16:16
125 John 17:12
126 John 19:16
127 John 20:29
128 Acts 2:30
129 Acts 2:31
130 Acts 3:11
131 Acts 3:26
132 Acts 7:30
133 Acts 7:37
134 Acts 9:5,6
135 Acts 10:6
136 Acts 9:29
137 Acts 10:21
138 Acts 10:30
139 Acts 15:18
140 Acts 15:24
141 Acts 15:37
142 Acts 16:31
143 Acts 17:5
144 Acts 18:17
145 Acts 18:21
146 Acts 20:15
147 Acts 20:24
148 Acts 20:25
149 Acts 20:32
150 Acts 21:8
151 Acts 21:22
152 Acts 21:25
153 Acts 22:9
154 Acts 23:9
155Neth that Acts 24:6
156 Acts 24:8
157 Acts 24:15
158 Acts 24:26
159 Acts 25:16
160 Acts 26:30
161 Acts 28:16
162 Romans 1:16
163 Romans 8:1
164 Romans 9:28
165 Romans 10:15
166 Romans 11:6
167 Romans 13:9
168 Romans 14:6
169 Romans 14:21
170 Romans 15:29
171 1 Corinthians 2:4
172 1 Corinthians 4:6
173 1 Corinthians 6:20
174 1 Corinthians 7:29
175 1 Corinthians 10:28
176 1 Corinthians 11:24
177 1 Corinthians 11:29
178 1 Corinthians 15:47
179 1 Corinthians 16:22-23
180 2 Corinthians 4:4
181 2 Corinthians 4:10
182 Galatians 3:1
183 Galatians 4:7
184 Galatians 5:21
185 Galatians 6:15
186 Ephesians 3:9
187 Ephesians 3:14
188 Ephesians 5:30
189 Ephesians 6:10
190 Philippians 3:16
191 Colossians 1:2
192 Colossians 1:14
193 Colossians 2:2
194 Colossians 2:18
195 Colossians 3:6
196 1 Thessalonians 1:1
197 1 Thessalonians 5:27
198 2 Thessalonians 1:8
199 1 Timothy 3:16
200 1 Timothy 4:12
201 1 Timothy 5:16
202 1 Timothy 6:5
203 2 Timothy 1:11
204 2 Timothy 2:9
205 2 Timothy 4:22
206 Philemon 1:12
207 Titus 1:4
208 Hebrews 1:3
209 Hebrews 2:7
210 Hebrews 7:21
211 Hebrews 10:9
212 Hebrews 10:30
213 Hebrews 10:34
214 Hebrews 11:11
215 Hebrews 11:37
216 Hebrews 12:20
217 1 Peter 1:22
218 1 Peter 4:1
219 1 Peter 4:14
220 1 Peter 5:5
221 1 Peter 5:10-11
222 2 Peter 1:21
223 2 Peter 2:17
224 2 Peter 3:10
225 1 John 1:7
226 1 John 2:7
227 1 John 4:3
228 1 John 4:9
229 1 John 4:19
230 1 John 5:7,8
231 1 John 5:13
232 2 John 1:9
233 Jude 1:25
234 Revelation 1:8
235 Revelation 1:11
236 Revelation 1:20
237 Revelation 2:13
238 Revelation 2:15
239 Revelation 5:14
240 Revelation 6:1,3,5,7
241 Revelation 11:17
242 Revelation 12:12
243 Revelation 12:17
244 Revelation 14:5
245 Revelation 15:2
246 Revelation 16:17
247 Revelation 18:20
248 Revelation 20:9
249 Revelation 20:12
250 Revelation 21:24
251 Revelation 22:19
Click to expand...
Netch that be rather generous. Considering many in the modern scholarship world don’t even believe the New Testament was written in the Apostolic era. They tend to see books such as the book of Acts of which many believe to be a myth of Christian origins. And that the Acts of the apostles should not be employed as a basis for historical study. So say the guys from the Westar institute or commonly known as the Jesus seminar. Perhaps it is just the signs of the times as more of the Bible is questioned as trustworthy and the final authority in all things . More so as the mystery of iniquity attempts to lay claim over all the kingdoms of this world
 
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crossnote said:
One's manuscripts omissions may be another manuscripts additions and vice-versa.
Click to expand...
All translations come from one of two manuscript sources. The Majority Text which consists of nearly all manuscript copies; the Minority Text which comes from three manuscripts. One of these sources is errant, because they do not have enough agreement in content with one another. One is short of Scripture, the other contains the entire Word. The Majority Text has been the one used for 500 years. The Minority only about 1 century, because they only recently discovered the manuscripts for them.

They are a couple centuries older than the majority of manuscripts, and it's due to the fact that the early scribes would not use these 3 because of errors and omissions that they contain in comparison to the Majority Text. Thus they did not wear out like those used for the Majority Text. When a manuscript copy began to show sings of deterioration the scribe would copy it, then destroy the exemplar to avoid it being misused. As we know, there are no known extant autographs of the writer of the Word, they are copies of copies, to perpetuate the Word.

Many Gnostic scholars had their hands in these corrupted ancient copies; which answers to the reason why passages that relate to the Deity of Christ were omitted. None of the translations from the Minority Text contain the entire Word, only those like the NKJV contain the entire Word.
 
Prim90 said:
Netch that be rather generous. Considering many in the modern scholarship world don’t even believe the New Testament was written in the Apostolic era. They tend to see books such as the book of Acts of which many believe to be a myth of Christian origins. And that the Acts of the apostles should not be employed as a basis for historical study. So say the guys from the Westar institute or commonly known as the Jesus seminar. Perhaps it is just the signs of the times as more of the Bible is questioned as trustworthy and the final authority in all things . More so as the mystery of iniquity attempts to lay claim over all the kingdoms of this world
Click to expand...
Very inciteful and true! The most significant source that the opposition (Satan and those who are being used of him) can attack is the Word, because it's the only source man has to know God and His will.

Appreciate your reply and God bless!
 
netchaplain said:
All translations come from one of two manuscript sources. The Majority Text which consists of nearly all manuscript copies; the Minority Text which comes from three manuscripts. One of these sources is errant, because they do not have enough agreement in content with one another. One is short of Scripture, the other contains the entire Word. The Majority Text has been the one used for 500 years. The Minority only about 1 century, because they only recently discovered the manuscripts for them.
Click to expand...
My point was just because one set of manuscripts are accused of leaving out 'stuff'; how do we know that the other side didn't add 'stuff'? As @Origin kept pressing for tangible proof, not just 'say-so'
 
Prim90 said:
Netch that be rather generous. Considering many in the modern scholarship world don’t even believe the New Testament was written in the Apostolic era. They tend to see books such as the book of Acts of which many believe to be a myth of Christian origins. And that the Acts of the apostles should not be employed as a basis for historical study. So say the guys from the Westar institute or commonly known as the Jesus seminar. Perhaps it is just the signs of the times as more of the Bible is questioned as trustworthy and the final authority in all things . More so as the mystery of iniquity attempts to lay claim over all the kingdoms of this world
Click to expand...
Should we pay any heed to the Jesus Seminar? The ones who used color coded tags to vote as to what was actually God's Word and what wasn't.
 
crossnote said:
My point was just because one set of manuscripts are accused of leaving out 'stuff'; how do we know that the other side didn't add 'stuff'? As @Origin kept pressing for tangible proof, not just 'say-so'
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And of course they do. The MT, CT, and TR are all different from one another. Net likes to give the impression that the MT and TR are more or less the same but that is quite false. Moreover there are numerous differences between manuscripts which are Byzantine.

Again, here is a partial list of where the MT and TR differ from each other.
carm.org

Differences Between the Majority Text and the Textus Receptus

King James Onlyists often defend their position by claiming that the KJV is based on the vast majority of manuscripts, but this is not really the case.
carm.org carm.org

I also provided three example (and there are many, many more) where the MT omits words, phrase, and verses.

Bible Problem

Bibles Before the KJV1611... *Coverdale-1535 History Bible 1425-1450 Koberger 1483 Paupers Bible 1414 Taverner Bible 1539 *Bishop's Bible 1568 Cervera 1300 Furtmeyr 1465 *Geneva (Breeches) Bible 1594 *The Great Bible 1540 *Matthews Bible 1537 Seville 900-950 (asterisk* English Translations)
christianforumsite.com

Bible Problem

Bibles Before the KJV1611... *Coverdale-1535 History Bible 1425-1450 Koberger 1483 Paupers Bible 1414 Taverner Bible 1539 *Bishop's Bible 1568 Cervera 1300 Furtmeyr 1465 *Geneva (Breeches) Bible 1594 *The Great Bible 1540 *Matthews Bible 1537 Seville 900-950 (asterisk* English Translations)
christianforumsite.com

Bible Problem

I am aware of that charge, but still hav seen it proven. I think a more fruitful approach is to show how the majority text was quoted by the early Church Fathers and to use the Providence/preservation angle. If by early church fathers you mean the RCC, they were totally against the MT, and is...
christianforumsite.com
 
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While I do think these things are important, I do think that much of this is intentionally aggravated by the enemy to place doubt in the minds of men.

The malice is not in the archeologists that locate original manuscripts, nor in the translators who work so diligently selecting and translating, but is in the heart of the devil who orchestrates these things.

The Holy Spirit that provides application in our minds and soul is stronger than the enemy.
 
Siloam said:
While I do think these things are important, I do think that much of this is intentionally aggravated by the enemy to place doubt in the minds of men.

The malice is not in the archeologists that locate original manuscripts, nor in the translators who work so diligently selecting and translating, but is in the heart of the devil who orchestrates these things.

The Holy Spirit that provides application in our minds and soul is stronger than the enemy.
Click to expand...
Hi, and like what you commented! Just to be accurate though concerning "original manuscripts," there are no known extant autographs of the Biblical writers, thus all are copies of copies. Also, there were some Gnostic scholars that hand a hand in the 3 manuscripts they use, compared to thousands for the Traditional Text. This answers to the occasional omitted phrases which attempt to detract from Christ's deity.

Example: "no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven (Jhn 3:13).

This passage manifests the omnipresence of Christ being in heaven while on earth. All the modern translations omit the phrase "which is in heaven."

God bless!
 
netchaplain said:
Also, there were some Gnostic scholars that hand a hand in the 3 manuscripts they use,
Click to expand...
Please names those Gnostic and cite primary sources proving your claim.

The fact is we have no idea who the scribes were that copied the vast majority of manuscripts.

netchaplain said:
compared to thousands for the Traditional Text.
Click to expand...
Which also difference from one another but that never seems to be a problem for you. You simply ignore that fact.

netchaplain said:
Example: "no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven (Jhn 3:13).

This passage manifests the omnipresence of Christ being in heaven while on earth. All the modern translations omit the phrase "which is in heaven."
Click to expand...
That is simply your interpretation of the reason why it is not in the body of the text. Your claim is an example of the informal fallacy poisoning the well. The real reason is because the CT prefers to follow the oldest manuscripts. It is that simple.

But while we are at it let's address Acts 8:37 which you conveniently left off your list and so does the Majority Text.

Verse 37, Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may.” He answered, “I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”, is missing from the Majority Text.

Following your same line of thought, this could only have been left out by someone who did not believe Jesus is the savior and the son of God.
 
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netchaplain said:
They are a couple centuries older than the majority of manuscripts, and it's due to the fact that the early scribes would not use these 3 because of errors and omissions that they contain in comparison to the Majority Text. Thus they did not wear out like those used for the Majority Text.
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I am curious, what is your source for this theory? Are there any 2nd or 3rd century citations on this speculation?

The whole idea is counter intuitive to me. In my personal life, I find the more precious the text, the more respect and care it is given, and consequently, the less likely it will become worn and worthless to the point it must be destroyed.

netchaplain said:
When a manuscript copy began to show sings of deterioration the scribe would copy it, then destroy the exemplar to avoid it being misused.
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This also I find curious. I would imagine the the very early scribes would treat early manuscripts with the same reverence that their Jewish counterparts did.

In the Jewish tradition early manuscripts were not destroyed but “decommissioned”. A Torah scroll “which become worn” was considered to have deteriorated beyond the point of repair. It was placed in an earthen vessel and buried in a cemetery, preferably next to the grave of a Torah scholar.
There are many verified sources for this reverence of sacred scripture.

“We find in the literature two primary explanations for this requirement. The one has to do with the proper honor that we must show to a Torah scroll: we store it in an earthen vessel (cf. Jeremiah 32:14) and bury it because we seek to preserve its writing for as long as possible. The other stems from the prohibition against destroying sacred texts, particularly those containing the name of God. We learn this prohibition from a midrash on Deuteronomy 12:4: that is, while we are bidden to destroy the places and implements of idolatry in the land of Canaan/Israel, “you shall not do that to Adonai, your God.”7 Thus, when we find the need to dispose of worn-out texts, we must not burn them, for this is how we should destroy objects of idolatry, but bury them.”

This idea may seem quaint in today’s throwaway culture, but at that time books were very precious, owned and kept by elite individuals or influential churches and monasteries and the Word, the Bible, was sacred and the most precious of all books.

God bless you and your enthusiasm for the Word.
 
blueskies said:
This also I find curious. I would imagine the the very early scribes would treat early manuscripts with the same reverence that their Jewish counterparts did.

In the Jewish tradition early manuscripts where not destroyed but “decommissioned”. A Torah scroll “which become worn” was considered to have deteriorated beyond the point of repair. It was placed in an earthen vessel and buried in a cemetery, preferably next to the grave of a Torah scholar.
There are many verified sources for this reverence of sacred scripture.
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Now that is a very interesting and important point given the fact that the earliest believers were all Jewish. A genizah is a storage area in a cemetery or synagogue used to house old manuscripts.

By the way we have no early record of Net's claim concerning manuscripts. If Net does, then he should cite the primary sources confirming his claim.
 
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Origen said:
Please names those Gnostic and cite primary sources proving your claim.
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"The Gnostic Gospels completely detached Jesus from Israel and the history of Israel with God. The God of the Old Testament, as described by the Gnostic Gospels, categorize Him as evil and Judaism as totally lost. -Wikipedia

It's difficult to find much evidence other than from trusted Bible scholars like the ones I use for 20 years now; of which I already mentioned in my posts from David Otis Fuller, D.D. . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Otis_Fuller#:~:text=Fuller dedicated much of his,Center in Grand Rapids, Michigan.

Example: "Within the first hundred years after the death of the Apostles, Irenaeus said concerning Marcion the Gnostic, 'Wherefore also Marcion and his followers have betaken themselves to mutilating the Scriptures, not acknowledging some books at all, and curtailing the Gospel according to Luke and the Epistles of Paul, they assert that these alone are authentic which they themselves have shortened."

Here is a sample of one popular ancient scholar who wrote evil manuscripts in the 2nd century":


Origen said:
Verse 37, Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may.” He answered, “I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”, is missing from the Majority Text.
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The detractors of the modern translations omitted this passage. If there were not Greek manuscript evidence for this verse they would have not included it. If you are using the three sources of the Minority Text you will not find this anywhere in those false manuscripts!

Origen said:
Following your same line of thought, this could only have been left out by someone who did not believe Jesus is the savior and the son of God.
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I doesn't matte if someone left it out--it's evil to claim that Christ was not the Savior. Gnostics taught that Jesus was not the Savior!
 
blueskies said:
I am curious, what is your source for this theory? Are there any 2nd or 3rd century citations on this speculation?
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Look at my post to Origen in post # 16.
blueskies said:
The whole idea is counter intuitive to me. In my personal life, I find the more precious the text, the more respect and care it is given, and consequently, the less likely it will become worn and worthless to the point it must be destroyed.
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The manuscript tradition went through many years of copying and it's common knowledge they all will wear out from usage. Copying before destroying the worn exemplar copy, guaranties the perpetuation of accurate Scripture (except for the false writers of some manuscripts of course)!
blueskies said:
The other stems from the prohibition against destroying sacred texts, particularly those containing the name of God. We learn this prohibition from a midrash on Deuteronomy 12:4: that is, while we are bidden to destroy the places and implements of idolatry in the land of Canaan/Israel, “you shall not do that to Adonai, your God.”7 Thus, when we find the need to dispose of worn-out texts, we must not burn them, for this is how we should destroy objects of idolatry, but bury them.”

God bless you and your enthusiasm for the Word.
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We know there are no known original autographs of the Greek NT writers, and these the only ones presently in question. I may research the Hebrew manuscripts at another time, but the urgency is the NT, because it is the sole spiritual growth for Christians.
 
Origen said:
Now that is a very interesting and important point given the fact that the earliest believers were all Jewish. A genizah is a storage area in a cemetery or synagogue used to house old manuscripts.

By the way we have no early record of Net's claim concerning manuscripts. If Net does, then he should cite the primary sources confirming his claim.
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I'm getting a strange sense of deja vu.
 
Revelation 22:18-19 (NASB)
18 I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his part from the tree of life and from the holy city, which are written in this book.
(NASB)

The traditional view of these verses is that it applies to the Bible as a whole, but there are some commentators that hold that Rev 22:18-19 was targeted at scribes that would add and otherwise change the text as they are producing copies.

Now, I don't claim to be an expert, particularly in this area, and no-one should care what someone says online (particularly someone that simply styles himself as Siloam says) but I don't see that it matters a great deal. The Apostolic age is over and there are no longer leaders who match the requirements for Apostleship as set forth in Acts 1: 21-22. Some churches use the term as an honorific but the actual requirements can no longer be met.
 
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