Are You Venting About Your Faith?

Ok, I'll answer a few of your questions, and maybe even vent a little...

Are you angry with the overall Christian faith in
Do you expect the body to be in full accord with your personal understanding and application of the doctrines?

these times?

I am more perplexed than angry.

Are you discouraged with attending church? What d
Is it because the world wide public sees your post between you and another?

oes it mean for you and your family to attend?

My dear wife has an aversion to attending in person. She understands the need for fellowship, but is much more comfortable watching online, so our physical attendance is down. For myself, I have attended and been blessed in a variety of churches, but feel it is important to attend with my lifes love.

Despite what Christ says about gathering for worship (Acts 1:13,) why do you feel you don't need to attend church?

It's not that we don't need to attend church, it is a matter of overcoming personal hesitancy.

Do you choose to be a lone Christian, if so, who do you lean on, and what does God say about the context of "iron sharpening iron" (Proverbs 27:17)

My wife and I are alone together. Yes we could use Christian fellowship, but we are where we are. Forcing the issue doesn't overcome it, only makes it more acute.

Does Jesus already know all this in these times, therefore, what does the Scriptures say to you?

Of course He knows. He also understands where our hesitancy comes from.

Do you expect the body to be in full accord with your personal understanding and application of the doctrines?

I tend to gravitate to churches with very fundamental doctrine. For the most part, I am in full agreement with the foundations. But I do have believe in a few things that are in starkly incompatible with church doctrine (I have mentioned before my stand on evolution).

And, much of the Christian right take political stances that I feel are contrary to living for Christ.

To vent in this regard: the Christian Right seems never to have read Matthew 25. Or they do not see how it applies to immigrants. They also seem to do all they can to make it difficult for the poor who are citizens to have a voice in society.

All this does not cause me to break fellowship, but sometimes I have to really work hard to control my tongue. The scriptures according to Siloam would not be a good basis for doctrine.

Why do you get angry or disappointed if a brother or sister posts their view contrary to yours?

I sometimes get anxious or a little upset, but not angry. This happens when there is an important point that a brother seems to be missing. If I do get anxious, the problem is with me regardless of wherever truth lies, and I sometimes have to 'walk' away and not post or even read other posts for a while.

Is it because the world wide public sees your post between you and another?

There have been times when I did not even know I was arguing, but when I read my own posts and remember how I felt, I realize how bad a witness that is. That this is in a public forum makes it particularly something to feel shame about.

After venting your grievance in your faith, what are you doing about it, logging off and forgetting about it, or allowing the discussion to linger with you? What does the Scripture say in your position?

About two weeks back, I was looking up the origin of the phrase "It is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness". The best evidence is that it is from a sermon entitled "The Invincible Strategy" by W L Watkinson and published in 1907 with other sermons in "The Supreme Conquest and other sermons Preached in America"

As far as the phrase, It is much better to find even a small way of alleviating a problem than to sit and stew and be angry about it. I have apologized a couple of times for being intemperate on this forum, and strive to do better.

As far as the sermon, I find it very refreshing. In this era of take-no-prisoners arguing about back and forth. It is much about looking at ones self and making sure that we are good examples of what a Christian is rather than shouting at all around us how they should be.
 
Do you expect the body to be in full accord with your personal understanding and application of the doctrines? not sure what you mean by this. - Lanolin

Let's say you strongly believe what Jesus says in a particular Scripture and another person shares with you what the same Scripture says to them. But they are not in agreement with you nor your understanding. How do you reconcile this?

I'd just say that its their personal understanding not mine and think about where they are coming from. Maybe I'd look at the surrounding passages if they only shared one verse. I'd respect their different view. It's a personal understanding after all. We aren't all going to fully understand everything.

The body has different members and we apply doctrines differently plus...God gives different gifts to different people we don't all have the same gifts. I think if we did it would be pretty boring!
 
Just want to add that some people plead ignorance because they weren't told or hadn't read that before.
I'm not the kind of person who always says 'you should know' Or 'you should know better' because a lot of the time, people don't really know. I can't get angry with someone who just didn't know.

God doesn't want us to be ignorant its true but we aren't born with knowing EVERYTHING otherwise we would be God wouldn't we? Thats why we need to ask Him for wisdom.

Also its not bad to say that you didn't know and want to know more. People that come down on you like a tonne of bricks for just not knowing something isn't the right way of going about learning. God reveals things to us - but not all at once or we'll just get totally blinded by His glory!
 
Ok, I'll answer a few of your questions, and maybe even vent a little...
1. I am more perplexed than angry.
2. My dear wife has an aversion to attending in person. She understands the need for fellowship, but is much more comfortable watching online, so our physical attendance is down. For myself, I have attended and been blessed in a variety of churches, but feel it is important to attend with my lifes love.
3. It's not that we don't need to attend church, it is a matter of overcoming personal hesitancy.
4. My wife and I are alone together. Yes we could use Christian fellowship, but we are where we are. Forcing the issue doesn't overcome it, only makes it more acute.
5. Of course He knows. He also understands where our hesitancy comes from.
6. I tend to gravitate to churches with very fundamental doctrine. For the most part, I am in full agreement with the foundations. But I do have believe in a few things that are in starkly incompatible with church doctrine (I have mentioned before my stand on evolution).
7. And, much of the Christian right take political stances that I feel are contrary to living for Christ.
8. To vent in this regard: the Christian Right seems never to have read Matthew 25. Or they do not see how it applies to immigrants. They also seem to do all they can to make it difficult for the poor who are citizens to have a voice in society.
9. All this does not cause me to break fellowship, but sometimes I have to really work hard to control my tongue. The scriptures according to Siloam would not be a good basis for doctrine.
10. I sometimes get anxious or a little upset, but not angry. This happens when there is an important point that a brother seems to be missing. If I do get anxious, the problem is with me regardless of wherever truth lies, and I sometimes have to 'walk' away and not post or even read other posts for a while.
11. There have been times when I did not even know I was arguing, but when I read my own posts and remember how I felt, I realize how bad a witness that is. That this is in a public forum makes it particularly something to feel shame about.

About two weeks back, I was looking up the origin of the phrase "It is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness". The best evidence is that it is from a sermon entitled "The Invincible Strategy" by W L Watkinson and published in 1907 with other sermons in "The Supreme Conquest and other sermons Preached in America"
As far as the phrase, It is much better to find even a small way of alleviating a problem than to sit and stew and be angry about it. I have apologized a couple of times for being intemperate on this forum, and strive to do better.
As far as the sermon, I find it very refreshing. In this era of take-no-prisoners arguing about back and forth. It is much about looking at ones self and making sure that we are good examples of what a Christian is rather than shouting at all around us how they should be.

Hello Siloam;

As always, I enjoy reading your posts. I find that many members gravitate toward very fundamental doctrine, which is a good thing. Truth is, people who devote daily in their time with God also need to tend to their responsibilities of caring for their family, working, serving in the church / community and making time to relax/rest.

You and your wife's personal alone time is where my wife and I are slowly evolving. Many times our marriage was placed third (God first) because my energies have always been focused on other people (second) in the church, despite our commitment to each other and doing the will of God as husband and wife. I'll share more later.

God bless you, Siloam, your wife and family.
 
1) No. 2) Yes. We choose to study at home. 3) We are still gathering for fellowship. 4) We dont choose to be alone. 5) I need to humble myself in meekness even more, shutting out worldly teachings as much as I can. 6) No. I only have expectations for myself, not others. 7) On rare occasions I have, but do my very best not to judge others. 8) No. 9) Pray more.

Hello thenami;

I remember in our many posts at CFS you have shared about your worship with your family and this reminded me of home church. I know a pastor and his wife had a ministry of home church and they traveled to 5 homes on all four corners of the SF Bay Area each week.

There was criticism of his ministry of home church, that it was shut out from the world and gathering with other Christians. But contrary to that their main ministry was evangelism (outreach.) Each home had an average of about 7 members and were all devoted to training.

I'm personally in favor of home church reference the upper room in
Acts 1:13-14. It hasn't been the direction the Lord gave me in my service but God anoints all forms of gathering to worship Him.

Unfortunately, when I spoke to the pastor and his wife a couple of months ago, they had to move back to their home state of Kentucky for personal reasons. I don't know the current situation with the 5 home churches but I should follow up.

God bless
you, sister and I agree with your #9, Pray more!

 
It’s hard to let people know when they are out of order without sounding holier than thou. But when we mention how we feel it works because we can’t argue with feeling. Christians shouldn’t be so offended as they ought to know the score.

I was reading today about “social cooling” it’s kind of like Chinas version of a “social credit score” that is done when vendors collect all our intimate data online.
So, social cooling seems to be like;
If you feel like your being watched you will tailor your behaviour accordingly.

I like the idea of God keeping my credit score these days because I know God is watching us and because He is interested in us all and wants to see and help us grow, and be like Him. But unlike the programmed algorithms we hear of today, forming our psychological profile for profit, Gods social credit score is a corrective action helping me to conform to His image.
-
 
It’s hard to let people know when they are out of order without sounding holier than thou. But when we mention how we feel it works because we can’t argue with feeling. Christians shouldn’t be so offended as they ought to know the score. I was reading today about “social cooling” it’s kind of like Chinas version of a “social credit score” that is done when vendors collect all our intimate data online. So, social cooling seems to be like; If you feel like your being watched you will tailor your behaviour accordingly. I like the idea of God keeping my credit score these days because I know God is watching us and because He is interested in us all and wants to see and help us grow, and be like Him. But unlike the programmed algorithms we hear of today, forming our psychological profile for profit, Gods social credit score is a corrective action helping me to conform to His image. - Via dolarossa

Hello brothers and sisters;

Thank you all for sharing with each other. Let's move on in the topic.

When we accepted God's only Begotten Son into our lives, we desire to honor God by seeking His will and purpose for each of our lives.

The questions I posed earlier will point to these disciplines in Scripture.

Psalm 37: 3-4, 3 Trust in the Lord, and do good; dwell in the land and befriend faithfulness. 4 Delight yourself in the Lord, and he will give you the desires of your heart.

Matthew 6:33, 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

1. Are you where God's Purpose is in your life (family, worship and ministry inreach or outreach?)

2. What do you feel God Says about where you presently are?

3. Do you feel God Allows you to share your desires with Him?

If your answer is yes, or yes and no, it's ok. Relationships with people and places of worship are challenging. God understands, afterall, He is the creator of people, His presence is the place we choose to worship and our relationship with Him can also be challenging.

We all want to be at peace with our desire to follow Jesus. We want to delight in Him at the beginning and end of each day and we desire to trust in the Lord with all our heart. We want to strive to walk in obedience to God in all things.

So what's the problem?

We want to practice the things of God's Word but we tend to include the mix of personal imperfections, flaws, sin and disposition of ourselves. I love Jesus but I'm also broken. I tend to be my own worst enemy because I know myself.

Example, out of nowhere while I'm serving the Lord with all my heart, I'll remember something foolish and folly I once did and start to cringe with guilt. Then I'll remember that I don't need to beat myself up for things I did yesterday or years ago after God and others already forgave me.

Praise God for reminding me! In Romans 8:1-4, 1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

This passage in Romans includes our tongue and heart.

So are we wrong to vent about our faith? No. God knows our hearts and He wants us to open up and confess our hearts to Him, first, and then to each other. Our Father already knows what, who and each of us are...imperfect. Only He is Perfect.

As Via shared, It’s hard to let people know when they are out of order without sounding holier than thou. But when we mention how we feel it works because we can’t argue with feeling. Christians shouldn’t be so offended as they ought to know the score.

This spoke to me. We need to distinguish between our obedience to God and our personal flaws of character. There is a difference. Whether a newly saved or seasoned Christian, noone is above another. We should not be offended with each other because one expresses their vent, frustration, grievance or discouragement in their faith.

God already knows what "we think He doesn't know about our lives and circumstances." Question is, are we focused on His Purpose, what He says, and are we limiting our desires to Him?

Your thoughts?

God bless you all and your continued walk with Christ.
 
Brother,
There are parts of God that are a mystery to us and will continue to be.
We ARE told that his thoughts are not our thoughts neither his way, our way.
We ARE not to lean on our own understanding but to trust in Him for his way is perfect.

Now the question I have to ask myself is do I completely trust my God to reveal what I need when I need it, and to secure my heart in him.

If our focuse and purpose is not him then we are following afar off. This is individual and we have to use HONESTY when we search ourselves.

We all want rightness in our heart and lives, I really believe we do. The thing is WHAT are you willing to do,change,forgive,confess and repent of to get to that place.

Personally I believe every word God has inspired and I trust it is for my benefit not my destruction. I do believe in some ways we limit our desires to God bc it's a trust factor.
Mankind has failed mankind in every way possible and I think we equate God to that position also. Not bc we want to but bc we base it on our own experiences in life. We need to recognize how supremely God loves his creation and wants ALL the best for us. He gave HIS SON to reveal this to us.
 
I thought people just did that (vent about their faith) so others could pray for them
It's kind of tiring always praying for yourself because you run out of prayers pretty soon. And someone else may be able to pray more fervently than you can about your situation..!
 
I thought people just did that (vent about their faith) so others could pray for them
It's kind of tiring always praying for yourself because you run out of prayers pretty soon. And someone else may be able to pray more fervently than you can about your situation..!

Actually, praying for myself can get really addictive. My need for prayer is ever present, but if I concentrate on ME exclusively, it becomes non productive. I find that He knows both my wants and needs, and my prayers better serve to help me understand that He has heard, and to observe and meditate on His answers. Praying for others sets my sights away from my own needs and focuses it on aiding those with whom I come into contact.
 
Yes. It gets harder and harder to find churches/pastors/teachers that teach/preach the truth as God would lead them.. (or so it seems)
Many teach/preach from a schedule, or curriculum... or simply pull an old sermon from their folder, or preach the topic of the current secular holiday... while neglecting to ask God what this assembly of believers, this person, or this study group needs to hear.
(I prefer to hear and study God's word.. from the Bible... not to read some made-up story with aweful questions to answer.. many written so as to push some agenda.)


ASf, something I've learned and come to accept is that the system will never change. That's the power of tradition and paradigm. I gave up a long time ago trying to kick against the goad of paradigm. Frank Miller, a minister of the Gospel, once told me that if ever I encounter a pulpit pastor who dares claim that there's not sense of ego boost to be the one behind that pulpit, he's a liar, and Frank wanted me to introduce him to that pastor who ever claimed such so that Frank can call him a liar to his face.

If I may offer something of encouragement...there is a way for ministers to learn and offer what is relevant to the people. Isolation from the people is how they remain detached and aloof from their needs. That is the outflow of massive ego. Some believe the Lord leads them to preach what is needed, and they will even enjoy the accolade from the various of the 'warm fuzzie junkies' who will lavish them with praises and glory for the sermons, regardless as to whether it really touched them at the deeper levels of their lives.

Those men who truly shepherd, which involves getting down into the weeds of the very lives of the people sitting out there as their supporting audience members, they are those whose effectiveness is much more pronounced.

Bob has demonstrated that he has his ear to the ground of lives in here. This thread is evidence of that. He's asked the hard questions, wanting real answers from the heart. Your response is how this all SHOULD play itself out. This is how Bob can glean far greater substance for sermons than the cash cow 'greats' many get from sermon volumes on the shelf, which is most generally detached from the lives of those to whom most preach each week. The people are far more dynamic and multitudinous in their experiences and needs than what those pathetic volumes on the shelf can cover.

Therein was the thrust behind a book called "The Open Church" within some organizations around the country. It was initially published some years ago, and is still in print at Amazon, by James Rutz. It's worthwhile reading. "Rethinking Elders" by Gene Edwards is also a good book to read when it comes to digging deeper into Church leadership...not (c)hurch leadership, but (C)hurch leadership. They are not all the same thing.

I could write volumes on all this, but time is the constraint.

I'm glad you took the time to write what you did. Blessings to you and yours.

MM
 
I tend to gravitate to churches with very fundamental doctrine. For the most part, I am in full agreement with the foundations. But I do have believe in a few things that are in starkly incompatible with church doctrine (I have mentioned before my stand on evolution).

And, much of the Christian right take political stances that I feel are contrary to living for Christ.

To vent in this regard: the Christian Right seems never to have read Matthew 25. Or they do not see how it applies to immigrants. They also seem to do all they can to make it difficult for the poor who are citizens to have a voice in society.

All this does not cause me to break fellowship, but sometimes I have to really work hard to control my tongue. The scriptures according to Siloam would not be a good basis for doctrine.

Yeah, I know what you mean. The national and world issues have become insane. The values breakdown taking place all around us is alarming, the political Left is pushing for greater and greater evils (open borders to any and all in spite of legal ways to immigrate), couching it all in seemingly benevolent language. I dislike both parties that are in power, and have grown weary of all their rhetoric and finger-pointing.

In the cacophony of it all, there is the Lord, who is in total control. THAT is the one stabilizing reality that keeps me grounded in emotional stability through it all. I don't watch the news, thus allowing mass media to tell me what to think and believe. I don't even listen to the far Right either. Above it all, there is THE Lord God, who has perfect Power over it all. The enemy of our souls cannot accomplish what He does not allow.

Conservative politicians (so-called) are not pointing at DOMA (which is the law of the land at the level of an Act) to go after so-called "gay marriage" allowances in states, not like the abortion crowd has always pointed at the Roe v Wade, which was NOT the law of the land.

So, yes, the hypocrisy we see even in those who are allegedly "conservative" is astoundingly hypocritical.

And here we all are, watching it all unfold. We're living in exciting times. Outside our borders, we see Israel attacking Syria, close to Damascus. There is a prophecy that city will be destroyed by a fire kindled in her walls...perhaps nuclear...

Anyway, there are ways to build a fellowship with others, even in your own home. We are striving to plant more and more house churches in my area, even in our home. People are getting more and more fed up with the ineffectiveness of the majority of what has been the institutional, physical front for the (C)hurch otherwise known as 'churchianity'. It's high time the (C)hurch abandons that failed model, and start practicing a LIVING model in this wicked culture of ours.

Just a word of encouragement....

MM
 
Sometimes what churches do is a bit over my head
Like church boards and things. Because I'm not an 'elder' or in that position people don't tell me what really goes on. When I have attended church meetings (for business) I'm not allowed to vote or say anything anyway so, there's not much point in me even being there. I learned that, in some churches, you can't bring things to the table, because you aren't allowed to speak at the table.

But thats just in some churches, I don't know if all are like that.

Even in other organisations, like clubs or panels of judges or work and things like that, when you have a meeting that is TOO big, nobody really gets a real say in the noise and confusion of a meeting. And they take forever. Maybe the odd meeting you get to write something on a post-it-note. But mostly its if you don't have a loud voice, you just won't be heard.
 
when I say noise and confusion..well actually church meetings can be highly structured, but they might be rushed or they take forever. In quaker meetings, there is a rule about it not being about politics. Eg you can't just stand on your soapbox and harangue people. If you are to speak, you are to respect what others are saying and also listen. But only speak when you have something to say (everyone has a chance to speak if they are led to by the spirit)
 
I don't really like going to church by myself. It's just that sometimes, you get harangued on why you are there why you arent' married, what your job is etc.
I know people are just trying to make conversation, but I thought the 'how is work' 'are you still working' was an inane question to ask when it's your day off.
 
It’s hard to let people know when they are out of order without sounding holier than thou. But when we mention how we feel it works because we can’t argue with feeling. Christians shouldn’t be so offended as they ought to know the score.

I was reading today about “social cooling” it’s kind of like Chinas version of a “social credit score” that is done when vendors collect all our intimate data online.
So, social cooling seems to be like;
If you feel like your being watched you will tailor your behaviour accordingly.

I like the idea of God keeping my credit score these days because I know God is watching us and because He is interested in us all and wants to see and help us grow, and be like Him. But unlike the programmed algorithms we hear of today, forming our psychological profile for profit, Gods social credit score is a corrective action helping me to conform to His image.
-

Interesting thoughts, Via. Holier than thou.... That's pretty much akin to another oldie but goodie...too heavenly minded to be any earthly good.

It's really something how powerful some cliché's can be that the enemy of our souls can use to stifle growth and effective function in Christ. I've often decried indifference as one of the chief sins throughout history to this very day, and yet had never really thought that sometimes indifference can be a good response to the worldly drag upon our spiritual lives...meaning that we can apply indifference against the demands to accept and celebrate perverse people and their lifestyles.

It doesn't help anything to get all bent out of shape over them and their antics. Prayer unto the Lord for the pulling down of the strongholds of evil, and the building up of godly strongholds in the place of the wickedness and evil that is trying to overtake our nation and the world.

Therein is the purpose for the removal of the Church from this world, because that shows how powerful a force prayer is for staying the hands of evildoers. That force must be removed in order for the antichrist tom come to full power.

Good stuff.

MM
 
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