Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Where is the Messiah, Jul 8, 2014.

  1. What are your thoughts on this passage?

    Then the seven angels who had the seven trumpets prepared to sound them.

    7 The first angel sounded his trumpet, and there came hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down on the earth. A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up.

    8 The second angel sounded his trumpet, and something like a huge mountain, all ablaze, was thrown into the sea. A third of the sea turned into blood, 9 a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.

    10 The third angel sounded his trumpet, and a great star, blazing like a torch, fell from the sky on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water— 11 the name of the star is Wormwood.[a] A third of the waters turned bitter, and many people died from the waters that had become bitter.

    12 The fourth angel sounded his trumpet, and a third of the sun was struck, a third of the moon, and a third of the stars, so that a third of them turned dark. A third of the day was without light, and also a third of the night.

    13 As I watched, I heard an eagle that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: “Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!”
  2. Much of Revelations is symbolic (or phrased in such a manner as to make it difficult to understand).
    Wormword is a shrub whose leaves are very bitter and contain a natural insecticide. It is used in making the alcoholic beverage
    Absinthe (which was banned in much of the world over the last century).
    Chernobyl translates to wormwood.
    Where is the Messiah likes this.
  3. I love Revelations! Clearly asteroids hit causing the earth's rotation to increase so that our day will be redefined as 16 hours instead of 24 (one third of 24 is 8 so a third of the day and night are removed, meaning the earth's rotation is increased by 8 hours reducing a single rotation to only 16 hours.) Here's an OT explanation of this verse:

    Isaiah 24:19-21 (KJV)
    The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved, the earth is moved exceedingly. The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again. And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones [that are] on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.

    Notice it also shows how Satan is thrown out of heaven as punishment to both them and those on the earth.

    ἄψινθος apsinthos (ap'-sin-thos) n.
    1. wormwood (as a type of bitterness
    2. (figuratively) calamity)

    It's named after what it does to the waters... making them bitter.

    Matthew 24:21 (KJV)
    For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

    We can't understand Revelation because we too much rely on our own understanding and paradigms of our experiences, but as Jesus says, we'll never have experienced anything like it, so it's time to broaden your imagination and take the word of God literally.

    Just my dos centimos :)
    רק שני סנטים שלי
    KingJ, porcupine73 and Where is the Messiah says Amen and like this.
  4. I've heard Chernobyl translated as that before. I didn't realize that was actually the case. I think it was unwise to build a nuclear power plant in a city named after a symbol in revelation that makes a third of the world's water undrinkable.
  5. That assumes they ever read the word of God. People can't agree with what version to read, it'd be shocking if someone actually changed their actions based on the word of God.
  6. Abdicate, you are so very cynical I've noticed. People get saved everyday and turn their life around, and even if it is just 1 in 1000 it is still worth it.
    autumn oddity likes this.
  7. That may be true, but it also happens to be a fact.

    Jer 17:9 KJV The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], and desperately wicked: who can know it?

    I trust nothing anyone says unless they're quoting the word of God without comment. Here's why. Your comment was unrealistic that a city wouldn't exist or do anything "dangerous" with the name of a prophecy towards destruction. In reality Chernobyl, the word itself, is a combination of chornyi (black) and byllia (grass blades or stalks), hence it literally means black grass or black stalks. Wormwood is a different (but related) plant, Artemisia absinthium, (Polyn). "Polyn" has no English equivalent, but corresponds to the botanical genus Artemisia. So you see, the entire premise is based on the stretch that Chernobyl means wormwood. I'm sure it was just to sell end-time books. It's just like the stretch that 666 is the Internet (Hebrew doesn't have the letter W so they use the letter vav which holds the value of 6, making www = ווו =! 666). Or the barcodes on all retail items when in fact the last digit (which isn't a digit) would be an example of a backwards six if it existed, yet for years people have said that the barcodes were 666 when they are not. All just elephants in clouds.

    If that makes me cynical, so be it. We live in a society where it's okay to cheat (as long as you don't get caught), repent when caught and not change, and never admit your wrong or say you’re sorry. These are what are being taught by de facto in society and when you point out that "this" or "that" is wrong you're branded as a hypocrite.
    KingJ likes this.
  8. I mean, I just thought it was ironic that they built a nuclear reactor in a city called wormwood or whatever. I didn't really have a point. In fact I lean on your side, I basically don't trust much of the apocalypse theories, and honestly I think it is going to happen a lot differently than most people think.

    As you were saying above, you don't trust anything people say unless they quote the word of God, and actually I am skeptical even if they do. For example, the Bible says, "All the believers were on in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of their possessions was their own, but they shared everything they had." Acts 4:32 Therefore, if your a believer you must live in a communitarian system. Or you must support socialism.
  9. My statement was "without commentary". It's up to the Holy Spirit and a willing heart to be taught that must provide the understanding intended. My experience has been that He'll give you clues to peak your interest on a subject and then with just the right nudging from a verse that may or may not actually apply to what He’s trying to teach you, but it’s the last piece of the puzzle for you to grasp the understanding He’s providing. This is why I cringe when people quote dogma like scripture. There are so many out there. My favorite is the 3 wise men at the birth of Jesus – NOT. But I guess it’s easier to sell Jesus in a manger than Him in front of a house at ~2 years old. I do agree that many use and abuse the word of God because they don't take it into context and sometimes that context isn't just the paragraph or sentence, but the entire word of God.
  10. Clearly God's wrath. Nothing symbolic there. It reads easily. No dragon = apache helicopter interpretations needed. Just take this line fore example ''and something like a huge mountain,''... John clearly trying his best to explain it properly. He will not be impressed with anyone miss interpreting him imho.

    Maybe John saw a CNN clip calling it wormwood because of him?
    Abdicate likes this.
  11. See, people often assume he's making the best description of things that he can about modern technology. I on the other hand firmly believe it is all symbolic. The dragon is the devil or his power. The lamb is Christ. 7 eyes means all seeing.
  12. I will not argue with you that there is much symbolism in other passages ;).
  13. As the earth has experienced many stellar impacts before the only thing we could be seeing is impacts with many fairly large meteors. Possibly from a breakup in the asteroid field between Mars and Jupiter. And object striking that area could cause a rain of meteors of small to medium sizes. These would come down red, hence mixed with blood, and cause devastation to a portion of the surface of the earth.

    Our planet is always moving and shifting due to plate tectonics. Having something the size of small mountain slide into the sea is quite plausible. The sea turning to blood is again a way of explaining classical way of death in that time period and ships being destroyed by a resulting tidal surge would not be too far fetched.

    Now wormwood the word used is apsinthion. That is a feminine use of the word, Usually in greek it is a neutral form, but here it is female. At present we have in orbit many satellites. These are running on batteries that if they got into the water supply can cause it to be poisoned. But that would be a LOT of batteries not something from just ONE item. So my theory would be a satellite with a nuclear material component. The feminine use of the word makes me think it could be named after a she, the way ships are often called she.

    As the sun and moon classically in his time was thought to revolve around the Earth, John would never understand that something could be blocking the light from these objects. What could block it is unknown at this time, but to hazard a guess the use of geosynchronous objects to divert sunlight in an effort to slow global climate change is a possibility. But honestly that kind of project would take the entire world working together to pull off. I don't see that as probable at this time period. So I am stumped on that one.

    The eagle is a classic powerful messenger in those times. Being used from Egypt to the Greeks. A portend of that nature would mean that this is a message from God to John.

    All of this is conjecture.
  14. There's no "eagle" in the Greek! What a terrible translation!

    Revelation 8:13 (KJV)
    And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

    - Original: ἄγγελος
    - Transliteration: Aggelos
    - Phonetic: ang'-el-os
    - Definition:
    1. a messenger, envoy, one who is sent, an angel, a messenger from God
    - Origin: from aggello [probably derived from G71, cf G34] (to bring tidings)
    - TDNT entry: 02:14,1
    - Part(s) of speech: Noun Masculine
  15. Yes it is, but I was only going by what was posted by OP.

    I knew it was an angel instead, but I had to use the sources given.

    And this is WHY if you go by the translation given we get errors.

    Like in Jesus at the temple with a scourge, the word is a non-violent driving out, not a violent one.
    Just as Satan is transformed in the Vulgate to Lucifer to denounce the lucerifarians at the time by the pope and then carried into the KJV.

    And how the word phosporus could be Christ or The Devil. These are just bad renderings.

    The bible is rife with these things.

    And they threw in a unicorn just for fun!

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