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Why first the Jews Then the Gentiles?

Discussion in 'Bible Study' started by univac, Sep 21, 2008.

  1. Why first the Jews Then the Gentiles?

    Thought for food

    Why is Isreal God Children and we Gentiles to be adopted as children of God?

    What is your reasoning?
  2. a seed starts small.:)
  3. I have no scriptures on hand for this but it's my opinion that God approached the Jews first. I believe that it was God's plan that they share the good news with the rest of mankind. When, however, they rejected Him God went to plan B. He gave it to the rest of us and now we get to share it with the Jews. The Jews were to be his spokespeople as it were. Why did He choose the Jews first? you ask. Why not? I answer. He could have played 'eeny meeny miny mo' or the Jews may have been the first that God found that were actively seeking to know Him. Personally I choose the second option. Abraham for instance was very actively seeking God. At least I get that impression since God came to Abram and led him out of a moon worshipping home to a separate place and eventually made the first covenant with him.
  4. My reasoning is that Isaac is begotten by Gods Holy Spirit through Sarah, and not flesh/soul through slave girl Hagar like Ishmael. Which makes Israel the offspring of God and us the adopted children. As one is of Holy Spirit and the other of Soul (Adam). But thanks to God that we gentiles have received his Holy Spirit through our Lord Jesus Christ and have permission to be children of God Amen.

    God Bless
  5. It was Gods plan from the begining because He praechedthe gospel to Abraham saying in you the nartions will be blesed thrugh your seed meaning Christ Jesus and tghrough Him belioevers ecieve hOLY sPIRIT THIS IS THE BLESSING THAT gOD IS AND WAS TALKING ABOUT
  6. It has always been God's plan to have those on earth who would represent Him. In fact, this was His purpose for all mankind as He created mankind in His image (Gen 1:27). The two words, "image" and "likeness" used together imply both a static picture as in a photo, and a dynamic image as in a shadow or reflection - in other words, mankind was to both "look" like God (not physically, since God in His essence does not have a body, but spiritually) and act like God (moving as He moved, standing still as He stood still, just like a shadow or reflection would.) He then gave our first parents the mandate to "fill the earth, subdue it and rule over it." (Gen. 1:28) In other words, they were to be His vice regents on earth.

    Our first parents fatally damaged their image and likeness of God through sin, not only for themselves but for all their descendants. By their obedience to satan instead of God, they also handed over the rulership of this world to the devil.

    However, God still wanted a people to represent Him. (None of this took God by surprise. He knows all things, and knew from before the creation of the world exactly what man would do, so technically it is not right to speak of Him having a "plan B.")

    Abraham demonstrated His faithfulness to God through obedience. When God told him to leave his country and his father's household - something that was not normally done in those days - he did. (Genesis 12:1-6) God then made him a promise that He would give the land to Abraham and his descendants (Gen 12:7) Later He confirmed this to Abraham as a covenant (Gen 15). Although Abraham and Sarah tried to make this happen by natural means, by Abraham fathering Ishmael through Sarah's maidservant, God made it clear that His promise would not come through that line, but through a son born to Abraham and Sarah, and in due time this was fulfilled with the birth of Isaac. (Gen 21:1-7)

    Fast forward through the days of the Patriarchs to the time when Joseph was sold into slavery in Egypt by his brothers. Remember, this whole family (as obnoxious as some of them were) had the blessing of God because of the covenant of God with Abraham. When, after a series of trials, Joseph ended up as 2IC over all Egypt, Jacob sent his other sons down (not knowing that Joseph is the ruler) to buy grain during the famine. Joseph tested them out a bit, then finally revealed himself and brought them all down to Egypt as honored guests.

    Fast forward another 400 years. The Hebrews have now become a large part of the Egyptian population. They have also become slaves. But they are still God's people, because of God's covenant with Abraham. Pharaoh decides they are a problem, and that he needs to drastically cut back their numbers, but as a direct result of his attack Moses ends up being brought up in Pharaoh's palace. (Exodus 1:1 - 2:10) When he grows up, Moses identifies with his own people. He knows that he is called to be their liberator, but tries to do it in his own strength, and as a result ends up spending 40 years at the edge of the desert tending sheep, till he is in a place where God is able to use him. Then God sends him back to bring His people out of Egypt and establish them as a nation in their own right. After they have come out, God tells them, "Now if you obey Me fully and keep My Covenant, then out of all nations you will be My treasured possession. Although the whole world is Mine, you will be for Me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation." (Exodus 19:5-6)

    Priests are those who represent God before man, and man before God. So Israel was meant to be God's corporate representative on earth. They were chosen because of God's covenant with Abraham, and confirmed in that position through the Mosaic covenant. Unfortunately, they did not live up to that position. Rather than touching the world with God, as they were supposed to, they saw themselves as special and better than the world, whilst at the same time indulging in all the sins of the nations around them. Nevertheless, God promised that the day would come when He would make a new covenant with them. (Jeremiah 31:31-33)

    In due time, God the Son took on humanity and became the Son of God in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ. He not only paid the penalty of sin for all those who would receive Him, but He actually began a new race of people - not a physical race, but a spiritual race: those who would be born not of the flesh, but of the spirit. (John 3:6) That "race" is the Church, the Body of Christ. Through Christ's death, God has made a new covenant with us, by which we become His people and His representatives. (Luke 22:20) Because of God's covenants with Israel, and His promise through Jeremiah, the Jews were the first ones given opportunity to become part of that race. But because this "race" is spiritual rather than physical, it can be extended to all peoples, gentiles as well as Jews.

    God's purposes with the physical Jewish race are not over, however, as Paul makes clear in Romans 11.


  7. Good observation...I had not seen that connection before. Many scriptures tell that God had chosen Israel so maybe that is WHY Isaac was born of the Holy Spirit...

  8. I enjoyed reading your excerpt, Lynn. It was full of information and really interesting. Explained a lot. Thanx. Bonnie
  9. So its agreed that God chose Abraham because of his hunger to know God and his obedience. When the Jews rejected Jesus the Message was given to the gentiles.

    Now...What position do the Jews hold here? Are they a special people above others? I submit that they are not. God being no respecter of persons, He does not put one above the other...What do you think.

    Does Revlynn mean you're a preacher? Cool.
  10. Because that is the way He wanted it?
  11. And maybe also, it is something that we should simply accept, even though we do not understand?
  12. John 4:22 You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.

    Basically this can apply to many others also such as the ones in Acts whom Paul I believe went to and found a statue that said "to the unknown God"

    Anyways. I don't think it only started with Abraham but with Noah.
    If Noah weren't there then the LORD would've destroyed the earth and everyone in it. But Noah found favor in His eyes, and then Abraham and so forth.

    There was no one else than the Hebrews who followed the LORD God, all others either did not submit to Him, or they did not know about Him. So the Hebrews were chosen, because they obeyed Him first (starting with Abel).
  13. God created Adam and Eve to start mankind out in His image. It wasn't until man fell from Grace and gained the "knowledge of good and evil", that humankind divided themselves between followers of God and followers of Satan- (world).

    Since then, God now chosses a lineage of people, makes a covenant with them and calls them His "First Chosen." They are the lineage that kept up the animal sacrificing God taught Adam and Eve to start with-(See Gen. 3:21 & Cain and Able).

    When Sarah and Abraham came along, God dd not implant Isaac by the Holy Spirit. God opened Sarah's womb, so when Abraham and Sarah came together, she produced an egg cell that could be fertilized by Abraham's sperm.

    Had to be that way, otherwise Isaac would've been the Messiah who was concieved thru, by passing the human elements to be concieved, grow and born pure. Jesus would've actually been the "3rd Adam", not the "2nd Adam" then.

    If pay close attention to Scripture, you'd find the Jews are still God's "First Chosen", because Jesus came from the Jewish lineage of David, etc, etc. And, Christ came mostly for the Jew first and second for the Gentile. Why?

    Salvation was still only for the Jews until Jesus gave Peter the keys to open Salvation to the Gentiles Acts 10:9-23. If study the Old Test. closely, you'd find, regardless how many times the Jews turned away from God, God still brought them back to Him because they stayed His "First Chosen" for all time.

    Notice in the futuristic prophecy of bringing Jews and Gentiles together in Ezek. 37:11-22 sticks of Judah and of Ephraim brought together, but Judah is mentioned first- (Jesus was born thru the lineage of the Tribe of Judah).

    As shown already, even during the time up to after Christ was raised from the dead and ascended to Heaven, Gentiles were still not opened to Salvation. Not until into the "Acts" of the Apostles And Peter's opening Salvation to Gentiles.

    Even the Apostles, at differing times, declare the Truth of how Salvation is still for the Jew first and the Gentile second.

    So, I disagree with that assumption. Scriptures say different.

    God Bless!!
  14. CC are you sure that's the right Verse where it talks about the animals being cleansed so that he could eat them and that they will be no longer unclean ?

    are you saying that represents the Gentiles, that now they are clean?

    other than that. I agree with your post.
  15. Yes, Denadii, I've been a preacher since 1975 and was first ordained in 1983. I head up Glory to the King Ministries International (Glory to the King Ministries International - International Apostolic Christian Ministry)

    Paul takes the whole of Romans chapter 11 talking about the future of the Jews and their relationship with God. The chapter is too long to quote, but particularly note verses 28 & 29: "As far as the gospel is concerned they (the Jews) are enemies on your account, but as far as election is concerned they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God's gifts and His call are irrevocable." In other words, God still loves Israel and still has purposes for them.


  16. Ramsey-

    Well, maybe you should read it instead of asking- 10:11-13, 15-16.

    Yes, this is exactly right. Look at what happened right after Peter was given that vision I mentioned. God had sent particular men of the Gentile race in Cesarea from Cornelius' household- (Cornelius was a Roman Centurion).

    For Milleniums thru the Old Test and even shortly into the start of the Christian Age, the Old ancient Command of God held, for eating only "clean" animals, avoiding eating "unclean ones".

    This also related to Gentiles being "pagans"- (scum, rejected- "unclean") races of people, outside of the races that belonged to the Jewish lineage that stems from "Seth", not "Able".

    There is no evidence in God's Word Able had married and had children. But, God does show, how after Cain killed Able, God then Blessed Adam and Eve with another son to replace Able- Seth.

    From there on, we always see references of evil children of Cain, good children of Seth.

    Look at Acts 10:19-28- (particularly v 28).

    Notice, all thru the whole time from Christ's ascention up to Acts 10, God nor the Holy Spirit, ever tells Peter right out, when Gentiles are allowed to be preached Salvation to. Then in Acts 10, Peter recieves this vision of that "sheet" from Heaven, showing all animals, birds, creeping things etc are "clean" now.

    Right after that, Cornelius' men show up and while they talk with Peter, look what Peter declares to them in v 28- He tells them of Old Test Law first, but then, right after, states this-

    "but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean".

    So, if not from that vision just before, where does God tell Peter otherwise Gentiles are now acceptable for recieving Salvation? No where, until that vision.

    This is why, when God has had me preach or teach, one of the main guidelines for learning what God is really saying in Scriptures, is to read plenty before to plenty after it, in order to understand the context in which God is meaning what He's saying.

    A second guideline is to read and learn God's Wprd- (all of It), for the purpose of studying It and seeking God's wisdom, that other related Scriptures can be understood and used in context with a focal one, for realizing a fuller "scope" of any Concept God teaches us.

    Read, learn and then study God's Word, being in fervent prayer for His Truth people.

    God Bless!!
  17. Thank you.
    I have read Acts 10 when you posted it but only until verse 23 as you have posted it before.

    Have a blessed night.

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