On non-essentials and their Amillennialism, Lutherans are about the same as Rome.
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What Is "Reformed Theology"????
- Thread starter Major
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There is no contrary. We agree completely. I think you misunderstood the last line I had posed.-
"I think a case could be made that the NT caused the formation of the RCC, not the other way around."
This in no way means the RCC based itself on the scriptures, or that the scriptures formed the RCC. Scriptures caused the formation of the RCC, in that, scriptures brought the churches together and made a power base that Constantine recognized he could use to unite the empire under his control. So he made Christianity the official religion of the Roman Empire to serve his purposes, which directly created the RCC and gave it power.
We've seen many instances of TV preachers using the scriptures to create a base of power and money for their own purposes. It is just evil to use the scriptures in this way. Power corrupts humans.
There is power in the scriptures because it is God's Word. The great thing is that God can use something like the RCC to advance His purposes.
OK. Yes.........I did misunderstand. Thanks for the clarification!
I earnestly hope that Catholic believers do not take my comments as Bashing your faith!!!!
That is not my intention at all. I am merely stating the obvious questions that anyone would want to ask! No malice is intended.
None of us should go to ANY church and accept what a man says as truth. God gave us all a brain and He did not tell us to take it out and leave it in the car when we go to church. We MUST always verify what a MAN says to what GOD HAS SAID!
That is not my intention at all. I am merely stating the obvious questions that anyone would want to ask! No malice is intended.
None of us should go to ANY church and accept what a man says as truth. God gave us all a brain and He did not tell us to take it out and leave it in the car when we go to church. We MUST always verify what a MAN says to what GOD HAS SAID!
This, I think, is the crux of the matter. What did God say? Well, the answer to that rests in the Bible. But, as we showed above, the text of the Bible was curated by the nascent Catholic church in 325 and 419. Were there other scriptures being passed around from church to church before that time that were considered inspired? I am sure there were, but because they were not selected for inclusion as canon material we'll never know.
Just to be clear, I am not bashing on the Bible (at least I don't think I am), but to further my case, even during the Reformation several books were removed from the Catholic Bible (it has 73 books vs our 66 books if I am not mistaken). As we can plainly see, men can and do determine what is canon, and by extension the word of God. It's messy and complicated, this religion stuff.
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I hope that you understand that it is often claimed that the church simply decided which books to include in the New Testament centuries after Jesus and the apostles had left the scene. The problem with that thesis is that it implies that Jesus, through the Holy Spirit, was not involved in the process at all! THAT IS THE PROBLEM! At least for me.
To answer your question, YES, There were many other early Christian documents, and some of them may have been very useful while others were heretical. The canon is the list of those that God has given to the church by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Some would say that the early church was diverse and, as time passed, one version of Christianity won out over the other types. The “winners” decided which books would be authoritative, and, of course, they chose the books that they agreed with or that agreed with them.
All of the following is easily found in history ......When attempting to determine which books were inspired and authoritative (books that should be included in the canon), the early church had three primary requirements:
1. Apostolic Authority
2. Orthodox Doctrine
3. Broad-Based Acceptance
As these tests of authenticity were applied, 27 books began to emerge. For a while there were some doubts or disputes about a book here or there, but the 27 books of the New Testament that are accepted by Christians today were the ones that emerged as a result of the application of the above guidelines. As this view of the canon emerged, various church councils and synods gave formal acknowledgment of what the church had organically come to recognize
The Synod of Laodicea (363) forbade the use of several non-canonical books. ere later accepted as canonical.
The Council of Hippo (393) stated that the 27 books in the New Testament were canonical.
The Synod of Carthage (397) stated that only canonical books should be read in the churches.
The Council of Carthage (419) reaffirmed the existing canon.
I agree 100%, but then we must reconcile why the Bible went from 73 to 66 books during the Protestant Reformation.
God's word is immutable and unchanging. Man's understanding of God's word, unfortunately, is a different matter.
The extra SEVEN (7) books in the Roman Catholic Bible are from the Apocrypha. The apocryphal books were not considered to be inspired and thus were not recognized by the church as part of the Bible. At the Council of Trent (A.D. 1546) the Roman Catholic Church included them in their Bible.
If you will read through the books of the Apocrypha I think that you will agree that they are not only NOT inspired but in most cases "Occultic".
Example:
2 Maccabees 12:45–46 teaches prayer for the dead.
Tobit 12:9 Teaches Salvation by Works.
Enoch gives us the angels Raphel and Peniel who are NOT found anywhere in the Bible.
Nor were they quoted by Jesus or the Apostles in their Epistles, or included in the Jewish Canon.
Absolutely correct my dear brother!
All are Occultic and some just plain "bizarre"!
Take the time to look up how Daniel killed a dragon with a lions fur ball and then there is the story of Susanna.
She refuses the advances of two Babyloian men refuses and is of course found guilty by the Council of Elders and sentenced to death on their testimony alone. Enter Daniel—after being divinely informed by God of the two men’s false testimony, a second trial is arranged. Daniel proves their guilt with a basic cross-examination, and justice is served; Susanna is freed and the two perverts are executed.
I love a mystery!