Gr8 post m8 I rate 8/8I'm a Bible believer. I'm sure many have come here claiming that, nothing new there.
But what do I believe? Well what does it say about itself?
Is it true?
Thy Word is truth - John 17:17 KJB
What is it's importance?
Part 1 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
- John 1:1 KJB
Part II - I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name. - Psalm 138:2 KJB
What will I gain from it? What will it do for me?
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. - Hebrews 4:12 KJB
1. quick
2. powerful
3. discerner
Those are the attributes of a living thing, aren't they?
see - John 1:1 again for reference
What should I do?
Seek ye out of the book of the LORD, and read - Isaiah 34:16 KJB
Then what?
And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God. - Luke 4:4 KJB
At this point, the only question ie,
which part of EVERY don't you understand?
Thank you for your time,
Craig
It seems like you are trying to b8 an argument m8.Well…
My post pretty much received the responses I expected.
I’m still figuring out how your system here works so please bear with me if my responses seem a bit jumbled…
Lanolin,
What a thing is called does not affect or change what that thing is. Many books (quran, book of mormon, etc…) and things in man’s history have been and are still called holy.
As a general teaching or discussion point simply calling it holy does not make it so.
There are many who think of and call the bible evil. Does that make it evil?
A little bit of research will show us that there have been a fair number of translation issues and corrections made to the King James version alone. Your own post demonstrates that you yourself have noted translation issues in at least one other version.
Please note the similarity between your “I just ask God about it.” remark and the last part of my original post.
Major,
The issue of the bible’s validity is important and I don’t think anyone here has stated or believes otherwise. My point is that statements/arguments about its validity tend to be counterproductive.
When dealing with other believers, I have found it a far more efficient use of time to simply just get into the word and let it convince them of its own veracity.
When dealing with immature believer’s, believers who have been discipled by churches who hold more to the world’s views than to God’s, with non-believers, or with those openly antagonistic to the things of God saying “It is true because it says it is true” is circular and does nothing but place a stumbling block in their path.
Given the way you posted, I’m willing to bet that if you saw someone using a similar reasoning pattern in something you found questionable you would catch it quickly.
A different example of circular reasoning:
The layer of earth that fossil was found in was laid down millions of years ago so that fossil we found in it must be millions of years old and if the fossil is that old, then the layer of earth it was found in must be millions of years old.
Craig,
Your response apparently ignored much of my post and imputed things that I did not say. Do feel that I should treat your posts the same way? If I do, there will be no room for discussion and possibly eventual fellowship.
It will only become a repetition the many ritualized and generally non-productive responses we see all over the net and in the dying churches across this country.
I try to consider the whole of what people say without addition and ask for the same consideration.
Some questions for all of us to consider (Joshua 1:8, psalm 77:12, psalm 119:15):
1. If the bible is without error then why are there so many translations within the same base languages (English, Spanish, etc…)?
2. If the bible is complete, then what is the point of all the commentaries, studies, and sermons that expound on what it says?
3. What do we do when the bible is taken from us (especially a new believer who hasn’t had time to take it to heart)?
4. What does an illiterate person or a person who cannot get a translation in a language they can read do with it?
5. How did the first church prosper without so much of what we now as the bible?
6. How can a new believer know they have a valid version as opposed to a feminist bible, a witness bible, a kanye bible, etc…?
Food for thought, and the kind of things that I have found many new believers who are just beginning to dig into the word ask.
No. I am not trying to bait an argument (Did I understand you correctly?). I am trying to promote thought. The bible tells us to meditate/think on the things of God and things that are good.It seems like you are trying to b8 an argument m8.
I agree.No. I am not trying to bait an argument (Did I understand you correctly?). I am trying to promote thought. The bible tells us to meditate/think on the things of God and things that are good.
I have just seen such responses to questions or potentially differing thoughts too many times. It is more common in those with religious hearts whether the religion they hold dear is a doctrine, a sport, a teacher, a book, a person, or anything else.
There is an unspoken (usually) assumption that one who would ask or broach such questions or thoughts is some sort of heathen, heritic, ignoramus, or weakling. With that assumption comes a trained, dismissive, or antagonistic response that most are not even aware of until they are on the recieving end.
This is very easy to see if you ever get involved in any kind of discussion involving politics or the subjects that are currently banned on this sight.
In most cases, when the dismissive person actually focuses on listening more than on responding, they'll understand or begin to understand where the person they dismissed was going with the question/thought.
That listening is one of the key responses in creating disciples, and it is something that Jesus demonstrated. That listening makes it easier to get to the heart of a person and bypass the trained responses.
This is what I see throughout scripture and in my own experience.
Eric, I am new here, so I can't speak for CFS. However, I am not new to forums - I ran my own for 5 years. I can tell you from experience that the problem is not in attempting to spark dialog and getting people to think. The problem is when you are questioning the very foundations of their belief. The very first line in the CFS Statement of Beliefs says "The Holy Scriptures, in it's original form, is the inerrant Word of God." There are some things that can be talked about and questioned until both sides are blue in the face. But the very tenets of our faith cannot be questioned. There simply is no room for discussion. Things like the Bible being the infallible word of God, that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, and rose again on the third day - these beliefs are what makes us Christians. We can't allow any doubt about them to creep in.No. I am not trying to bait an argument (Did I understand you correctly?). I am trying to promote thought. The bible tells us to meditate/think on the things of God and things that are good.
I have just seen such responses to questions or potentially differing thoughts too many times. It is more common in those with religious hearts whether the religion they hold dear is a doctrine, a sport, a teacher, a book, a person, or anything else.
There is an unspoken (usually) assumption that one who would ask or broach such questions or thoughts is some sort of heathen, heritic, ignoramus, or weakling. With that assumption comes a trained, dismissive, or antagonistic response that most are not even aware of until they are on the recieving end.
This is very easy to see if you ever get involved in any kind of discussion involving politics or the subjects that are currently banned on this sight.
In most cases, when the dismissive person actually focuses on listening more than on responding, they'll understand or begin to understand where the person they dismissed was going with the question/thought.
That listening is one of the key responses in creating disciples, and it is something that Jesus demonstrated. That listening makes it easier to get to the heart of a person and bypass the trained responses.
This is what I see throughout scripture and in my own experience.
Yes, I think you are right. The purpose of a forum like this is to see, think about it and challenge yourself and then post a useful reply. I have noticed on a number of forums that communication actually breaks down. I can also be guilty here.No. I am not trying to bait an argument (Did I understand you correctly?). I am trying to promote thought. The bible tells us to meditate/think on the things of God and things that are good.
I have just seen such responses to questions or potentially differing thoughts too many times. It is more common in those with religious hearts whether the religion they hold dear is a doctrine, a sport, a teacher, a book, a person, or anything else.
There is an unspoken (usually) assumption that one who would ask or broach such questions or thoughts is some sort of heathen, heritic, ignoramus, or weakling. With that assumption comes a trained, dismissive, or antagonistic response that most are not even aware of until they are on the recieving end.
This is very easy to see if you ever get involved in any kind of discussion involving politics or the subjects that are currently banned on this sight.
In most cases, when the dismissive person actually focuses on listening more than on responding, they'll understand or begin to understand where the person they dismissed was going with the question/thought.
That listening is one of the key responses in creating disciples, and it is something that Jesus demonstrated. That listening makes it easier to get to the heart of a person and bypass the trained responses.
This is what I see throughout scripture and in my own experience.