Moving of the Water John 5:1-

[crossnote]

John 5:1-4 NKJV
After this there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. [2] Now there is in Jerusalem by the Sheep Gate a pool, which is called in Hebrew, Bethesda, having five porches. [3] In these lay a great multitude of sick people, blind, lame, paralyzed, waiting for the moving of the water. [4] For an angel went down at a certain time into the pool and stirred up the water; then whoever stepped in first, after the stirring of the water, was made well of whatever disease he had.

Was this 'stirring of the water' by an angel folk lore? Was it true? Can you prove your assertion either way?

 

[LearningToLetGo]

Was this 'stirring of the water' by an angel folk lore? Was it true? Can you prove your assertion either way?

According to William Barclay: "Beneath the pool there was a subterranean stream which every now and again bubbled up and disturbed the waters. The belief was that the disturbance was caused by an angel, and that the first person to get into the pool after the troubling of the water would be healed from any illness from which he was suffering." (The Gospel of John, Volume 1, page 178)

 

[crossnote]

According to William Barclay: "Beneath the pool there was a subterranean stream which every now and again bubbled up and disturbed the waters. The belief was that the disturbance was caused by an angel, and that the first person to get into the pool after the troubling of the water would be healed from any illness from which he was suffering." (The Gospel of John, Volume 1, page 178)

I'm usually a bit leery when natural explanations are given for supernatural events, (sniffs of a theological liberal). Did Mr. Barclay give any evidence for his 'subterranean' belief?

 

[LearningToLetGo]

Did Mr. Barclay give any evidence for his 'subterranean' belief?

Unfortunately no, he did not footnote that particular item.

 

[Musicmaster]

That legend the Jews believed in sounds like modern day kids walking along the sidewalk avoiding cracks and seams...just in case they break their mother's back...

MM

 

[bobinfaith]

John 5:1-4 NKJV
After this there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. [2] Now there is in Jerusalem by the Sheep Gate a pool, which is called in Hebrew, Bethesda, having five porches. [3] In these lay a great multitude of sick people, blind, lame, paralyzed, waiting for the moving of the water. [4] For an angel went down at a certain time into the pool and stirred up the water; then whoever stepped in first, after the stirring of the water, was made well of whatever disease he had. Was this 'stirring of the water' by an angel folk lore? Was it true? Can you prove your assertion either way?

Good morning, crossnote;

Can I ask, what led you to post this Scripture, and what is your assertion of the 'stirring of the water'? Do you believe either way whether this was true?

God bless you, brother, and thank you.

Bob

 

[Major]

John 5:1-4 NKJV
After this there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. [2] Now there is in Jerusalem by the Sheep Gate a pool, which is called in Hebrew, Bethesda, having five porches. [3] In these lay a great multitude of sick people, blind, lame, paralyzed, waiting for the moving of the water. [4] For an angel went down at a certain time into the pool and stirred up the water; then whoever stepped in first, after the stirring of the water, was made well of whatever disease he had.

Was this 'stirring of the water' by an angel folk lore? Was it true? Can you prove your assertion either way?

I have used that Scripture several times.

The "feast: mention here is probably the feast of Pentecost. I say that because there are 3 great feasts of the Jews.
Since in John 2 we find the Passover and in John 7 is the Feats of Tabernacles so it seems by deduction it is The feast of Pentecost.

Anyway......IMHO, many psychological cures took place there. There are just as many people today who have sick minds, and are ignorant and superstitious as there were then.

Those people go to "faith healers" or that touch their TV and send a check to a man who claims to be a healer.

However, ALL stories come from somewhere so I am of the opinion that at one time, years before this Scriptures, someone really did go into that pool and claimed to be healed. There is no other reason to explain why lame people would be lieing there.

Now.....the point however is that that man had been lame for 38 years. Makes one wonder if he had been lieing there 38 years??????

Was he the worst case there????? I would think so as he is the one John mentions.

However, it was his own sin that got him there no matter how long he had been there as verse 14 says............
"Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee."

Can you imagine lieing there looking and waiting for the water to stir??????

Then, he was in such a bad condition that there was allways going to be someone that beat him to the water.

The point and application here is that there are so many people today just like this man who are sitting around waiting for something to happen.

Think of the countless people sitting in churches just waiting for something to happen, a sweeping revival or a miracle healing or a special individual so that they can latch onto "SOMETHING" instead of the real thing which is the Lord Jesus Christ.........and it was on the Sabbeth!

BUT......notice verse #9 what happened when that man focused on Jesus! Then Jesus told him to GO TO CHURCH!

 

[crossnote]

BUT......notice verse #9 what happened when that man focused on Jesus! Then Jesus told him to GO TO CHURCH!

I was tracking your post until here...

John 5:8-9 CSB
"Get up," Jesus told him, "pick up your mat and walk." [9] Instantly the man got well, picked up his mat, and started to walk. Now that day was the Sabbath,

I don't see a Church or Synagogue or Temple in miles. (kidding also)

 

[crossnote]

Good morning, crossnote;

Can I ask, what led you to post this Scripture, and what is your assertion of the 'stirring of the water'? Do you believe either way whether this was true?

God bless you, brother, and thank you.

Bob

My wife would say it's not a myth, because some would say 'it's just a myth' or they would tell her the translation is wrong/missing in some of the texts.

 

[forgiven61]

I don't see a Church or Synagogue in miles.

it has nothing to do with either building mentioned in the above. in fact imo placing emphasis on them takes away the miracle Christ performed . yes i have no other choice to take it at face value. other wise i would have go through the scriptures and cherry pick what i thought was real and not real . no i cant prove the virgin birth either or the resurrection . the scripture says the Just shall live by faith. my faith may need boosting in many area . but in this i accept as truth

 

[crossnote]

it has nothing to do with either building mentioned in the above. in fact imo placing emphasis on them takes away the miracle Christ performed . yes i have no other choice to take it at face value. other wise i would have go through the scriptures and cherry pick what i thought was real and not real . no i cant prove the virgin birth either or the resurrection . the scripture says the Just shall live by faith. my faith may need boosting in many area . but in this i accept as truth

My wife says "Thank you Jerry." (I would lean that way myself.)

 

[Major]

I was tracking your post until here...

John 5:8-9 CSB
"Get up," Jesus told him, "pick up your mat and walk." [9] Instantly the man got well, picked up his mat, and started to walk. Now that day was the Sabbath,

I don't see a Church or Synagogue or Temple in miles. (kidding also)

My apologies............John 5:14 .......
"Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee."

Matthew Henry---Barnes-----Benson all agree , "The same day, probably, in which he was healed, whither, it is likely, he had repaired to return thanks to God for his signal recovery. "

 

[Major]

My wife would say it's not a myth, because some would say 'it's just a myth' or they would tell her the translation is wrong/missing in some of the texts.

Most "myths" have a genesis of what someone once thought was a truth. Time and perspective changes that.

One time one day someone knew that a SAW a big shaggy bear walking around in the woods. From that came what we now call the Big Foot which is actually nothing but an exaggeration of a perceived truth.

“a great number of disabled people used to lie [there]—the blind, the lame, the paralyzed” (John 5:3) tells us that there was a legend that people believed.

The Legend had it that an angel would come down into the pool and “stir up the water.” The first person into the pool after the stirring of the water “was made well from whatever disease with which he was afflicted”. Interestingly, The Bible does not teach that this actually happened—and John 5:4 is not included in most modern translations because it is unlikely to be original to the text—rather, the superstitious belief probably arose because of the pool’s association with the nearby temple.