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A question about John 12:27.

Discussion in 'Bible Study' started by Ahmed, Feb 14, 2008.

  1. A question about John 12:27.


    I have a question about this one, " Now my heart is troubled, and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour? No, it was for this very reason I came to this hour. Father, glorify your name!

    Did jesus pray that he would not be crucified? that our sins wouldn't be put on him? or did he not pray?

    God bless.
  2. He prayed that if there was ANY other way, that God would provide Him a way out. But, He also showed willingness to do His Father's will.
  3. What Banarenth said. :)

    Actually, the particular verse that you posted about, from my understanding, is more about Jesus telling of his coming death. If you look at Matthew 26:36 onward, there you can see where Jesus was in the garden and prayed that if there was another way that God would provide it. But, as Banarenth said, Jesus was still willing to do his father's will.

    The thing to always keep in mind was that Jesus was still human. God in the flesh. Jesus dealt with the same things that all humans deal with. If you knew you had to die, would you be so eager? It is easy for people to say "yes" until they are actually faced with it. Crucifixion was not an easy death by any means. It isn't as though they were going to just put a bullet in his head, or administer lethal injection, or any number of other more humane ways of ending the life of another. Crucifixion was a relatively slow death. I believe that it is human nature to want a way out if you know death is near. Our survival instincts kick in. So, it is only natural that Jesus would ask God if there was any other way then let that happen. But there wasn't.
  4. Jesus faced a terrible task. Not only torture, cruxifiction and finally death but He faced being seperated from His Father for the first time ever. As He bore our sin the Father would not look upon that sin until the debt was paid. I believe that was the most painful part Jesus faced. He walked in human flesh and felt pain just like us, the wieght of the sins of all humanity was a daunting task yet He did it out of love for you and me.
  5. You bet Jesus wanted to avoid the cross. He was human. But He was also the Son of God and knew what He had to do. When He was in the desert being tempted. All of the temptations that the devil through at Him would have gotten Him out of having to go to the cross.
    The bottom line is Jesus did it for you and me. He loved each of us that He shed His perfect blood for our stupid sins. We are not worthy of what He did for us.
  6. I did not read it completely through so please explain the problem or problems you have with it.
    I am not saying I disagree with your feelings, I may want to check it out a little deeper myself.
  7. I didn't read the whole thing either, but here is one example.

    We would explain the Garden prayer in this way: Father, I cannot fulfill my destiny at the cross if I am not revived here in the Garden. As I have my entire life, I ask this to be accomplished by your power, not my own. And, in fact, God did answer Christ's prayer, sustained him in the Garden by means of angels, and preserved him alive to face his crucifixion to save us from our sins.

    I think Christ new that his destiny was at the cross. He knew that He would go there. Therefore, He couldn't have been killed in the garden. Then He asked if there were any other way. I think having one of the guards kill Him with a sword in the garden would have been more humane than what He had to endure for our sins.
  8. I befriended a reverend in the past who has since moved on. He was a good friend, and this was something that he always talked with me about, I don't know. I think it was just one of his favorite subjects.

    Jesus, as the Son of God, knew what was coming. It wasn't just death, but the punishment for the sins of all mankind. Each lashing would be a lashing for countless numbers of sins. The pain would be unbareable, and it would happen over and over and over again. It would have a supernatural quality to it, becoming drawn out and the man holding the whip would receive extra strength and stamina from God Himself. There would be no other purpose for the man with the whip, anywhere in the universe, except to beat Jesus to supernatural pain.

    This isn't pain that you or I would feel if we were whipped with the same whip. This was the sacrifice, the Lamb of God. A pure heart, the Blood of God, spilling as punishment for us. The sins for all mankind would be paid for with this beating. With this death.

    Jesus knew that was coming, and he was scared. He was so full of love for us and His Father, he was scared. He was nothing but Love. To face such a judgment for us, he knew that for it to pay for all of mankind's sins, the punishment had to fit the crime. The punishment had to fit the crime. The punishment had to fit the crimes.

    Being innocent of any crimes, Jesus asked if there was another way for this to happen...Let this cup pass from me. That's what he wanted. But at the same time, with the same prayer, he said that it wasn't his (Jesus) will that must be done, but his Father's (God's) will that must be done.

    He was telling his Father that he was afraid, scared to go through with this because he knew that it was going to be supernatural pain. But he would do it, because it was God's will. God's plan. God's love for us.

    Pretty amazing, isn't He?:)
  9. Jesus showed he was a man with feelings and free will,and not a computer.Jesus did this for us.also any arguements in later time would be unfounded,like God is a robot etc.clever our God you know.:)
  10. This was a part of what drew me to make Jesus My Lord, His follow thru in the face of unspeakable misery. After what He went thru, willingly, just for me, how could I do otherwise?

    I Stand At The Cross

    I stand at the Cross in awestruck wonder.
    Fingering the bloodsoaked wood,
    One question echoes thru my mind...
    Why did it have to be THIS way?

    Quietly, gently, the answer came to me...
    He said "Would you say that it took
    Alot of strength and courage
    To see it,
    Face it,
    Follow thru with it?


    Would you be able to worship a God
    Who did NOT have that strength and courage?


    Would you say that it took
    Alot of love to follow thru with it?


    That is how much I love you!

    I stand at the Cross in awestruck wonder.
    Fingering the blood soaked wood,
    One word reverberates thru my heart...
  11. Hi people-

    I suggest, before we believe Jesus was afraid to die, read Matt. 26:52-54.

    At the start of His Ministry, Jesus clearly states why He was here. He knew and was not afraid to die for us. "Think not that I have come to destroy the Law or the Prophets, but to fulfill them."

    Secondly- What Jesus feared in Gethsemane was not dieing on thecross, but because during His earnest Prayer, sweat as it were blood, started coming out. He did not want Satn to take his life before His reason for being here was accomplished- Matt. 26:54, 56.

    Jesus, as God in the flesh was never afraid of dieing for us, or He is not my Jesus, it would be a fake one.

    Right, Jesus was a man, but God declares of Himself He is love, so Jesus would demonstrate love, compassion, plus more of the Father's attributes, being the "Son of God"- ("I and My Father are one"), The Word as with God and in God since the beginning and was God made manifest in the flesh.

    And while Jesus was not a computer, He still totally adhered to "My Father's Will". Not His Will, but God the Father's Will.

    Think about this as well- Since Jesus knew He would eventually die for our sins, why still, should He fear what he would endure, knowing God the Father intends and will raise Him up and bring Him back to Heaven after that?

    I have had no more fear of death myself, since it sank into my heart Paul's stating it is gain to die, for we shall be with the Lord and away from the sin and strife of this tainted world. We can't kill ourselves to do this, but we should still embrace death and not fear it knowing the future we have. As Paul declares too- but apparently its not my time as yet, for the Lord appears to have more for me to accomplish in this life.

    I pray this helps-

    God Bless!!
  12. I agree with Bo, this great fear was separation from the Father for the first time because taking on the sins of the world, the Father could not abide. Is that why the sky became black in the middle of the day? Because God turned His eyes away? Interesting.
  13. Thank you all! I understood it now.

    God bless.
  14. Ahmed my brother, you will find that this place has Christians from litteraly all over the globe. Each from different backgrounds , with different ideas and teachings. What you will find in common in each of us is a genuine love for God and each other. We love Jesus and He is our Lord. We may be different in some ways but we each make up a part of the beautiful church of the Lord Jesus Christ. When we walk togeather in unity we fulfill the will of God. We all need each other!

    Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
    Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

    Much love in Jesus Name, brother Larry.
  15. Ahmed, when you have spent much more time in studying God's Word, you will see that both the Old and New Testaments are filled with PARABLE teachings. Parables were used in the original manuscript texts to explain things to the common people of the day, in terms that they would understand based upon their limited education and their observations of life around them.

    Christ used a great number of Parable Teachings in His ministry and whenever we see these in the writings of the Disciples and Prophets, we see exactly how He carefully planned His words to teach the people about His Gospel.

    Our Savior also taught to His very last breath. When he said, "Eli, Eli, Lamma Sabacthani" (My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?) while He was on the cross, He was TEACHING. Remember the opening line from Psalm 22 (KJV)? That Psalm was written by King David roughly 1000 years before Christ walked the earth in His human form. Psalm 22 (KJV) prophesyed the Crusifixion 10 centuries before it actually took place, and Christ was reminding everyone present at His crucifixion that it was indeed, prophesy being fulfilled.

    Recognizing and understanding Parable Teachings can be difficult for a new Bible student, but once you can recognize these and mentally place yourself into the time period of the original writings, you can get a much better grasp on what is being said. Using a Strong's Concordance to sort through the Hebrew, Aramaic and 'street' Greek word uses in the Parables will also assist you in your understanding.

    May God bless you in your studies and research.
  16. Thank you, Pastor. A blessing, as always.

    Hey - I learned on TV from Pastor Arnold Murray that "pastor" came from the agricultural term for the One who watches the pasture.

    Never knew that before - never linked in my noggin before. I thought it was fascinating! I sat there lipping the words over and over again, it tickled me that deeply.

  17. "The One Who Watches The Pasture" is an excellent way of putting it. The origin wording is closer to "one who feeds the flock" - in other words, a Pastor freely provides the Word of God to those who ask for knowledge... a Pastor is a "teacher of God's Word.

    Thank you for your kind comments. :)
  18. i completely agree

    this shows a sign of Jesus's temptations because He was a man
    no man wants to go through a ten hour torture just to die

    I think all Jesus was saying was God I am no wanting this to happen but I will be obiediant and will go through with it so keep me strong my Father.

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