Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by geralduk, Aug 31, 2015.

  1. What are words?
    If not the expressions of thought and ones self .
    "In the beginning was the Word "

    Words express that which was once hidden .But the nature of words is such that they have to be spoken one word at a time and that you have to listen to all that is spoken to understand the thought that is being expressed.
    "In the beginning God created the heaveN and the earth "
    Its a statement of fact . That God created the visible and the invisible. The heaven where His throne is and all therein and the earth.
    But while it is a statement of fact that God created all things .Both visible and invisible.
    It is not until He spoke that you get the first perception of what God is like .
    For it was not heaven that was in darkness but the earth .
    "For heaven needed no sun or moon for God is the light thereof "
    and it was not God that needed light , but man .
    "For God is light and in Him there is no darkness nor shadow of turning"
    We read that "the EARTH (not heaven) was without form and void and darkness was upon the face of the deep" and the Spirit of God moved upon (or brooded) the face of the waters .
    THEN ....................... God said "let there be light " and there was light .
    God always brings light before he begins a work. In creation or in a mans heart.
    For it is also written that "God commanded the light to shine in our hearts"
    God is light .
    and when he saw the darkness he commanded that the light shine in the darkness "and the darkness comprehended it not "
    God has never taken back those words .
    When God opened the door of the gospel to be preached to all the world. He has never taken back that either and no one can close it .
    Words .
    Mathew 12:36 " But I say unto you that every idle word that men shall speak ,they shall give account thereof in the day of judgement "
    What is an "idle word"?
    if not a word that does no work. it is idle .
    If then we will give an account of our idle works ,what then of our words that do some work?
    "My Word that goeth forth out of my mouth shall not return unto me void but shall accomplish that where unto I sent it"
    Many of the words that we speak we are the father of them.
    But Jesus said "The words that I speak are not my own words but the Father who is in me he doeth the works"
    and in another place as the Father tells me so i speak .
    Or what the father taught me so teach I you.
    The greatest work we can do is preach the gospel .
    When Jesus said after that the Holy Ghost has come go ye into all the world and preach the gospel,starting first in Jerusalem and then onwards and outwards to the utter most parts of the earth .
    But they did not .They all stayed in Jerusalem .So God sent persecution which scattered them to all the four corners of the world (even the UK) and as they went they preached the gospel .
    Its a bit like when God said to Noah go out into all the world and replenish it . But they found a nice valley and said let us stay here and make a name for ourselves and build a tower up to heaven .
    But God came down and scattered them to the four corners of the world and when the 'west' went out to discover the world wherever they found a place where men could live.There they found men already .

    in Christ
    KingJ likes this.
  2. WORDS.
    With words a loving mother can comfort a sick child and sooth their fears .
    With words a father can correct an erring son and reproof a disobedient one .
    With words ,Adolph Hitler called to the most base things in man and to his generation and promised them the world and what they wanted to hear .
    With words Winston Churchill called to his generation to higher things than they thought capable of doing but were inspired to do .
    "If any man heareth my words and doeth them not ,I will liken them unto a foolish man who built his house upon sand and the rains came and the wind blew and the floods came and beat against that house and the house fell and great was the fall of it .
    If any man heareth my words and doeth them ,I will liken him unto a wise man that DUG DEEP and built his house upon a rock and the rains descended and the floods came and the wind blew and it fell not because it was built upon a rock " Mathew 27.
    In a very very very,small measure and in a very very ,very little likeness what was the nature of Adolph Hitlers words and what was the nature of Winston Churchills words? and which house stood and which house fell?
    and which work did each mans words do?

    Hitler gave his generation what they wanted .
    What people want and what people need are too often two very different things .
    If you get what you want ,but do not get what you need ,You will rejoice at first but in the end weep bitter tears .
    If you get what you need but do not get what you want ,you may well weep in the beginning but in the end you will thank almighty God you got what you needed but not what you wanted .
    Happy glad and free is the man who wants what he needs.

    Churchill gave what the people needed to hear . Which they did not want at first .
    God has promised to meet our every need . Not our every want.
    When he said "seek ye first the kingdom of God and HIS righteousness and all things shall be added unto you" it does not mean he will give you whatever you want as some have thought .
    But in relation to the first two things all things will be added to you to fulfill the requirements of the kingdom of God and his righteousness and therefor what is needed shall be added unto you .

    in Christ
  3. WORDS:
    written on the floor of the lobby between both houses of the palace of Westminster or of Parliament of great Britain are the words of scripture .
    "Unless God builds the house the builders build in vain "
    The truth is not democratic . For it is not upheld ,undermined or established by how many people 'vote ' for it . Which is one reason but not the only reason why we have an unelected monarch on the throne of England.
    For while she is no empty headed wooden figuerhead ;if she is a symbol of any thing or rather a foreshadow it is of the fact that the truth must sit on the throne and reign and not another .
    But the truth is no tyrant either and a man can deny the truth or not believe it .

    The laws of physics and the principles of aerodynamics are not of man but of God .They are greater than man for man cannot change them as he is also subject to them.
    He can by his 'democracy ' or majority say "we do not do God" and reject the laws and principles of God and say "we will build a plane according to our laws and according to our principles and in our image .The truth is not a tyrant you are at liberty to do so .
    BUT while you may have the liberty to build such a 'plane' you will not have the liberty to fly .
    You may by your majority and agreement build such a plane and get every one to push it down the runway and they will indeed by their efforts have the plane move and with a lot of effort get it moving faster . But it will not fly .
    and at the end all will be exhausted .
    Then some will say let us make laws that will impose upon all that they must help us to push the plane and let it be that if they do not they will be punished. They will by such laws get a greater unity and more people to push it down the runway and it will go much faster . But it will still not fly or can .and all will be exhausted.
    Then it will be said let us get some air under it and let us push it over a cliff and let us make more laws that on pain of death all must push and if any say it cannot fly will be put to death.
    Then will there be a greater unity and a faster plane down the runway and it will go over the cliff with a 1000 foot drop.
    But it still will not fly and all who are in it will perish.
    "Unless God builds the house , the builders build in vain"

    in Christ
  4. Proverbs 25:11..........
    "A word spoken at the right time is like apples of gold in settings of silver".
  5. Proverbs 18:21
    Parallel Verses
    New International Version
    The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love it will eat its fruit.

    New Living Translation
    The tongue can bring death or life; those who love to talk will reap the consequences.

    English Standard Version
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those who love it will eat its fruits.

    New American Standard Bible
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, And those who love it will eat its fruit.

    King James Bible
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    Holman Christian Standard Bible
    Life and death are in the power of the tongue, and those who love it will eat its fruit.

    International Standard Version
    The power of the tongue is life and death— those who love to talk will eat what it produces.

    NET Bible
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those who love its use will eat its fruit.

    Aramaic Bible in Plain English
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and he that loves it will eat from its fruit.

    GOD'S WORD® Translation
    The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love to talk will have to eat their own words.

    JPS Tanakh 1917
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue; And they that indulge it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    New American Standard 1977
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue,
    And those who love it will eat its fruit.

    Jubilee Bible 2000
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those that love it shall eat its fruit.

    King James 2000 Bible
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    American King James Version
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    American Standard Version
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue; And they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    Douay-Rheims Bible
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue: they that love it, shall eat the fruits thereof.

    Darby Bible Translation
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    English Revised Version
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue; and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

    Webster's Bible Translation
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit of it.

    World English Bible
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue; those who love it will eat its fruit.

    Young's Literal Translation
    Death and life are in the power of the tongue, And those loving it eat its fruit.
  6. God speaking everything into existence is very interesting. With 4d printing we can have an idea of how that can work. But it is truly amazing to think that God can speak a universe, life and a spirit into existence. God can speak a creation into existence that can create a voice activated 4d printer. Interesting to see how man is in the image of God on technology, but at a really really low level.

    The scripture on our words spoken always makes me wonder on the time it takes for our thoughts to become words. Imagine if life and death was in the power of our thoughts. God has given us a filter on our words. We must use it. I guess that's why scripture says 'a fool utters all his mind' Prov 29:11.
  7. I reject the idea,thought , concept ,immaculate conception that God needs a multitude of versions to record or speak his mind on a matter . and even IF (they dont) they all said the same thing I would not hold that they would establish what was true .For the truth is not democratic.
    and if in parts they seem to agree .So does a stopped watch agree with the time twice a day.
    so while in part they might well agree with the truth .In others they have rejected or denied the truth and in some places" changed the truth into a lie"

    in Christ
  8. What I find more interesting is not so much how he did it (unfathomable?) but HOW he said it .
    "Let there be light "
    I do not believe for a moment he spoke as some of these false prophets speak with a great performance and a booming voice. Made to impress. or with sweating brow with some one dabbing the sweat off their forehead for him.
    For apart from his own character would not do such a thing he had no one to impress . Nor anyone to hear .
    It would be worth considering what langauge he spoke as well.
    I once spoke to a Moslem who once declared that only the Koran in Arabic is the Word of God .
    Surprised I asked him if he ahd been lying to me as he spoke to me? He replied "No" then I asked him if the book in his hand which on one side had the Koran in Arabic and on the other the translation of the page if that was lying as well? He replied no.
    Then I said if what you said was true ,is God therefore an Arab? he replied "no"!
    I asked then if he was an Englishman? for I think we used to think he might have been . He replied no again. then asked if God was Chinese , etc etc etc .
    Then I answered are they not all mans languages? and if that is so .God not being a man they believed must have his own langauge as it were.
    Is it not written that "God humbles himself to speak to men"?
    If God has his own language then the message never changes for it si that which goes forth out of His mouth and giveth life or is "the bread of life".
    It is then the accuracy of the translation that is important not the langauge it is translated into.
    I can think of 4 or 5 reasons why we could have as many versions .
    There is a message from God designed to bless and free a man .me! for instance.
    The message needs to be translated .
    1) the man doing the message does not like me and so will change the message because he does not want me to be free or blessed.
    2) He did not understand the message and for pride sake gives the message he thinks was right .
    3) He does not like God and for his hatred sake will not translate the message as it should be.
    4) There is money to be made if he can get me to believe that I have to pay him or be in servitude to him to get the message . So he will translate the message accordingly .
    5) He neither loves man or loves God nor believes there is God .

    in Christ
    KingJ likes this.
  9. Yes, it is quite mind blowing when we grasp the bible sitting on our table is God's word. The same words He used to create the universe. I agree, translation is everything.
  10. Hi there,

    The fact that we have God's Word written is in itself a miracle, I believe. Men have also died, for us to be able to read it for ourselves. They were branded heretics and horribly killed for wishing it to be translated into a language that the average man, of that age, could understand. We are blessed to have copies of our own, and to be able to read it, freely.

    * Yet, without the sacrifice of 'the Living Word', according to the will of God the Father, and the ministry of the Holy Spirit, we would not be able to understand it's message, or receive of it's bounty.

    Praise God for His wondrous grace!

    In Christ Jesus
    Fish Catcher Jim and KingJ say Amen and like this.
  11. What are you talking about?
  12. Why a long list of versions of the BIBLE
    in Christ

  13. Why not?
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  14. For the reason I said.
    God does not need a myriad of versions to speak his mind.
    But it does seem that man does .

    in Christ
  15. Men do for a variety of reasons. Some prefer a more literal translation, some like a translation that more accurately portrays the concepts in the scripture.
    Some like the antique language of the KJV, others really can't read it and need a modern translation. And then you have those that have their own versions that push an agenda, like the Jehovah's Witnesses and their Watchtower version.
    There is no problem with having multiple translations to server the diverse masses, as long as the translations are ACCURATE.

    Regardless of how accurate the translation, you'll still have people butchering the meaning. Seems to be a hobby with some folks these days.
    Euphemia and Fish Catcher Jim say Amen and like this.
  16. Gerald,
    You started a thread on words and began in the biginning with God Said.
    I added ONE piece of scripture - Proverbs 18-21
    I posted many translations of the same verse.
    Many people from all over are in here and neither of us know which translation they use.
    Some times a different translation words it a little different and it helps it click with the reader.

    So you your self wrote this very long reply to me and all you meant was why so many translations... Funny how that is. ;)

    God Bless and as Euphemia said...........why not ?
  17. So then are you writing to God or man in here ?
    Why the fuss over different translations ?
  18. Not to mention that the KJ version is not even 100 percent correct. I mean people fuss as if this is the only real version to use. They dont think about how this king james guy had his people re-write the bible in an easier way to study and it was this same king james who broke down the word of God and made chapters and verses. The Origional word of God did not have chapters.

    I mean think about this.......
    There Is One God - One Son - One Holy Spirit - One written word of God
    So why do we have a million and one doctrines and beliefs and rights and wrongs and rules and church fights and this is of God but God does not do this or that and yada yada yada.

    Come on now - we as the body of Christ should be united in understanding of His word and united in doing what His word says to do.

    Oh yea I forgot - our enemy that defeated foe that goes around leading brethren here and there in their thought life. OUCH.......
    God Bless
    Euphemia likes this.
  19. Ahh, but mankind needs it. God has been supremely generous in His varied ways He meets us, and He uses gifted men and women to produce various translations of the same scriptures to meet the spiritual needs of innumerable people. Why begrudge Him of that pleasure?
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  20. In all that you seem to expalin simply that people like to please themselves .
    The great trouble is that they are not accurate . Some omit some add and others render it absurd.
    This post is about words.
    and words are expressions of thought are they not?
    The KJV is not antique langaue as you call it . For if Gods thoughts are higher than our thoughts would not the expression of his thinking be of a higher order?
    I see nothing then to commend anybody to bring the Word of God to modern mans idioms and forms of expression.
    Indeed how can a man be transformed by the renewal of his mind if he seeks simply to reduce everything to his own experience and modern parlance ?
    The Jehovas Witness agenda is the same as every work of that arch deceiver .To use the Word of God to lead men away from God.
    I would agree with your last statement insofar as it will happen till the Lord comes.
    "For sin must come but woe to him by whom it comes " But why give space and room for the devil you can drive a tank through?
    The devil has always used scripture or the Word of God and its one of his favourite methods.
    He used it tempting Eve and he used it tempting Christ .
    It is written that in the last days things will get so bad so deceptive so subtle(?) "that if it was possible even the very elect would be deceived"
    In that list of versions there was very little difference between them but they were different . what criteria then do you choose one over the other ? The oen you feel is right more than the other>?
    if you were right why have another?
    if you are wrong how can you tell? and if you are then why the one you chose?

    When the Spirit of truth shall come he will elad us into all truth and he has come to abide . and by Him "we know the spirit of error "
    There is the BODY of truth which is scripture and there is the Spirit of truth.
    What knoweth the things of men save the spirit that is in man ,likewise then what knoweth the things of God save the Spirit of God"?
    is it not written He knoweth the mind of God and the deep things of God?
    If then the Word of God was inspired by the Spirit of God according to the mind of God.
    Why then a myriad of versions? all pertaining to be the Word of God ? and all of them a little or much different from each other .
    You then can understand my concern and my post about the list.

    in Christ

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