Will God and Jesus ever stop loving me? Can someone lose their salvation while on earth?

Fish Catcher Jim said:
Major..........that was a good try but you kind of got over in the ditch with this.
It was not once sad that satan can read our minds......You added this.........
satan throws a thought your way and watches how you respond by either words or actions and then will feed you another.

Scripture tells us to take every thought captive and make it line up with Gods word.
God Bless you Major.............
I need to go
Click to expand...

God bless you my brother but once again you have not read my comments correctly. Actually it is you that once again have ADDED to what was said.

I did not say that Satan could read the minds of men!!! I said exactly this.................
"If he cannot see into the minds of men, then it follows he is not able to insert thoughts into men either. All the way through the Bible we find Satan tempting mankind by manipulating the situation men find themselves in and by encouraging men to consider sinful things by playing on man's desires as wee see in James 1:13-16.
 
Fish Catcher Jim said:
Major I have no clue who these peoole are and dont really have an intrest in what they said.
Yes I do know who K. Copeland and what you quoted from him as false.........
The quote you listed
“Faith activates the force of God fear is a force that activates the Devil. Copeland says, God did not create the world out of nothing, He used the Force of His Faith.'

Faith activates or moves God and fear moves or activates the devil........Sounds correct to me...............

For the other dispute............are you saying God does not have Faith ?
Lets clear this up and move on to the next........To many things to deal with at once.
Well at least for me......
Blessings my friend
Jim
Click to expand...

Jim..........WHY would I make a false comment about such a thing that is so easy to prove????
Just to cause you to disagree????? THINK man! I am trying to open your eyes to truth and not my opinion.

What I posted is a direct word for word post of his words from the book HE wrote and I even gave you the name of the book and the page number!!!! YOU look it up. Don't believe me, you do the homework.
Why would you say that is a false comment??????
Have you read the book????
Did you look it up and research it as I did????

You are welcome to say that WHAT he said is a false comment and I agree totally with that, but to reject someone's own words simply to maintain an erroneous teaching is dangerous Jim. Very dangerous.
 
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CCW95A said:
The "new heart" can not sin for God's seed remains in the Christian, for it is Christ himself.

1 John 3:9.. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

There are two enemies as a Christian we face.

(1) The enemy without:
Eph 6:12.. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

(2) The enemy within:
2Co 10:3.. For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
2Co 10:4.. (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)
2Co 10:5.. Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Thoughts and imaginations belong to the physical mind. The "carnal" un rewed mind is the "enemy" of God because it is not subject to the laws of God.(Romans 8:7)

Does a Christian sin? Yes, but it is not his heart that sins but "sin" that is in his "flesh".

Rom 7:18.. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

Rom 7:20.. Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.


Click to expand...
And isn't that exactly what I said my dear brother????
 
Major said:
God bless you my brother but once again you have not read my comments correctly. Actually it is you that once again have ADDED to what was said.

I did not say that Satan could read the minds of men!!! I said exactly this.................
"If he cannot see into the minds of men, then it follows he is not able to insert thoughts into men either. All the way through the Bible we find Satan tempting mankind by manipulating the situation men find themselves in and by encouraging men to consider sinful things by playing on man's desires as wee see in James 1:13-16.
Click to expand...
Satan can place thoughts within man, but he has no idea what man is thinking, except by man's reactions to these thoughts. No one knows the thoughts of a man except for the spirit of man that is in hum. (1 Cor 2:11)

Act 5:3 Peter asked, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill you with the idea that you could deceive the Holy Spirit? You've held back some of the money you received for the land. (ERV)

Act 5:3 Peter said, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill your mind with such an idea? You kept part of the money for yourself and lied about it to the Holy Spirit!(GW)

Act 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?(KJV)
 
CCW95A said:
Satan can place thoughts within man, but he has no idea what man is thinking, except by man's reactions to these thoughts. No one knows the thoughts of a man except for the spirit of man that is in hum. (1 Cor 2:11)

Act 5:3 Peter asked, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill you with the idea that you could deceive the Holy Spirit? You've held back some of the money you received for the land. (ERV)

Act 5:3 Peter said, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill your mind with such an idea? You kept part of the money for yourself and lied about it to the Holy Spirit!(GW)

Act 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?(KJV)
Click to expand...

I am not sure what the point is you are trying to make. It seems that we are in agreement on this. You posted several verses and one of them was ...........

Act 5:3 Peter asked, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill you with the idea that you could deceive the Holy Spirit? You've held back some of the money you received for the land."

Those verses do not say that Satan was able to read the mind of those involved now does it???? They actually say...............
"why did you let Satan fill your mind with such an idea".

There is no Biblical evidence that the devil can read our minds. Knowing our thoughts is only attributed to God and never anyone else.
1 Chron. 28:9..............."For the Lord searches all hearts, and understands every intent of the thoughts."
Psalm 94:11................. "The Lord knows the thoughts of man, that they are a mere breath."
Matt. 9:4...................... "And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, 'Why are you thinking evil in your hearts?'"
Matt. 12:25..................."And knowing their thoughts He [Jesus] said to them, Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste;
and any city or house divided against itself shall not stand."
 
Major said:
I am not sure what the point is you are trying to make. It seems that we are in agreement on this. You posted several verses and one of them was ...........

Act 5:3 Peter asked, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill you with the idea that you could deceive the Holy Spirit? You've held back some of the money you received for the land."

Those verses do not say that Satan was able to read the mind of those involved now does it???? They actually say...............
"why did you let Satan fill your mind with such an idea".

There is no Biblical evidence that the devil can read our minds. Knowing our thoughts is only attributed to God and never anyone else.
1 Chron. 28:9..............."For the Lord searches all hearts, and understands every intent of the thoughts."
Psalm 94:11................. "The Lord knows the thoughts of man, that they are a mere breath."
Matt. 9:4...................... "And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, 'Why are you thinking evil in your hearts?'"
Matt. 12:25..................."And knowing their thoughts He [Jesus] said to them, Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste;
and any city or house divided against itself shall not stand."
Click to expand...
Did you read what I said?

Satan can place thoughts within man, but he has no idea what man is thinking, except by man's reactions to these thoughts. No one knows the thoughts of a man except for the spirit of man that is in hum. (1 Cor 2:11)
 
Major said:
I am not sure what the point is you are trying to make. It seems that we are in agreement on this. You posted several verses and one of them was ...........

Act 5:3 Peter asked, "Ananias, why did you let Satan fill you with the idea that you could deceive the Holy Spirit? You've held back some of the money you received for the land."

Those verses do not say that Satan was able to read the mind of those involved now does it???? They actually say...............
"why did you let Satan fill your mind with such an idea".

There is no Biblical evidence that the devil can read our minds. Knowing our thoughts is only attributed to God and never anyone else.
1 Chron. 28:9..............."For the Lord searches all hearts, and understands every intent of the thoughts."
Psalm 94:11................. "The Lord knows the thoughts of man, that they are a mere breath."
Matt. 9:4...................... "And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, 'Why are you thinking evil in your hearts?'"
Matt. 12:25..................."And knowing their thoughts He [Jesus] said to them, Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste;
and any city or house divided against itself shall not stand."
Click to expand...
No one has said anything about satan reading minds. So why keep bringing this up?
 
CCW95A said:
Did you read what I said?

Satan can place thoughts within man, but he has no idea what man is thinking, except by man's reactions to these thoughts. No one knows the thoughts of a man except for the spirit of man that is in hum. (1 Cor 2:11)
Click to expand...

Yes I did and that is why I said we are saying the same thing!!!
 
KingJ said:
This scripture is always on my mind when I do long trips :). I wonder how many can boast that they do not think immoral thoughts when they are idle.

This is advice for the brethren to keep their minds clean. As clean thoughts do not lead you into temptation. This is not suggesting that if someone doesn't feel right with God they must clean their thoughts and they will. Not feeling right with God requires harsher action then just cleaning the mind / meditiating on clean thoughts.

Paralleling this to brainwashing is like proposing someone who attends church regularly is saved.
Click to expand...
what is your obsession with using the term brainwashing? You keep applying it to far to many things and avoiding any real answer. You have a lot of cute little sayings but they dont always line up with scripture.

You say not feeling right with God needs or requires harsher action then renewing the mind.
- see renwing the mind is what was said and then you bring your brainwashing and such to replace this and try to turn it into something that was not said.

So in your words KJ - what is this harsher action required to get ones thinking in-line with the written word of God ?
What does re-newing the mind with Gods word mean KJ
Blessings
 
Fish Catcher Jim said:
No one has said anything about satan reading minds. So why keep bringing this up?
Click to expand...

Just so that that you are aware-----
"It was you in comment #102. YOU are the one who brought it into the conversation by saying........
"It was not once said that satan can read our minds......You added this.........".

To that I responded in comment #101 this ...........
"God bless you my brother but once again you have not read my comments correctly. Actually it is you that once again have ADDED to what was said.
I did not say that Satan could read the minds of men!!! I said exactly this.................
"If he cannot see into the minds of men, then it follows he is not able to insert thoughts into men either.
 
Major said:
Just so that that you are aware-----
"It was you in comment #102. YOU are the one who brought it into the conversation by saying........
"It was not once said that satan can read our minds......You added this.........".

To that I responded in comment #101 this ...........
"God bless you my brother but once again you have not read my comments correctly. Actually it is you that once again have ADDED to what was said.
I did not say that Satan could read the minds of men!!! I said exactly this.................
"If he cannot see into the minds of men, then it follows he is not able to insert thoughts into men either.
Click to expand...

Woaaaaaaaa lets slow down a pace here. lol
Major Yes you are correct I did say that.......
Here is why.........in your First reply towards it said that satan places thoughts in your mind - you wrote back about how he can not read minds.......I simply was saying something like this.
I did not say satan could read minds. You added this.....Another words brother you were the first to say one word about satan not being able to read minds as I and others had said he places thoughts in peoples minds........

So bro it is not that I did not get what you said. It is more along the lines of me not saying what I did - with it was you that said this - In A Much Clearer Way...........
My fault for not wording it better..........
Better ? ;)
Jim
 
The truth is in us forever Eph 1:13-14 NIV, 2 John 1:2 NIV,

and our seed is imperishable 1 Pet 1:23 NIV, 1 John 3:9 NIV.

The agape love of Christ will also never leave us Rom 8:35, 38-39 NIV.

Once we believe we have eternal life John 3:14-16 NIV, John 3:36 NIV, John 4:13-14 NIV, John 5:24 NIV, John 5:39-43 NIV, John 6:40 NIV, John 6:47 NIV, John 6:54 NIV, John 10:25-30 NIV, John 17:1-3 NIV, Acts 13:46-48 NIV, Rom 5:21 NIV, Rom 6:22-23 NIV, Eph 1:13-14 NIV, 2 Thess 2:16-17 NIV, 1 Tim 1:15-16 NIV, Tit 1:1-3 NIV, Tit 3:7 NIV, Heb 9:12 NIV, Heb 9:15 NIV, 1 John 1:1-4 NIV, 1 John 5:9-14 NIV, 1 John 5:20 NIV

All sins are covered Rom 4:7-8 NIV, Rom 6:10 NIV, Rom 8:38-39 ESV, 1 Cor 15:12-19 NIV, Col 2:13-15 NIV, Heb 7:23-25 NIV, Heb 7:27 NIV, Heb 9:12 NIV, Heb 9:24-28 NIV, Heb 10:10-12 NIV, 1 Pet 3:18 NIV
 
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We've been adopted into a family...John 8:34-36 NIV, Rom 8:15-17 NIV, Rom 8:23 NIV, Rom 9:4 NIV, Gal 4:4-7 NIV, Gal 6:10 NIV, Eph 1:4-5 NIV, Eph 2:19 NIV, 1 Pet 5:9 NIV

Jesus died for past, present and future sins...Rom 4:7-8 NIV, Rom 6:10 NIV, Rom 8:38-39 ESV, 1 Cor 15:12-19 NIV, Col 2:13-15 NIV, Heb 7:23-25 NIV, Heb 7:27 NIV, Heb 9:12 NIV, Heb 9:24-28 NIV, Heb 10:10-12 NIV, 1 Pet 3:18 NIV

We belong to Christ...John 8:34-36 NIV, John 8:44 NIV, Rom 1:6 NIV, Rom 8:9-11 NIV, Rom 14:8 NIV, 2 Cor 10:7 NIV, Gal 2:12 NIV, Gal 3:29 NIV, Gal 5:24 NIV, Gal 6:10 NIV, Heb 10:38-39 NIV, 1 John 2:19 NIV, 1 John 5:12 NIV

We are written in the book of life forever...Luke 10:18-20 NIV, Phil 4:3 NIV, Heb 12:22-24 NIV, Rev 3:5 NIV, Rev 13:8 NIV, Rev 17:8 NIV, Rev 20:12-15 NIV, Rev 21:27 NIV

There is now no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus...Mark 16:16 NIV, John 3:18 NIV, John 5:28-29 NIV, John 8:11 NIV, John 16:11 NIV, Rom 3:6-8 NIV, Rom 5:16 NIV, Rom 8:1-2 NIV, Rom 8:34 ESV, Col 2:13-15 NIV, 2 Thess 2:11-12 NIV, 2 Pet 2:3 NIV, 1 John 3:21 NIV, Jude 1:4-5 NIV

Once we believe, we have eternal life...John 3:14-16 NIV, John 3:36 NIV, John 4:13-14 NIV, John 5:24 NIV, John 5:39-43 NIV, John 6:40 NIV, John 6:47 NIV, John 6:54 NIV, John 10:25-30 NIV, John 17:1-3 NIV, Acts 13:46-48 NIV, Rom 5:21 NIV, Rom 6:22-23 NIV, Eph 1:13-14 NIV, 2 Thess 2:16-17 NIV, 1 Tim 1:15-16 NIV, Tit 1:1-3 NIV, Tit 3:7 NIV, Heb 9:12 NIV, Heb 9:15 NIV, 1 John 1:1-4 NIV, 1 John 5:9-14 NIV, 1 John 5:20 NIV

We are heirs to Christ...Acts 3:25 NIV, Rom 4:13-14 NIV, Rom 8:15-17 NIV, Gal 3:29 NIV, Gal 4:7 NIV, Eph 3:6 NIV, Tit 3:7 NIV, Heb 6:17 NIV, Heb 11:9 NIV

We have an inheritance that can never perish, spoil or fade...Dan 12:13 NIV, Matt 25:34 NIV, Acts 20:32 NIV, Gal 3:18 NIV, Gal 4:30-31 NIV, Eph 1:13-14 NIV, Eph 1:18 NIV, Col 1:12 NIV, Heb 9:15 NIV, 1 Peter 1:3-5 NIV

We are only justified once...Acts 13:39 NIV, Rom 3:24-28 NIV, Rom 4:2 NIV, Rom 4:25 NIV, Rom 5:9 NIV, Rom 5:16 NIV, Rom 8:30 NIV, Rom 8:33 ESV, Rom 10:9-10 NIV, 1 Cor 6:11 NIV, Gal 2:16-17 NIV, Gal 3:11 NIV, Gal 3:24 NIV, Gal 5:4 NIV, Tit 3:7 NIV

God will lose none of the elect...John 6:35-40 NIV, John 17:9-10 NIV, John 17:12 NIV, Rom 5:5 NIV

Nonbelievers are considered lost, not believers...Matt 18:12-14 NIV, Luke 19:9-10 NIV, John 10:25-30 NIV, 1 Cor 15:12-19 NIV, 1 Pet 2:24-25 NIV

Overcoming is based on belief, not works...John 16:33 NIV, Acts 20:28 NIV, 1 Pet 2:24-25 NIV, 1 John 2:13-14 NIV, 1 John 4:4 NIV, 1 John 5:4-5 NIV

It's not our works that keep us saved, it's His...Isa 64:6 NIV, Matt 6:1 NIV, Matt 23:25-26 NIV, Matt 23:27-28 NIV, Luke 18:19 NIV, John 6:28-29 NIV, Rom 3:9-20 NIV, Rom 3:21-31 NIV, Rom 4:3-11 NIV, Rom 4:22-24 NIV, Rom 5:17-21 NIV, Rom 6:16-20 NIV, Rom 8:9-11 NIV, Rom 9:30-33 NIV, Rom 10:3-4 NIV, Rom 11:5-7 NIV, 1 Cor 1:30 NIV, 1 Cor 3:13-15 NIV, 1 Cor 8:1 NIV, 1 Cor 15:10-11 NIV, 2 Cor 1:9 NIV, 2 Cor 3:5 NIV, 2 Cor 5:15 NIV, Gal 1:6-7 NIV, Gal 2:21 NIV, Gal 3:1-5 NIV, Gal 3:6-7 NIV, Gal 4:9 NIV, Eph 2:7-9 NIV, Phil 1:9-11 NIV, Phil 2:12-13 NIV, Phil 3:8-11 NIV, 1 Tim 4:10 NIV, 2 Tim 1:9 NIV, Tit 3:5 NIV, Rev 15:4 NIV

We are sealed until the day of redemption...John 6:27 NIV, 1 Cor 9:2 NIV, 2 Cor 1:21-22 NIV, Eph 1:13-14 NIV, Eph 4:30 NIV, Rev 9:4 NIV

The seed of God that is in us is imperishable...Matt 13:20-23 NIV, Luke 8:11 NIV, 1 Cor 15:54-57 NIV, 1 Pet 1:23 NIV, 1 John 3:9 NIV

The truth will be in us forever...Eph 1:13-14 NIV, 2 John 1:2 NIV

We are victorious by our belief in Jesus, not by works...Prov 21:31 NIV, John 16:33 NIV, Rom 8:35 NIV, Rom 8:37 NIV, 1 Cor 15:54-57 NIV, 2 Cor 2:14 NIV, 1 John 5:4-5 NIV, Rev 2:7 NIV, Rev 2:11 NIV, Rev 3:5 NIV, Rev 12:11 NIV, Rev 21:7-8 NIV

And to save the best for last, neither death nor life can separate us from the love of God...Rom 8:38-39 NIV, Rev 20:14 NIV.
 
CCW95A said:
The "new heart" can not sin for God's seed remains in the Christian, for it is Christ himself.

1 John 3:9.. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

There are two enemies as a Christian we face.

(1) The enemy without:
Eph 6:12.. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

(2) The enemy within:
2Co 10:3.. For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
2Co 10:4.. (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)
2Co 10:5.. Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Thoughts and imaginations belong to the physical mind. The "carnal" un rewed mind is the "enemy" of God because it is not subject to the laws of God.(Romans 8:7)

Does a Christian sin? Yes, but it is not his heart that sins but "sin" that is in his "flesh".

Rom 7:18.. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

Rom 7:20.. Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.


Click to expand...
In 1 John 3:9, John says...........
“No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning because he has been born of God".

Just so that we are all on the same page of understanding, here John explains that a person who is born again has that spiritual “seed” which is the life-generating and growing power within him, and that this keeps the person living a life free of continual sin.

I am not real sure what you are trying to say but allow me to be clear, this does not of course mean that the person will have a perfect, sinless life, but only that the pattern of his life will not be one of continuing indulgence in sin.

1 John 1:9 tells us that forgiveness is dependent on our confessing our sins to God. How does this work if all of our sins are forgiven the moment we receive Christ as Savior? It means that what the apostle John is describing here is “relational” forgiveness.

All of our sins are forgiven “positionally” the moment we receive Christ as Savior. This positional forgiveness guarantees our salvation and promise of an eternal home in heaven. Then when we stand before God after death, God will not deny us entrance into heaven because of our sins. That is positional forgiveness.

The concept of relational forgiveness is based on the fact that when we sin and we certainly do, we offend God and grieve His Spirit as told to us in Ephesians 4:30. While God has ultimately forgiven us of the sins we commit, they still result in a blocking or hindrance in our relationship with God.
 
Major said:
In 1 John 3:9, John says...........
“No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning because he has been born of God".
Click to expand...

Brother Major who do you suppose is this "seed" that dwells within a believer? Is the Christian born of "corruptible" seed, or incorruptible seed?
What is the name of this "seed" who now has taken up residence inside the believer? His name is Jesus Christ. Can Jesus Christ ever sin who now is our new life?
Do you not know that Jesus Christ is in you........? (2 cor 13:5)

Not only does the one born of God not "continually sin" but the "seed" (The Word of God) in this person can NEVER sin.

1 John 3:9.. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
 
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CCW95A said:
Brother Major who do you suppose is this "seed" that dwells within a believer? Is the Christian born of "corruptible" seed, or incorruptible seed?
What is the name of this "seed" who now has taken up residence inside the believer? His name is Jesus Christ. Can Jesus Christ ever sin who now is our new life?
Do you not know that Jesus Christ is in you........? (2 cor 13:5)

Not only does the one born of God not "continually sin" but the "seed" (The Word of God) in this person can NEVER sin.

1 John 3:9.. Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
Click to expand...

Just as I should not have to answer such a question on what the name of the seed in a believer is, you, and everyone should know that an act of sin is different from a state of sin.

This is an ideal to which every Christian is bound to aspire - inability to sin.

What John is saying here is that a Christian cannot persist in habitual, continual sin because he is born of God and the seed which which is of course the Lord Jesus Christ lives in him.

He cannot sin without a struggle or without a sense of grief so powerful that ultimately, despite his struggles, he will be brought to repentance and a forsaking of sin. What he is declaring to us, then, is that sin is no longer natural to the believer. Though, for a time, he may slip into it rather easily, nevertheless, it is now contrary to his nature. His heart is set toward God, and his life is a truceless antagonism against sin, and this must become apparent by breaking away from the bondage and slavery of sin.

"No one born of God commits sin; for God's nature abides in him," he declares and I believe!!! The child of God cannot persist, he cannot go on continuously living in what he knows to be sin.

If you will study the Greek grammer on this you will see that this is made clear in the tense of the compound verb, to commit sin. It is not aorist, which would have meant a single act of sin, but rather it is the present, continuous tense, "to go on committing sin."
 
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