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which side are you guys on when it comes to Ferguson?

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by 福井舞, Nov 30, 2014.

  1. do you consider yourself Darren Wilson supporters , Michael Brown supporters or simply neutral and why?
  2. I think if Brown didn't attack and further threaten Wilson that he would still be alive. Once you put your hands on a police officer your life expectancy is greatly reduced.

    As for sides, I am on the side of justice and it appears that justice has been served.
    LanceA likes this.
  3. I agree with Asuk. Brown escalated the situation when he decided to engage the police officer. Could Wilson have done some things differently, Yes and No. We weren't there and we can't possibly know how Wilson felt when Brown reached for him in his car.
  4. Well Wilson has now resigned. Hopefully the peace will return to Ferguson
  5. Yeah he resigned because of threats to innocent people. This entire situation is disgusting and it is going to get to the point no one will want to become a police officer, then we will have federal cops in our cities doing whatever they want. But I guess that lines up with the end times so there isn't really anything we can do about it.
  6. Yes it is disgusting indeed. There will be lawlessness near the end. it is every where, Thailand, China, America, mid east, and I agree there is nothing we can do about it....:( Jesus is the only 1 that can clean this place up ( Earth) and the people.
  7. People need to act respectful to police officers. That's the way I was raised to be. When I was a teenager I was in a place that I shouldn't have been one night. One of my best friends was with me. Someone called the police. Neither one of us were anything wrong but my friend acted rude to the police. I acted very respectful. He was hand cuffed and taken to jail. I was told to have a good night and went home.
  8. Brown was a thug. Wilson is a militarized trigger happy panic prone cop.
    The locals have become criminals themselves with the looting and rioting.
    I don't see any reason to be in support of any involved.

    IMNSHO, the modern world seems to be a showcase for stupidity.
    Bad behavior by all involved.
    Great Fiction, Where is the Messiah and LysanderShapiro says Amen and like this.
  9. trigger happy panic prone cop? Where do you get that? Did you some how read some of his history where he might have shot someone else or just flying off at the mouth?
  10. He fired more shots than were necessary. Wilson never attempted to de-escalate the encounter at any time, nor did he consider using non-lethal weapons. He stated that Brown "looked like a demon". These all point to a person panicking.

    A cop "under control" would not have allowed himself to be man-handled in the first place.
    He also would have used non-lethal tools first.

    There's a good article on a town that has changed their methods with good results

  11. #11 LysanderShapiro, Nov 30, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2014
    I've always been critical of the police system. When it comes to law, I lean toward Anarcho-Capitalism (which doesn't mean no law or police, but it means privatization of police and the court system is with arbitrators and private lawyers). That's a very VERY broad explanation. There is a lot more to say about it. And it's just a leaning toward it -- I'm no a loyalist to that concept, and I also see flaws in it.

    But the point is the police system needs some serious re-evaluation to ensure they are held accountable for their mistakes -- more so than they currently are.

    Now that that is said, I can't say entirely. From the evidence that was presented, the story that we know (that they have not given in the mainstream media), Michael Brown was a real trouble maker, made foolish choices, and did stupid things. Darren Wilson, from my own, fallible judgment, responded irresponsibly, and as a cop, his position is to hold morality and prudence to a higher standard, especially since he is paid by the public.

    I also believe that if a jury cannot reach a sound conclusion of one's guilt or reach an indictment, then further legal action ought not be taken.

    As for the looters, they are shooting themselves in the head. If they really have a problem with the police system, then what they are doing is only empowering them. Just like if an anarchist despises the government, blowing up a government building will only empower the government, not reduce it.

    A few people I know from work made comments saying "Don't blame the looters -- they were pushed to the brink for years and it is only natural they will react this way." Um, no. Everyone is responsible for their actions, they are not getting justice out of hurting innocent people and their businesses, and they seem more concerned about stealing electronics than getting justice.

    Ultimately, I'm really on no side at all. Partly because both are so damned flawed, but also because I really don't even have much of a leg to stand on in this, just as most everyone doesn't.

    I posted a few videos from a researcher named Stefan Molyneaux who presented every element of fact from the case. He is incredible with his research, and it was approached with serious thought and responsibility.

    Above all, if those who hold up the signs and use the hashtag #blacklivesmatter and believe it, they need to show equal concern for black on black crime, and more so, abortion since it is the number one killer of black Americans...the NUMBER ONE, and by a long shot too.
    Great Fiction likes this.
  12. I am not on either side.. Because at the end of the day, there is loss of innocent life.. At the same time, I have no idea why any citizen would get into a brawl with a cop in uniform. That sounds a little foolish.. Playing with fire and telling it is wrong to be burnt..
    Big Moose and LanceA say Amen and like this.
  13. How was he innocent?
  14. Right. As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one."
  15. Well said.
  16. Well my brother, I have to disagree with you. IF it was not for the police system we would all probably be dead. This is a real hard world we live in and if it was not for the police total chaos would prevail.

    You are saying that the police made a mistake. I do not agree at all. What we heard was a bunch of people saying that they saw this and they saw that and were very angry because a black youth had been shot. That same youth had just robbed a store and used violence against the owner.. BUT when they were placed under oath and told that if their testimony was proven to be a lie, THEY would be charged with accessory to the crime........all of a sudden those same people changed their story from distortions and lies to the truth. THAT is why the grand jury found that there was not to be any charges made because the evidence did not match the stories told.

    The riots and marches are all about POWER and the excuse to steal something. It is about rage and the need to be in control and be something more than you really are and has nothing to do with justice at all.

    IF.....when this kind of attitude prevails in society, we would SHOOT looters then there would be no looting and destroying peoples property.

    "Oh....but that is extreme and unchristian." IS IT????

    Isn't there something in the Bible about an "an eye for an eye".
  17. I am gonna be on God's side (lest my fleshy nature get the better of me).....
    Silk likes this.
  18. #18 LysanderShapiro, Dec 1, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2014
    Don't misunderstand me for saying we shouldn't have A police system. We have to have one, to serve and protect. Anyone who thinks that people will simply do the right thing is living in denial. I only said I'm not sure the ones we have is the right one. I'm wondering if it ought to be under privatization. And I also understand the arguments as to why it isn't -- so a serious reform within the police system (stronger penalties for their errors, each officer must take responsibility for his mistakes, etc). In the private sector, when a company does something against the customer, they either have to rectify it or parish as a company. The same model, even if it continues to exist on the hard-earned tax dollars of working people, ought to be put in place against officers who do the wrong thing, even if it really was only an accident. Accidents happen, but that doesn't mean someone else ought to rectify it for the person who make the slip-up.

    That's one of the problems I have with so many people today -- no one wants to take personal responsibility. While I know there are good cops, the problem with the system they work under is very light on their errors and many times (not always, but far too many times) innocent citizens have to clean up their mess. It's certainly happened to me in the past.

    Also, I think you skimmed over my answer. Much of what you said I already agree with. I said I lean toward the thought that Darren Wilson made a mistake, but 1) I can't say for certain because I wasn't there and wasn't given all the evidence, 2) Michael Brown did act aggressively, I do think some action HAD to be done (6 shots, I don't know--but something certainly), and 3) I already said the looters really need to stop being viewed as innocent protesters and need to be held responsibility for their crimes. People who are giving them a free pass are nuts. I said explicitly how they DON'T really want justice, they want to cause chaos and steal stuff. That's all they are interested in.

    Major, I really do like you, but please read my response carefully. If you were confused about anything, please ask first.
    福井舞 and Where is the Messiah say Amen and like this.
  19. That is good news. I like you as well. However, I was disagreeing with your comment on the police.
    I did not misunderstand or was I confused. I only responded to what you stated.

    You had said........"I've always been critical of the police system."

    I am NOT of that opinion. My son has been in the police system as an officer now for 25 years as well as my 1st cousin who retired after 40 years.

    That is what I was responding to. Yes, it seems we do actually agree on the other things you posted.
  20. I understand. Most people I encounter who argue against my opinion are often either cops themselves or relatives of cops. No disrespect of course, but usually the argument either begins with or is followed by "My husband is a cop" or "My sister is a cop" or "My son is a cop," etc. I absolutely understand the need to defend the entity since their is close relation.

    My position really isn't personal, it's not tied to any one cop or event or experience, and it isn't even in regards to police themselves -- most experiences I have with them are pretty good. Usually the argument goes "Well, not ALL cops are bad." I'd go even further to say most cops are actually pretty good and have the purest of intentions. But my concern is for the bureaucracy of the police system and the flaws it has which are pretty major.

    Again, it isn't personal and has absolutely nothing to do with individual police officers -- I'm approaching it more from an Austrian Economics perspective.

    And I would never argue for the lack of some sort of law enforcement. How that law enforcement operates is another story. And then laws, of course, is another story -- outside of the police of course.

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