In another place, the Roman Catholics were being lambasted by daring to say a Xian should be doing good works. It was irrelevant how much they proved with scripture, they were RCC and they said works, so they were open targets. Even the moderators took part in it. So I'm curious, if works are not to be achieved, and it's more about your studies to be independant of the Church's teaching, which was the gist of the arguments there, how does that work? So, what do you believe? Is knowing the TULIP, sinners prayer, trinity doctrine, etc... important to salvation? If a person knew all of those things, would they be saved? Could someone be saved without knowing those things? Someone without even knowing there WAS a Jesus, could they be saved? Or, could they have lived a life, that would have enabled God to have a relationship with them anyway, even if they had no clue what "a doctrine" was?