WHAT IS THE KINGDOM OF GOD?

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by vengaturreino, Feb 20, 2015.

  1. So you do not think that web sites which investigate and confirm the truth are something that Christians should use.

    Now that is very interesting. I am not arguing with you and neither am I "baiting you (whatever that means), simply trying to understand.

    Euphemia, aren't we commanded by the Lord to test all things so as to make sure that we in fact do have the truth????

    1 John 4:1 (ESV)
    "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. "

    What about 1 Thessalonians 5:20–21 ........
    " Do not despise prophecies, 21 but test everything; hold fast what is good."

    Didn't Jesus tell us in John 8:32 ........
    "And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."

    It seems to me that truth can transform a person’s thinking and personality, resulting in freedom from avoidable problems and if there is any group of people in this world that should demand the truth, it is the Church of the living God.....but that is just my thinking.
     
  2. Just because there is no death certificate on the death of Andrew Wommack's son is no proof of a misunderstanding. It is, in fact, proof of a doctor's reticence to declare what happened as a miracle of God, due to his fear of men, and what they may say about his abilities as a physician, declaring someone dead and then he is alive again. Death certificates are not signed immediately, but the young man's chart, a legal document, and not available to public scrutiny, would declare in the nurses' notes that he had expired, and at what time. It is only self-preservation of a secular professional that would try to save face in his own confusion and misunderstanding.

    Based on the fruit of his life, and on a Christian's God-given common sense, I would believe Andrew Wommack over any secular individual, and especially any heresy hunter website (which I cannot access, btw).
     
  3. Time to move on... rehashing argued arguments is futile. People will believe whatever they want to believe - so let them. God does. Have faith.
     
    Fish Catcher Jim and Euphemia say Amen and like this.
  4. What complete gobbledegook - we do not need more miracles!!!
    Tell that to the blind, and the crippled, and those suffering from malaria and tuberculosis, and HIV AIDS, and the deaf,
    and those suffering cancer; and a multitude of diseases, ailments and disabilities. Especially in the Third World where millions of people
    have NO access to doctors, hospitals, medical insurance nor ambulances; but are fully dependent on Jesus to heal them and set them free.

    These signs shall follow them that believe - miracles, healings, blessings and answered prayer is the REWARD for believing
    the full gospel of salvation as exactly written and explained in the New Testament by all the Apostles,
    and enjoyed by all true believers and worshippers.
     
    Euphemia likes this.
  5. Ok, I tried. This thread is on time-out until Wednesday.
     
  6. This thread is unlocked but keep it on the OP's subject. Be civil and state your case and move on.
     
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  7. The Kingdom of God is not the Kingdom of Heaven. The kingdom of God is here where a born again believer who is full of the Holy Ghost operates. Another words, people who are unsaved or Christians who are not walking in the spirit of God but in the spirit of man (the flesh) will not inherit the kingdom of God. Which means they can not walk in His blessing or walk in His protection and will not have His power to over come or fight the enemy and so on.

    When a Believer is walking in Gods will He is dwelling in the kingdom of God. He has inherited the kingdom of God.
    Luke 17:20-21 KJV
    20... And when He was demanded of the pharisees, when the Kingdom of God should come, He answered them and said, "The Kingdom of God cometh not with observation -1
    ( or with outward shew)
    21... Neither shall they say, Lo here ! or lo there ! for, behold the Kingdom of God is within you -2 (or among you)
    See it like this....The Kingdom of God is inside out
    the kingdom of darkness is outside in

    Blessings
    Jim
     
  8. I have to disagree with you Jim. Yes, some believe that the Kingdom of God and Kingdom of Heaven are referring to different things, it is clear to me that both phrases are referring to the same thing.

    Using the Scriptures Jim we see Jesus in Matthew 19:23 speaking to the rich young ruler, and He uses “kingdom of heaven” and “kingdom of God” interchangeably.

    “Then Jesus said to his disciples, ‘I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven’”.

    In the very next verse, Christ proclaims, “Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God” (verse 24). Jesus makes no distinction between the two terms but seems to consider them synonymous.

    Mark and Luke used “kingdom of God” where Matthew used “kingdom of heaven” frequently in parallel accounts of the same parable Compare Matthew 11:11-12 with Luke 7:28; Matthew 13:11with Mark 4:11 and Luke 8:10; Matthew 13:24 with Mark 4:26; Matthew 13:31 with Mark 4:30 and Luke 13:18; Matthew 13:33 with Luke 13:20; Matthew 18:3 with Mark 10:14 and Luke 18:16; and Matthew 22:2 with Luke 13:29. In each instance, Matthew used the phrase “kingdom of heaven” while Mark and/or Luke used “kingdom of God.” Clearly, the two phrases refer to the same thing.
    (http://www.gotquestions.org/kingdom-heaven-God.html#ixzz3UrXME8bH)
     
    Roads likes this.

  9. Well you can do that brother !! I believe it is aloud...lol
    Have awonderful day
     
    Major likes this.
  10. Jim, you said.........
    "Christians who are not walking in the spirit of God but in the spirit of man (the flesh) will not inherit the kingdom of God.

    What Scriptures do you base that on?
     
  11. Okay I'm going to chip in.
    Again, we are slightly off topic - just pointing it out.
    I do accept Mark 16:15-18 - do not care about the scholars' belief.
    How about Matthew 10:1-8, Yeshua clearly summons His 12 disciples and give them authority over unclean spirits and illnesses.
    And then there is the bit about freely you have received, freely give. Why would this apply to only 12. What are we of Jesus?
    I would also like to take you to 1 Corinthians 12 - spiritual gifts given be Holy Spirit Himself.
    These are: wisdom, knowledge, faith, healing, working of miracles, prophecy, discerning of spirits, diverse tongues and interpretation thereof.
    I can imagine a non-ignorant unbeliever walking away from witnessing any of these with one word on his/her tongue - miracle.
    I also think the devil and his cronies have done well to replace miracles with magic - go turn on your tv and tell me.
    AS to an unbeliever finding and trusting in God by miracles, we have a very important clue about the process.
    Think back to Lazarus and a certain rich man, now see the end of that passage in Luke 16.
     
    Abdicate likes this.
  12. We build false theology to hide out inability because of sin and lack of faith birthing many stillborn in the world. :(

    No more for me. Glory to God!
     
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  13. Greetings Brother Major,
    There are many scriptures through out the written word of God which speak of either seeking first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and a list of those who will not inherit or dwell in the kingdom of God.

    In order to talk with you on this we would have to agree on what the kingdom of God is and what the kingdom of heaven is. So far we have yet to agree on this. So if I go into why even with scriptures, well brother you will just come back and tell me I am out to lunch so to speak. lol We have been there before. ; )

    So to keep the peace and not see another thread get closed I will say...
    Blessings Brother and have a great week end
    Love and Hugs in Christ
    Jim
     
  14. When God gives me revelation knowledge to any part of His word then to me it is SETTLED. I do not ever have to wonder about it or ask about it for God said it and so it is.
    If God tells me to sing and worship Him and it is in chaos .....then no more reasoning......My hands are lifted and we are singing and praising God. Total Trust in God and His written word....now thats Core Value ! It's Settled
     
    Chopper and Abdicate say Amen and like this.
  15. No problem Jim. I was not concerned with the kingdom of God being different than the kingdom of heaven. I already posted the Scriptures that confirm them as being one in the same IMO. I do not understand how disagreeing on the two would lead you to not speak to the question asked.
    I was just wondering about what Scriptures say that.............
    "CHRISTIANS who are not walking in the spirit of God but in the spirit of man (the flesh) will not inherit the kingdom of God."

    I do not know of any and was curious where your thought came from.
     
  16. Can you clarify what you are saying my brother. I am just an old country boy so I need a clearer explination of what that means .
     
  17. My pleasure. :)

    The scriptures are filled with the miraculous. We are told to do the same thing. We are told we are the same as Jesus is now. But because we don't experience these miraculous things, we use "theology" to excuse away these promises - "Oh that was for the apostles only." "I guess it's just God's will I'm sick." "I guess the answer is no." We build theologies around our failures so we don't have to deal with the sin in our lives keeping us from doing/having the promises of God.

    Psalms 66:18 (KJV)
    If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear [me]: ​

    James 1:6-7 (KJV)
    But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord. ​

    There are so many churches filled with dead (unsaved) members all thinking they're saved. That's a stillborn.

    Does this help?
     
    Fish Catcher Jim and Euphemia say Amen and like this.
  18. Yes. Thank you. I do not necessarily agree with you but that is OK.

    Job 14:1...........
    "Man that is born of a woman is of few days, and full of trouble".

    Romans 8:28-29............
    “And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.”

    That passage teaches and some important truths.

    It teaches “that all things, both good and bad, tranquility and tribulation, ease and distress, peace and persecution, safety and peril, prosperity and poverty, happiness and suffering, life and death work together for good to them that love God .....Correct???

    It then refutes the teaching that it is not God’s will for His people to have problems and suffer since ALL THINGS, good and bad work together.

    It teaches that Believes are “predestined to be conformed to the image of Jesus Christ,” and this conformation involves suffering. He was called the "suffering" Saviour for a reason.

    With that in mind, and we both know many, many faith filled believers who have suffered. And although there are scriptural indicators that God wants us to be in good health, all sickness and disease are allowed by Him for His purposes, whether we understand them or not.

    Thanks again.
     

  19. Romans 8:28-29............
    “And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.”

    That passage teaches and some important truths.

    It teaches “that all things, both good and bad, tranquility and tribulation, ease and distress, peace and persecution, safety and peril, prosperity and poverty, happiness and suffering, life and death work together for good to them that love God .....Correct???

    It teaches us that those WHO LOVE GOD and are CALLED ACCORDING TO HIS PURPOSE,
    That He can and will work Good into all things. How ever it will depend on the person or believer. If they are walking by faith and doing or acting in which the word requires us to act then yes He will work good in all things BUT if we are not abiding by His word then He can not do this. Not that He does not have the power but He is bound by His word. God just does not go around doing what ever He pleases as if , you never know what God is going to do.



    It then refutes the teaching that it is not God’s will for His people to have problems and suffer since ALL THINGS, good and bad work together.

    It does no such thing.
    3 John1:2 KJV
    Beloved I wish above ALL THINGS that thou mayest prosper and be in Good Health, EVEN AS thy soul prospereth.

    John 16:33 KJV
    These things I have spoken unto you, that in ME ye might have peace . In the world ye shall have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have over come the world.

    If we walk according to His written word we to have the authority to over come the sufferings and such in this life. Those who are not walking according to HIS word and living by faith will not. This alone would say it is not Gods will for us to suffer.

    With that in mind, and we both know many, many faith filled believers who have suffered. And although there are scriptural indicators that God wants us to be in good health, all sickness and disease are allowed by Him for His purposes, whether we understand them or not.

    God does NOT allow sickness or anything bad for His purpose or working of anything.
    Also you said faith filled believers....Brother all believers have faith placed in them when they became born of the spirit..........HOWEVER we have to build on this faith so it is faith that walks, talks and has the last say other wise you are moved by fear and doubt and accepting things as from God that are in no way what so ever FROM GOD.

    People put things off on God that they do not understand or have no real revelation knowledge of and it never was God and never will Be God.
    Have a wonderful Blessed week
    Jim
     
    Euphemia likes this.
  20. Jim, I do not see us being able to agree on several Biblical issues. Our thinking and understanding what the Bible sys are just too far apart.

    I love your devotion to what you believe and in the middle of this I can and do see your love and affection for our Lord Jesus Christ.

    I do however think that if you look at Rom. 8:28 with an open mind you will be able to see that it reminds us that God can bring about good from any situation. Many people look back on times of sickness as times when they grew closer to God, learned to trust Him more, and/or learned how to truly value life. This is the perspective God has because He is sovereign and knows the end result. Is it then possible that God allowed such a sickness or affliction to come upon us in order to accomplish His will in our life.

    I am going to say this to you already knowing that you will disagree but for others out there, many need to understand that we live in a world tainted by sin, sickness, disease, and death will always be with us. We are fallen beings, with physical bodies prone to disease and illness and that is simply a fact and can not be explained or "faithed" away. It is what it is !!!

    Some sickness is simply a result of the natural course of things in this world. Sickness can also be the result of a demonic attack. The Bible describes several instances when physical suffering was caused by Satan and his demons as recorded in Matt. 17:14-18 and Luke 13:10-16. So, we see Biblically that some sickness is not from God, but from Satan. Even in these instances, God is still in control. God sometimes allows sin or Satan to cause physical suffering. Even when sickness is not directly from God, He will still use it according to His perfect will which is exactly what Romans 8:28 says.

    It is undeniable, though, that God sometimes intentionally allows, or even causes sickness to accomplish His sovereign purposes. Look at Heb. 12:5-11 and notice that it describes God disciplining us to "produce a harvest of righteousness" in verse 11. Sickness can be a means of God's loving discipline. It is difficult for us to comprehend why God would work in this manner. But, believing in the sovereignty of God, there is no other option than suffering being something God allows and/or causes.

    I will not continue to banter back and forth with you as it is obvious that we are convinced in what we think we know to be correct and to continue is going to lead to another closed thread.

    I will leave you to your thinking and as always ask God to bless you and keep you safe and in good health.
     

Share This Page