What Is The Flesh?

Discussion in 'Holy Spirit Baptism and Living' started by Mitspa, Mar 30, 2014.

  1. Man was made from the dirt and that was cursed by God at the fall. Let us say that a false seed was planted in the dirt and it produced a cursed spiritual tree, that grows in all of us? "I see men as trees" was what the blind man first saw when The Lord healed him. What this man seen was a spiritual truth that the seed that is in man is a false seed and grows a tree that cannot bear fruit.

    Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

    Its hard to see the truth of what we are, because the same lie that we are judges of good and evil prevent us from seeing the truth that we are corrupt according to the true standards of God.

    Now what was the solution to this tree? Well we where given another Tree and new seed to plant to reproduce a new tree unto God.

    The term "flesh" as used by Paul and others in the epistles could best be described as "self" or the self principle? We desire that which promotes our own ego, we desire that which satisfies our own lust to have and to be seen as having. "let us make a name for ourselves" is the response of the flesh. Covetousness, personal ambition, jealousy, pride, world gain..etc Its all based upon self, even sexual sins are based upon the desire to have and satisfy self. What is Gods solution? First is the truth of the Cross where we determine that self must die and in sincere acknowledgement of its truth allow it to judge our flesh..daily. Second consider that "love" agape is the exact opposite of "self"?

    1Co 13:4 ¶ Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up;
    5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil;
    6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth;
    7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
    8 ¶ Love never fails

    The Cross and love are the only answer to the flesh, all these religious traditions are vain and have no power to overcome the flesh.

    Col 2:23 These things indeed have an appearance of wisdom in self-imposed religion, false humility, and neglect of the body, but are of no value against the indulgence of the flesh.
    God calls me Olivia likes this.
  2. Oh that some could see this truth and be set free! The purpose of the law (10 commandments and all) was to show us ALL the truth of our own flesh "selfishness". Now it that love fulfills all the law we are not walking in the flesh "selfishness" That's why over and over "love" is brought forth as the fulfillment of what the law demanded. That's why Christ said "THIS IS MY COMMANDMENT" he was showing us the Royal law.. In that we walk in love we will not stumble and the flesh (self) will not have power over us.

    2Co 11:3 But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
  3. There are two leavens that where to be guarded against and purged from the Church? The first being hypocrisy, in that we are all sinners in the flesh..we cannot judge the flesh of others. Anyone who teaches the law is a hypocrite, for no man can keep its standard so how could any man judge another by a standard they cannot keep themselves? The Royal law is a law that demands that we love others as we love ourselves. In this there is no place for hypocrisy, there is no place to judge others by standards we do not keep ourselves. No the Royal law is broken by all those who attempt to teach the law. They cannot or will not see that in their own flesh is deceiving them into a blindness that cannot see the truth.
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  4. Mt 23:23 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought to have done, without leaving the others undone.
    24 "Blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!
    25 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence.
    26 "Blind Pharisee, first cleanse the inside of the cup and dish, that the outside of them may be clean also.
    27 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness.
    28 "Even so you also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.

    Jesus Christ is the same , yesterday, today and forever.. He never used such harsh words against the harlot or the tax collector but always gave them His grace. There is a religion of the flesh and there is true worship in Spirit and truth. The false is very much like those the Lord rebuked, a religion based upon outward appearance and upon doctrines of men. The true is based upon the simplicity of Christ and faith working by love.

    Joh 8:10 When Jesus had raised Himself up and saw no one but the woman, He said to her, "Woman, where are those accusers of yours? Has no one condemned you?"
    11 She said, "No one, Lord." And Jesus said to her, "Neither do I condemn you; go and sin no more." (Rom 6:14)
    12 ¶ Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, "I am the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life."
    13 The Pharisees therefore said to Him, "You bear witness of Yourself; Your witness is not true."
    14 Jesus answered and said to them, "Even if I bear witness of Myself, My witness is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going; but you do not know where I come from and where I am going.
    15 "You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one.

    Jesus Christ the same yesterday, today and forever..
  5. Be natural; forget yourself; be so absorbed in what you are doing and in the realisation of the presence of God, and in the glory and the greatness of the Truth that you are preaching, and the occasion that brings you together...that you forget yourself completely. That is the right condition; that is the only place of safety; that is the only way in which you can honor God. Self is the greatest enemy of the preacher, more so than in the case of any other man in society. And the only way to deal with self is to be so taken up with, and so enraptured by, the glory of what you are doing, that you forget yourself altogether.

    Martyn Lloyd-Jones quotes
    God calls me Olivia likes this.
  6. It is written "I AM THE LORD, I CHANGE NOT" so what was Gods original intention for man?

    Ge 1:26 ¶ Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth."
    27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
    28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth."
    29 ¶ And God said, "See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be for food.
    30 "Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food"; and it was so.

    Ge 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.
    8 ¶ The LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden, and there He put the man whom He had formed.
    9 And out of the ground the LORD God made every tree grow that is pleasant to the sight and good for food. The tree of life was also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

    Ge 2:15 Then the LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to tend and keep it.
    16 ¶ And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, "Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat;
    17 "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."
    18 ¶ And the LORD God said, "It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him."

    Ge 2:24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.
    25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed

    Ro 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
    21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,
    22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference;
    23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

    The intention of God for man was that we would be in His Image and His Glory, he placed us in a garden where we were blessed, and could eat freely of all good things. A place where we would have no shame..

    The purpose of the law was to show us we had fallen short of Gods intention for us and that through faith in Christ His son we could be restored to His glory and His good intentions for us. In fact the word "sin" means to miss the mark or to come short of the goal... in this we have all fallen short of Gods Glory.

    The Lord does not change and His intentions for us are the same as in the beginning, that we would have life and have it in abundance..that we would have His Glory and His Image..that we would eat freely from all good things.. "I AM THE LORD, I CHANGE NOT"
  7. In a general sense "the flesh" refers to our normal, human, worldly nature.
    In other words, all those needs and concerns of our body.
  8. I would agree with the worldly nature... but lust are not what we need, such food, clothing etc.. I have often struggled with the difference between a godly need and a sinful lust? Still I am not always sure that the things I desire are sanctified according to Gods will? Im not like some who take a promise and a blessing to mean that im just supposed to have everything I desire. I know that from the past.. some of the things I thought where in Gods will, were really not and was a lust that came from the flesh. I think the "self"-ego principle helps me understand this better than anything. If its selfish in nature, if its to glorify me and not God..then I can question it as a lust. But I allow that others have there own ways of expressing this truth, I am trying to represent what I believe is the biblical view. :)
  9. Lusts can proceed from the corruption of natural desires, but are not necessarily caused by "flesh".
    Sin begins in the will, "the flesh" very often is the excuse given for the sin, but all sin begins from misuse of the will.
    As our Lord said “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. 23 All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”
  10. Well I think we kinda agree but Paul uses the term in doctrine that determines true obedience.. I like to look at how he defines it and its effects.
  11. What version of the Bible are you using?
    They have mis-spelled the word "veil" as "vail".

    That is very odd.
  12. I think that's KJV or NKJV yea if you look the word up its spelled different in the same bible.
  13. The odd thing is that the words vail and veil have VERY different meanings.
    Vail is archaic, means to submit.
  14. I think in the context here we can see its intended meaning?
  15. Ro 7:14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin.
    15 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do.
    16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good.
    17 But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.

    18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find.
    19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice.
    20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.
    21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good.

    You know Paul was most likely the greatest law-keeper of his time? His level of obedience to the written code of the law would have been seen as "blameless" before other men. Paul himself would have thought that he was righteous by the law, and according to his testimony he was very much self-righteous. But when he saw true holiness and true righteousness in the Lord Jesus Christ, he then understood why the scriptures declare that there is none good, no not one. That all our righteousness is as a filthy rag. The Holy Spirit took Paul into the desert and began to teach him the truth. We always want to compare ourselves with others, often trying to see the flesh working in others and refusing to see its working in ourselves. Bitterness, jealousy, envy, strife, anger, hatred, hypocrisy, covetousness are just as sinful as the "sin" that many look to find in others. It is so common to hear certain Christians pointing to the sin of those outside there little groups. This girl wears short shorts etc.. that guy is a drunk and a liar etc... But they cannot and will not see there own sin, they cannot and will not accept that they are in the flesh themselves. God hates this kind of religion and He loves these poor souls that are held in bondage to sin. But the hypocrite who cannot see the truth of their own flesh cannot help these people, in fact they only hinder those of us who are going out to reach them with the truth. The reason that many blaspheme God is not because they hate God but because they see the hypocrisy of the religious, who claim to represent Him.

    Ro 2:1 ¶ Therefore you are inexcusable, O man, whoever you are who judge, for in whatever you judge another you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things.

    Ro 2:21 You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?
    22 You who say, "Do not commit adultery," do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?
    23 You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law?
    24 For "the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," as it is written.
  16. Hey I forgot about this thread...thanks Olivia
  17. I just found this one. Cool.
  18. Better be careful reading this one Where :cautious:
  19. I have heard this summed up in as little as two words, it's our 'corruptible nature'
  20. I like to make things as simple as possible also..but many can think they are not in the flesh but can very much be walking in the flesh. Most religious people I know have a law centric idea of the flesh? They think because they are doing religious works they are not in the "flesh"? But the scriptures call these very works...works of the flesh or dead works. The Pharisees are given to us as an example of this, they strived at every precept of the law, and was very much blinded from there own flesh by self-righteousness. They were very good rule-keepers compared to some, but they were far from God and the greatest enemies of true righteousness.
    God calls me Olivia likes this.

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