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What False Teaching?

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by KingJ, Dec 19, 2013.

  1. I want us to expose false teaching. An increase in false teaching in the last days is scriptural, so what are these heresies in your opinion? and what are the priorities? I am not too interested in denominational differences if they have been with us for over 100 years.

    If you are liberal / moving with the times and clash with the popular conservative heresies...ok we are not going to debate here, but then where and what is the prophesied 'last days' false teaching according to you?

    1 Tim 4 and 2 Tim 4 warn us of false prophets in the last days. Paul acts swiftly to expose them in the church in Gal 5. Timothy touches on some of them, those that say ''do not get married, do not eat some kinds of food''

    In Gal 5:7-12 Paul gives six identifying marks of false teachers / guidelines to spot heresy.

    1. False teachers distract Christians from obeying the truth of the gospel.
    2. False teachers replace the call of God with their own deceptive persuasiveness.
    3. False teachers gain control over the whole church.
    4. False teachers cause confusion and discouragement.
    5. False teachers spread false reports about spiritual leaders.
    6. False teachers emphasize sensational rituals.
     
  2. Well obviously the end times "experts" who set specific dates that turn out to be wrong (and collect millions of $$ in the process) as well as those who make a generous living off of telling people the end times are "soon" for their entire careers.

    I also think the televangelists who rake in millions and live lavish lifestyles, as well as faith healers who are easily proven to be frauds, fall into that category.

    Finally, I believe those who tell kids and Christians that they have to reject pretty much all of modern science in order to be a Christian (young-earth creationists, geocentrists) also are examples of "false teachers".

    Basically, IMO it's anyone who does serious damage to the general perception of Christianity, and thereby hinders our Great Commission, is a "false teacher". If I were Satan and I wanted to steer as many people away from the true path of Christianity as I could, I'd adopt the mantle of the faith and associate it with as much ridiculousness as possible, thereby turning many away before they even really know what it is.
     
  3. It's pretty difficult to express a common heresy and not pinpoint certain doctrines.
     
  4. What false teaching? It's everywhere, it has so infiltrated the churches that it is hard to find a church that has not been influenced in one way or another.
    We are awash in modernism that waters down the gospel, feminism that corrupts what it is to be a woman, dominionism that is a half hidden front for misplaced patriotism, prosperity gospel, word of faith, ...... a seemingly endless litany of godless stupidity.

    As RiverJordan alluded, every time someone lies to support an agenda, he is a false teacher.
     
  5. The falling away is definitely upon us...People are believing in a false grace doctrine called 'unmerited favor'...Pre-tribulation rapture theories, antichrists in Jerusalem, and all kinds of other fables.

    Apostle Paul did not teach a pre-tribulation rapture theory...

    2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him
    2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand
    2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first,
    and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

    Jesus taught that both would be together until the end:

    Mat 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

    Mat 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
    Mat 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

    2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

    Mat 13:49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just

    1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    When does Jesus come on the clouds:

    Mar 13:24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, Mar 13:25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
    Mar 13:26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

    That’s right...Jesus returns after the tribulation and the ‘wicked’ leave first. The Bible says ‘the wicked’ are those from the falling away and they are taken from among the just by the angels. Apostle Paul did not teach a ‘pre-tribulation’ rapture. He said very clearly that we who are ‘alive and remain’ will be caught up to them...


    The United States churches are in deep trouble and do not know it..

    ‘Christians’ It is time to test yourselves!

    Are you ‘in the faith’? Are you following sound doctrine?...Or have you been led astray by a false teacher? The falling away is taking place in the United States and the warning is being sounded...The great apostasy is here! A false gospel called ‘unmerited favor’ is being taught in many of today’s Churches. Is yours one of them? ‘Unmerited favor’ is not the doctrine of Jesus Christ. The gospel of grace is the transforming and renewing power of the Holy Spirit, by which we are taught how to live and are able to serve God:

    2Co 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

    Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

    Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us,
    by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

    Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
    Titus 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

    1Co 15:10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

    Heb 12:28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God
    acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

    Those who have received God’s grace will have it manifested in how they live their lives...The gospel of ‘unmerited favor’ is a powerless gospel and will not save you on judgment day!


    Please read this PDF entitled 'The Falling away is Here' Click here to read it:' The Falling Away is Here PDF

    The warning is being sounded...will you listen?

    TC
     
  6. even in your bibles you find false teachings of scripture ..

    example:
    Hbr 8:11 “AND THEY SHALL NOT TEACH EVERYONE HIS FELLOW CITIZEN,
    AND EVERYONE HIS BROTHER, SAYING, ‘KNOW THE LORD,’ FOR ALL WILL KNOW ME, FROM THE LEAST TO THE GREATEST OF THEM.

    8:11 καὶ οὐ μὴ διδάξωσιν ἕκαστος τὸν πολίτην αὐτοῦ καὶ ἕκαστος τὸν ἀδελφὸν αὐτοῦ λέγων γνῶθι τὸν κύριον ὅτι πάντες εἰδήσουσίν με ἀπὸ μικροῦ ἕως μεγάλου αὐτῶν

    Hbr 8:11 and never neither (will it be) taught everyone (is) their neighbor, and everyone (is) their brother (as) speaking (with) understanding (of) Christ, because all (will) know Me, unto (the) least (to the) greatest (of) them.

    note: "and never neither (will it be) taught" ..
    can be put into plain English by saying: "and it will be taught" (everyone is their ..)
    (double negatives cancel out)
     
  7. Jer 31:34
    “They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the LORD, “for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”

    there isn't a negative in the Hebrew .. thus congruent to the double negative canceling in the Greek .. "no more every" is the translator changing the context ..
    'iysh simply means "man" ..

    Jer 31:34
    לָמַד lamad = teaching
    עוֹד `owd = again
    ......... (to)
    אִישׁ 'iysh = man
    ......... (that)
    אִישׁ 'iysh = men
    ......... (are his)
    רֵעַ rea` = neighbor

    stepping back from the trees ..
    to NOT teach man is his neighbor and brother is a direct contradiction of what the OT & Jesus taught .. and as such a BIG DUH on the translators part ..

    LOVE NEIGHBOR AS SELF IS TAUGHT IN THE OT & NT ALIKE ..
    (and will be again according to the prophecy of when the Jews accept Jesus in end times and thus gaining forgiveness of sins)
    JESUS EVEN UP'D IT TO LOVING YOUR ENEMIES ..
     
  8. The big push to accept homosexuality and incorporating that into the Churches. Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, all major denominations have been infiltrated with this Homosexual acceptance. I see it as a big problem and sin is not called sin but an "issue" now. We also see churches combining Muslim teaching with Bible. I see more of a washing out and accepting just anything as being good.

    This would be more denominational belief's right? Everything about The Word will prosper you and without faith it's impossible to please God. Now preaching green and patriotism is not preaching the Word and a waste of time in church, but many have taken the political pulpit. They should run for those positions and let someone else Pastor.

    Is bad translations false teaching? For the most part I have found translators gutless and translating things that make sense to them according to "Their" revelation. I have yet to run into a Bible that translates super consistent, even the KJV which does a better job than most.

    Example:

    But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse Barak (Bless) thee to thy face.
    (Job 1:11)

    Using the consistent translation of the Word Bless or to salute did not make sense to the translators, so they changed it and in doing so changed the context a bit. It would take revelation to understand this passage with the correct translation.
    but Satan did not use the Hebrew for Curse, Satan actually meant bless. It's the Word the Holy Spirit picked out of all the other Words that mean curse, so it should have been translated consistent. Only in Job and only in a few scriptures is the Word translated Curse.

    Job will Bless you to your face God.
    bârak means to bless, and only gets it's Concordance definition from the way it was translated into Curse, the actual Hebrew Word means to bless back, or salute back for what was given.


    Job 1:21 And said, Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed Barak be the name of the LORD.

    Job did exactly what Satan said He would do, but we would not know that because they translated the Word in that one place to curse instead of bless.

    Why are you hung on on Pre-Tribulation. That is a doctrine, not a false teaching that will lead anyone astray. It's 7 years off from Post trib teaching as the Doctrines match until it is determined when we get to be with the Lord and if we go through tribulation.

    On my own forum I have a thread honoring both positions because It is not all that important, we serve the Lord no matter if it's pre or post trib.

    Also your "Falling Away" Theory as mentioned by Paul needs examined. Apostasia is a Greek Female noun and there is nothing in it's Verb form that denotes some deflection from the truth, nor can a Female noun tell us what it's realationship to something else is. That is why it's a Female noun, and not a Verb. So the Word can not mean falling away from the truth, as a Female noun can't tell us what it's falling away from.

    Apostasia means departing from a previous position. Since we know the Son of perdition is revelaed after this Apostasia, we have to get the meaning of the Female noun from the Article. Otherwise it reads like this.

    We must depart from the Son of Perdition before that day comes.

    That would be incorrect, so we know that by our gathering together unto the Lord Jesus must come first as that is the subject of the article and a departure before the Son of perdition is revealed.

    To read it they way your reading it, there would need to be a Verb like
    parapiptō

    It's an action that means to deflect from what is true, or apostatize. The Holy Spirit did not choose that word though.

    Blessings.
     
  9. Definitely. There are so many. My thinking is, if Paul were to walk into the church we attend, what would he find wrong with it?

    We need to judge the place we attend. Council of elders present (y). One dominant preacher (n). I like the Catholic church in this regard. The ranking of priest / bishop / cardinal form a wise council. No priest can get away with heresy / malpractice for too long.

    Paul's solution to combat false teaching was 1 Tim3. The need to have qualified elders and deacons.
     
  10. In Paul's time, nobody could just vote him out like we have today. I think it good one person be in charge as pastor (priest) and not be under another higher body that dictates what you teach and who you have to let be in charge of things.
     
  11. Agreed. Every 'new message / new revelation / new discovery' just scares me. I am just thinking how the early heresies against the Catholic church....orthodox, pentecostal, montanism into protestants with their Lutheranism, Calvinism and Anglicanism are a breath of fresh air compared to what we have today...emerging church, weak theology, ecumenical theology, Jehovah witnesses, liberal and liberation theology.

    The path we are headed down is = no Christianity. Make teaching liberal today and tomorrow we won't even teach from the bible. This weak and liberal teaching is simply not Christianity. It must be defined as such. We excluded Jehovah witnesses from being a Christian denomination, we must do the same with many more movements today.
     
  12. Really good post TC, thanks! I believe in pre-trib. But made for a really good read irrespective.
     
  13. Definitely. It meets every single 'identifying mark' by Paul.
     
  14. Even when those above are qualified elders? We must look closer at the qualifying requirements. I would err on the side of a council of wise and respected elders over a one man show any-day. Unless of course that one man was Paul, Moses or Elijah ;). How many men like that exist today? Can we even name one?
     
    ixoye_8 likes this.
  15. it has taken down some major denominations, and I am more concerned with that than someone believing in some prosperity gospel because God does bless and prosper.

    I thought you forgot about me today Brother King, glad to see I am still on the list :)
     
  16. Holiday plans keeping me busy ;). I was thinking its bad timing to be discussing false teaching. But then every Christmas just gets more sour with the state of the church. Many celebrate Christmas at their spiritualist / liberal church :cry:. Its like spitting on His grave.
     
  17. the first 3 1/2 years of the 7 years, cannot actually be called tribulation .. so in that sense, I would concur in pre-trib .. as the church does not go through the last 3 1/2 years .. however there will be those who will find the faith during that Apostasy, but will be greatly persecuted (jailed and killed) ..

    Rev 3:10 ‘Because you have kept the word of My perseverance, I also will keep you from the hour of testing, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.

    Dan 7:25 ‘He will speak out against the Most High and wear down the saints of the Highest One, and he will intend to make alterations in times and in law; and they will be given into his hand for a time, times, and half a time.

    Rev 13:7 It was also given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation was given to him.
    Rev 13:10 If anyone is destined for captivity, to captivity he goes; if anyone kills with the sword, with the sword he must be killed. Here is the perseverance and the faith of the saints.


    Apostasy is the formal disaffiliation from or abandonment or renunciation of a religion.
    apostasia = female noun (chosen to describe the bride/church event)
    apostasion = neuter noun

    Rapture ..

    Mat 24:30 “And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power and great glory.
    Mat 24:31 “And He will send forth His angels with A GREAT TRUMPET and THEY WILL GATHER TOGETHER His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.

    1Th 4:17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.

    Eph 4:30 Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
    (the HS who restrains, no longer will restrain, because He indwells the elect and is removed with the elect)

    Apostacy of Church after elect gone ..
    and the Anti-Christ is revealed ..

    2Th 2:6 And you know what restrains him now, so that in his time he will be revealed.
    2Th 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way.
    2Th 2:8 Then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming;
    2Th 2:9 that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders,

    Rev 13:8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.

    Mat 24:22 “Unless those days had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short.

    2Th 2:2 that you not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.
    2Th 2:3 Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction,
    2Th 2:4 who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God.

    2nd Coming ..
     


  18. Not heard this view before, very interesting............. Apostasy of the Church after we are gone.
    It makes sense, once you remove all light, things go haywire.

    A few issues I have though................

    The day of Christ, Day of the Lord Jesus Christ, Ends something. (Not sure what, but things stop when that term is mentioned)

    Translated, it's the day for those that call Jesus Lord or Christ's anointed.
    Christ, is Greek and means Anointed one, reserved as like a title for Jesus (Messiah) but also us in Him as His anointed.


    Church.................... Or the anointed Church.

    1Co_1:8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
    Php_1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
    Php_1:10
    That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ;
    Php_2:16 Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.

    2Th_2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.


    Day of the Lord
    Day of the Lord Jesus Christ

    signify two different events.

    If we are taken in Matt 24:30, then we go through the whole deal. we escape nothing.

    If we are delivered at the time of tribulation like Dan 12 says, then it's only the Lord's chosen (elect) who wait through tribulation that were left or converted during tribulation. Those that are not "IN CHRIST" like us, but those that belong to God and the lamb who did not worship the beast or receive the mark.

    Rev_14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

    These were chosen by God and the Lamb because they followed, not because they were saved or born again. Elect means chosen.
    We had to believe in our hearts and confess with out mouth the Lord Jesus, and saved by Grace through our faith in him. Just following by works does not cut it.
    Unless your a Calvinist, then you have to use your faith in the Blood.

    The days are cut short for these chosen or elect.

    Your right, Apostasia is a Greek Female noun. Greek female nouns are not Greek verbs though and a Female noun can't determine on it's own a relationship to something. That is why it's a Female Noun.

    They Forsake (Apostasia) Moses. Apostasia means to depart from something previous stood by. It's Root Verb just means to depart. There is no forsaking of truth or any connection of meaning to our English Word Apostasy.

    Apostasia needs something to depart from and Paul does not give anything after which would be normal for a Female noun to connect to. Apostasia can't mean deflection from truth or turning from truth because Female nouns can't define themselves that way.

    Faith is a Female Noun but does not denote faith in what, or how much faith.
    Wedding is a Female Noun, but does not denote who's wedding or even the location.

    You get the idea.

    Most correctly translated.

    WEB:
    2Th 2:3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For it will not be, unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of destruction,................................................. our gathering together unto him,


    There is no place in Scripture that tells us something considered a Church would go into Apostasy. If it's a church, and considered a Church by the Lord Jesus, then it can't go into apostasy.

    If the Holy Spirit meant Apostasy, and not Apostasia then there would have been a Greek verb.

    parapiptō means to apostatize or fall in error.

    If you want a pre-trib of any type, you have to split Matt 24 into two separate events.
    Events not in order, just different events.

    Event 1: Happens immediately after Tribulation and the 6th and 7th seal with the 7th angel blowing his trumpet. That is a timed event by which people will hide from the face of the lamb at the release of the 6th seal and wait that 1/2 of silence on the earth in terror before he comes.

    And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
    (Rev 6:16-17)

    Event 2:
    Nobody knows the day or the hour, so it's not event 1 which can be timed down to the last 1/2 hour after the sun, moon and stars get wiped out.

    It's like the days of Noah where nobody knew a thing until Noah and his family entered the boat, then one is taken and one is left. It's an event for those that call Jesus Lord, not those that Keep the Sabbath or from Judah.

    Everyone was having a great time until suddenly people are taken, Just like Paul told that we are caught up in the air, but we don't land on earth but come back with the Lord (Rev 19)

    Event 2 is for those that call Jesus Lord. Nobody knows when, it's sudden with no warning unlike Event 1 where everyone suffered all the trumpets, seals, and vials.

    Mat 24:42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

    It's this event the Lord said we escape, it's before anything drastic like the first trumpet sounds raining fire on the earth with blood and hail burning up 1/3 of all the trees on the planet. One working in the field, one is taken. This tells us it could be daytime to work in the field. After the 6th seal it will be really dark everywhere.

    Blessings.
     
  19. Tribulation ends and then the wrath begins...scripture is very clear on this:

    The tribulation ends at the fifth seal:


    Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:



    Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them and it was said unto them that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.



    Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

    Rev 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

    This group is revealed at the fifth seal, making the first four seals the time of tribulation. There is more proof of this so just keep reading:

    Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:


    Mar 13:24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moonshall not give her light



    Isaiah 13 confirms it:


    Isa 13:9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.
    Isa 13:10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine




    The start of the sixth seal describes the same thing:

    Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;




    It is clear that the fifth seal is the end of tribulation and the sixth seal is the start of the day of the Lord-thereby separating the tribulation from the wrath. There cannot be a rapture before the tribulation because the trumpets are not handed out until the seventh seal:

    Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

    Rev 8:2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.


    There is still more proof so lets keep going...


    Read this one more time-the fifth seal reveals those who came out of great tribulation:

    Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
    Rev 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

    After the tribulation-at the sixth seal, the sun will go dark:

    Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

    Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

    Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

    Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

    Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?



    The wrath starts after the tribulation is over.

    That is why Jesus comes on the clouds after the tribulation..it is all consistent:

    Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
    Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

    Mar 13:24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
    Mar 13:25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
    Mar 13:26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.


    2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,


    Mat 13:49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,


    1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.


    Give up on your pre tribulation rapture theory and your 7 year tribulation with an antichrist in Jerusalem. Download the PDF that I gave a link to and read it. You cannot refute scripture it is plain as day...

    Click here to read the PDF on the falling away: 'The falling away is here.PDF'


     
  20. I quit studying, or reading Herbert W. Armstrong teaching. Even though I thought he was pretty good, I think his teaching has led me astray in some aspects. On others, I think he did understand.

    I'm pretty much sticking to just reading/studying the bible, and I've gone back to a site I did a lot of study through, and I feel the instructors there are pretty good. They don't get into much speculation, and if they do, they tell you they are speculating.

    I've gone through a great deal of study in the first testament, and I feel it sheds a great deal of light on the second testament.

    I'm studying the book of Judges now, and it shows a lot of what is happening in todays church. Like how the Hebrews would fall away, as opposed to how today, the church is syncretizing to un-Godly observances.
     
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