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What Exactly Do "lukewarm" And "free Indeed" Look Like?

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by gideon, Oct 15, 2013.

  1. I think it important that we make sure we are using the same definitions though of "free indeed" and "lukewarm". Not yours or mine, but God's, amen?

    As to whether or not we are lukewarm, here is the test. If sin is still our master at times, if self still gets to rule the roost, if we are not walking in all the light He has given us all the time, we are lukewarm. We view it as comparison of us to others, saying "Well, at least I am not ______" but the word tells us:

    "They that compare themselves among themselves are not wise".

    It is not whether WE think we are lukewarm, but what God thinks. Lest we forget, it is the cold ones that Jesus said He would rather we be than lukewarm. Why? Because a cold one KNOWS he is in bad shape and can thus repent. But a lukewarm brother or sister is often not aware of his state in God's eyes, so he ends up going through the motions, his service becomes a ritual, going through the motions. He may be convinced he is ok because he may not do the "grosser sins". He or she may actually look outwardly very nice, but the sin that is not defeated and eradicated, the old nature that has not been put off forever will eventually harden his heart, to the point that he sees no danger at all in his state. Keith Green called it "asleep in the light". By continuing to use grace as an excuse to stay right where he is ends up a dangerous path. This can actually evolve into so leaning on grace during temptation, that a man counts on grace before he even sins, assuring himself that all will still be well. THAT is dangerous ground. THAT is lukewarmness.

    I heard a good and true story defining what it is to be HOT for God. See what you think....

    A condemned man was to be executed and the priest came, as was his duty, to administer last rites. As he walked in front of the prisoner towards the gallows, praying, the prisoner stopped him and asked "Do you believe in hell and it is for eternity?" The priest stopped going through his religious but non-heart felt prayers and answered that he did. The condemned man, soon to face such a horrid place, had these words which pierced me as I read them for the very first time.

    "If I believed in such a place, and that all the lost would end up there, suffering for eternity, though all of England were strewn with razor shards of broken glass, I would crawl across it on my knees to save just one from such a place."

    Hot saints have passion for lost souls. It just follows. Lukewarm saints, however, do not have the gaze of eternity, but their eyes are more firmly fixed on this world, this life, THEIR life. Hardened hearts have been deceived by sin, and have no burden for the lost. Oh, we may pass out a few tracts, but as to weeping between the porch and the alter over a lost friend, a spouse, a child,a neighbor? Lukewarm does not do that.

    Gene, what I am sharing is that Christ called us all to walk in the glorious liberty of the children of God, free indeed. This is not just a place of just pardon, but a place where darkness is not in us any more. Its grip has been broken.

    Jesus defined free this way.

    "He that commits sin is a slave to sin, but whom the Son sets free is free indeed."

    That is the only true definition of what our walk was always destined to be. If one is found walking there? Praise God! And even if a man is NOT walking there, but believes it possible, thank God for that faith! I will even go so far as to state that if a man is walking far from that liberty, bound by strong addictions, and even if he does not belief it possible that our God can keep him from falling, but IF that man hates his life, his sins, his lack of passion, and in brokenness comes to God and cries out as a wretched man for liberty, freedom from guilt and shame and self-loathing, praise God for that one! That cold one WILL be made hot!

    But how many there are who are not free, but "doing OK", They are not tightly bound to disgusting types of sins and addictions. Yet, if the truth be told, how many there are who are using grace as simply a covering, a ticket to heaven, never hungering to be freed from the evil that is still within them? These peoples, whoever they may be, you, me, the American church, any such are.... lukewarm.

    The word tells us that godliness with contentment is great gain. But woe unto any of us who have swallowed the lie that we ought to be content with a grace that does not bring with it godliness, without true victory over the evil that nailed our Lord to the cross.

    Paul once lived in Romans 7 but he escaped its grasp into Romans 8! Why? His heart hated his wretched life.... and with all that was within him, he cried out for a deliverer. He could not be satisfied with forgiveness and yet continue to live out his life as a flesh-ruled self centered man. He wanted to walk pleasing to God as a living sacrifice, and the fact that he couldn't do it drove him to the edge. This is the path, the "edge", we too are called to tread, and thank God to pass through into the light, but up til now we have become far too content with far too little. God is awakening us to what He has for us, and calls us to become overcomers, and to discover the secret to victory over the world, the flesh, and the devil. If any is walking here, I rejoice. If not, I say the things that can lead them back to the God who can keep us from falling and "cause us" to walk as obedient, holy children.

    Gene, may God bless you richly.

  2. Gideon.........
    Gene certainly does not need me to speak for him and I do not have a dog in this hunt, but IMO I would not address another member so directly as you did in an open forum like this. That is why the site has PM available. That stands for "PERSONAL message I think. IMO that would have been the way to speak more clearly than the way you just did it.

    Your post here sounds a little condescending to me, but that is just me.
  3. Major, my post was not directed at Gene, but at the condition we have all been steeped in. We have much truth, and forgiveness is well understood and it is wonderful. But the word of God is clear. God sent His son to deliver us from the POWER of darkness as well as its penalty, amen?

    Jesus told us that sin shall not have dominion over us, that we are not in the flesh and owe it nothing. Is this what we have been taught? If we have swallowed truth mixed with error, it will rob us of the joy of walking in victory as overcomers.

    How can we get back on the path uness we admit that we have deviated? I apologize if my post seemed inappropriate to you. Condescending is the last thing I want to appear. The fact is, I do not want eyes on me at all, but back on the promises of the Bible. It is time we read what God said and do not "interpret" them based on our experiences to date, or what we have all accepted as truth. The promises ARE true, and if we simply read them and ask ourselves..... "Do I believe what it says?" Our God does not mince words. He says what he means and His promises are yea and amen...amen?

    Listen to these two words:

    Our shield of faith WILL quench all the fiert darts launched at us from the enemy of our souls.

    Our God will NOT allow us to be tempted above our ability to resist them.

    Now, if this is not our experience, what shall we do? Close our ears, and ignore the obvious and return to nice church services as the world drifts on towards an eternity without our wonderful savior? Or, shall we fall before Hima nd admit this is NOT what we have found. It is NOT what we have even believed is possible. Who is right?Will we bow our knee and ask Him to make it real for us? Do we WANT it to be real?

    Again, forgive me if I have offended you or Gene. It was never my intent. It is not easy sharing such a message without sounding like a know it all. I pray God increases my love and compassion and humility as I try to share the full power of grace..... to deliver us from the power of darkness and make us overcomers in these last days.


  4. It is not a big deal to me and I hear what you are saying but when I read your post you said.........
    "Gene, what I am sharing is that Christ called us all to walk in the glorious liberty of the children of God, free indeed. This is not just a place of just pardon, but a place where darkness is not in us any more. Its grip has been broken."

    That seems to me that you were certainly pointing the message to him. But be that as it may, it was just something I noticed and has nothing to do with Gene at all.

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