Watch And Be Ready For What???

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Straightshot said:
The reformers and later reconstrucionist spin offs were not only wrong about the study of the the Lord's prophetic word and did not understand them in the first place, they proceeded to concoct their own proprietary ambitions claims to have the truth against the same claims of one another

And they made their error by inserting the idea of a Euro centered Pope/Antichrist/ revived Roman empire

None of this is in the prophetic scriptures and only speculated and inserted by them

They lacked sound prophetical study and did not have the hindsight we have today, and instead they build their own proprietary religions upon the offset against the RCC .... and all were anti-Semitic [anti-Israel] to the max

At the same time the reconstructionists made up cult like dogmas to separate themselves from the others [JWs, SDAs, Calvinists, Mormons, William Branham followers, H. B. Armstrong followers, etc. are prime examples]
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The Protestant Reformers exposed the Antichrist of prophecy exactly as it is found in Scripture, which made necessary the false interpretations of Jesuit Futurism and Jesuit Preterism, and the further corruptions by Maitland, Irving, Darby, Scofield, and their posterity who were never taught accurate church history and the blasphemous reign of the most wicked institution to ever grace the top-side of the earth. I fear that those who subscribe to Jesuit Futurism will embrace the false Christ who will precede the true and be lost forever.

As for your remark on "cults", a Christian cult teaches contrary to Scripture. Scripture teaches that the Ten Commandments are written on the heart of New Covenant Christians, but the rest of Christendom teaches that we may safely disregard, to one degree or another, the Ten Commandments, which is contrary to Scripture.
 
As I recall, as a child, My Mother had christmas cards made of it and the Reverend Quinn had done missionary work in China and had gotten it from the source (He was Pastor of our Church - Methodists. (Maybe I shouldn't say - but personally I liked her sent to a select few cards where on the front of the card it reads: Jesus Loves You. Inside it said: But everyone else thinks you are a.....")
Anyways - my point was: once you see it - you can't unsee it - for me about 55 yrs now). It's like that with the rapture verses. Your view (I really don't mean to offend) to me seems matrixed. For me - all of the verses/scripture have to agree. When I was arguing about this with Major - long ago posts when I didn't see it - He told me, frustrated, "that it just fits" and I can't say I saw it then. And my worry was similar to yours: that people thinking rapture were in danger when it might not come and lose what faith they had. God's wrath is not meant for us - the tribulation - Jacob's trouble, is meant for God's first people - the Jews. They were the first and they shall be the last. In regards to Catholicism, I have major problems, currently with their leadership and I dunno how all that will fold out - but I think the common members will be saved. If you can't accept that you may be wrong about a passage(s) of scripture, then you aren't really looking for the truth. And you don't give me that vibe. See my signature - there's 2 ways to be fooled.
Blessings to you and yours.
 
Phoneman777 said:
Major, the Rapture idea to which you are hopelessly devoted originated with Jesuit Francisco Ribera, not the SDA church, and was soundly rejected by Protestant Reformers for over 300 years before the SDA church ever existed. Please stop spreading misinformation about the history of your beliefs. I can only assume that you do so in order to conceal the fact that you have chosen to embrace as truth a doctrine from an institution, the Roman Catholic church, which has failed to achieve even a Biblical position on the most fundamental Christian teaching - salvation by grace through faith alone - and countless other positions as well, among which are that the Pope is God on Earth; submission to him is necessary for salvation; Mary serves as Intercessor; bread and wine are transubstantiated into literal body and blood of Jesus; idolatrous worship of "saints", and too, too many more to list. There is an abundance of resources online that will confirm what I've written here, to please be assured that I am not making this up.
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That's just simply not true... you hate the catholics so much that whatever "thought" you disagree with you camouflage it in a coat of Catholicism. Just because the Catholics claim something doesn't mean they own it - like Augustine of Hippo - Catholics didn't even exist then! So stop and I mean STOP with all the different slanders and stick to the word of God, not pseudo dogma.
 
Phoneman777 said:
Major, the Rapture idea to which you are hopelessly devoted originated with Jesuit Francisco Ribera, not the SDA church, and was soundly rejected by Protestant Reformers for over 300 years before the SDA church ever existed. Please stop spreading misinformation about the history of your beliefs. I can only assume that you do so in order to conceal the fact that you have chosen to embrace as truth a doctrine from an institution, the Roman Catholic church, which has failed to achieve even a Biblical position on the most fundamental Christian teaching - salvation by grace through faith alone - and countless other positions as well, among which are that the Pope is God on Earth; submission to him is necessary for salvation; Mary serves as Intercessor; bread and wine are transubstantiated into literal body and blood of Jesus; idolatrous worship of "saints", and too, too many more to list. There is an abundance of resources online that will confirm what I've written here, to please be assured that I am not making this up.
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I am not Catholic however if you want to believe that the Rapture was their doing.......then they got it right.
Just as they have the importance of Mary as the virgin mother. Not that she is divine or sinless but that she was THE virgin blessed by God to bring the Lord Jesus incarnate into this world. They got that right to.

Now I have said this to you many times my brother. It does not matter WHO received the revelation from God concerning the Rapture. You are so indoctrinated that you miss the whole point. The point is that every single Scripture concerning the Rapture IS FOUND IN THE BIBLE FOR EVERYONE TO READ FOR THEMSELVES.
The Rapture event is found or referred to or pictured in Scriptures from Genesis to the Revelation. It is almost like the Doctrine of Jesus as He is seen in every book of the Scriptures because the Scriptures are about HIM.

We, me, YOU everyone can read what the Scriptures say about this Rapture event and it does not matter WHO came up with it.

Martin Luther received the saved by grace doctrine and it had been in the Scriptures for about 1600 years when he read it, understood and proclaimed it. Now......do you accept it or reject when YOU read it today????????

You continue to blame the Jesuits, the Roman Catholics and Mary and everyone else who disagree with your SDA theology.

Personally and finally........I do not care if you do not accept the Bible teaching on the Rapture event. That is YOUR choice in life and I am weary going in circles with you over something that YOU CHOOSE TO REJECT when it is right in front of you.
YOU donot believe it............OK with me my brother.

BUT your choices in life should never lead you to question and or condemn anyone else for there's.
 
Straightshot said:
"so is the "day of the Lord" the Rapture or not?"

The answer is in scripture and I would suggest that you make an effort to find it for yourself .... your choice

But you will do .... what you will do

Denying the Lord's promise on the matter is not a good idea for sure .... and this behavior actually makes no good sense because you have nothing to lose by taking Him at His word

And you might have everything to lose by your denial

No literate Bible believing Christian who knows the details of prophetic scripture will ever be fooled by Satan's beast because this one has already been exposed in detail and will easily be recognized by his behavior and actions ..... all of this has already been documented beforehand

The argument proposed by post-tribulation thinking is that if one believes in what you call the a pre-tribulation "rapture" and it does not happen that those expecting will either lose their faith and or will be deceived by Satan's beast

This is highly improbable and not representative of a true believer's standing .... neither thing would ever happen

A true believer who is well versed in scripture, and I do not know of any who are not, would never be deceived on this issue

And then for the post-tribulation pied pipers to call the Lord's promise a "lie of the Devil" is unadulterated blasphemy and should be suspect of piper

The "Day of the Lord" is His coming day of trial and judgment upon an unbelieving world [Psalms 2; Ezekiel 39; Joel 3; Micah 5; Zechariah 12; 14; Jude 1:14-15; Revelation 6:12-17; 14:8; 16:1-16; 17:16-18; 19:1-6; 19:11-21] ..... to be followed by His millennial kingdom upon the earth [Micah 4; Revelation 20:4]

And in the process He will seek to destroy all human rule to make way for His own .... and unprecedented time of vexation, confusion, deception, and destruction upon the earth that will last for 2550 days

But just before He will call His true ecclesia out just as He says

[1 Corinthians 15:20-23; 15:51-58; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; 5:1-9; 2 Thessalonians 2:1; Revelation 3:10; 18:4]

Here is the evidence for those dwelling as immortals in the heavenly state of existence during the coming tribulation

[Revelation 4:4; 5:1-10; 7:9-17; 11:1; 12:12; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-9]

Here are the same contending with the Lord against Satan's beast and his human followers at Armageddon [Revelation 19:11-21]

And the same ruling with Him over His coming millennial kingdom of mortals [Revelation 20:4] [those on thrones ..... the symbol of His government]

If you are looking for a resurrection just after the tribulation of those days you are looking in the wrong place .... the gatherings of Matthew 25:29-31; Isaiah 11; 27:12-13; [of Israel] and Matthew 25:31-46 [of the nations of the Gentiles] are not resurrections of anyone, but for separation of the mortal survivors of the tribulation period .... those found believing will enter and populate His millennial kingdom upon the earth .... those found in unbelief will be rejected

If you are looking for your resurrection at the 7th judgment trumpet sounding of Revelation this will not come ..... there are no resurrections scheduled with this trumpet

If you enter the tribulation period and turn to the Lord in repentance you will most likely be martyred for your faith .... but you will have to wait for your resurrection at the end of the battle of Armageddon [6:9-11; 14:13; 15:2-3; 20:4 [those beheaded]]

And I will assume that you are not one of the Lord's two prophets of chapter 11 .... these two will be resurrected just before the battle of Armageddon after being killed by Satan's beast [Revelation 11]

The last trumpet call for the Lord's ecclesia of both the dead in Christ and those living at the time is a very different trumpet sounding and not associated with any of the 7 judgment trumpets or the sounding of the "great" gathering trumpet just after the days of the tribulation which will herald the gathering of mortal Israelites that survive the same [Isaiah 11; 27:12-13; Matthew 25:29-31]

The first trumpet sounding for the Lord's church is found here [Revelation 1:10] .... the Lord's first formal communication to the assembled church [Revelation 1:1-1:20]

And I might suggest to you that if you are entertaining the idea of the post-tribulation pied pipers that the Lord's pre-tribulation "harpazo" action is a lie of the devil .... that you consider the possibility of the devil's lie being that of the post-tribulation ruse

Satan is coming to the earth for a short time at the Lord's casting and he will be out to deceive and destroy as may humans that he can hunt down with the intent of keeping them from the truth and stealing their potential salvation

I am just saying do not let him snooker you into the tribulation if in fact you are alive at the time
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Well said! I am blessed to read your comments.
 
Abdicate said:
That's just simply not true... you hate the catholics so much that whatever "thought" you disagree with you camouflage it in a coat of Catholicism. Just because the Catholics claim something doesn't mean they own it - like Augustine of Hippo - Catholics didn't even exist then! So stop and I mean STOP with all the different slanders and stick to the word of God, not pseudo dogma.
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Amen!
 
Silk said:
As I recall, as a child, My Mother had christmas cards made of it and the Reverend Quinn had done missionary work in China and had gotten it from the source (He was Pastor of our Church - Methodists. (Maybe I shouldn't say - but personally I liked her sent to a select few cards where on the front of the card it reads: Jesus Loves You. Inside it said: But everyone else thinks you are a.....")
Anyways - my point was: once you see it - you can't unsee it - for me about 55 yrs now). It's like that with the rapture verses. Your view (I really don't mean to offend) to me seems matrixed. For me - all of the verses/scripture have to agree. When I was arguing about this with Major - long ago posts when I didn't see it - He told me, frustrated, "that it just fits" and I can't say I saw it then. And my worry was similar to yours: that people thinking rapture were in danger when it might not come and lose what faith they had. God's wrath is not meant for us - the tribulation - Jacob's trouble, is meant for God's first people - the Jews. They were the first and they shall be the last. In regards to Catholicism, I have major problems, currently with their leadership and I dunno how all that will fold out - but I think the common members will be saved. If you can't accept that you may be wrong about a passage(s) of scripture, then you aren't really looking for the truth. And you don't give me that vibe. See my signature - there's 2 ways to be fooled.
Blessings to you and yours.
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Very well said. I can see the Holy Spirit effecting your thoughts and words!!!
 
Phoneman777 said:
The Protestant Reformers exposed the Antichrist of prophecy exactly as it is found in Scripture, which made necessary the false interpretations of Jesuit Futurism and Jesuit Preterism, and the further corruptions by Maitland, Irving, Darby, Scofield, and their posterity who were never taught accurate church history and the blasphemous reign of the most wicked institution to ever grace the top-side of the earth. I fear that those who subscribe to Jesuit Futurism will embrace the false Christ who will precede the true and be lost forever.

As for your remark on "cults", a Christian cult teaches contrary to Scripture. Scripture teaches that the Ten Commandments are written on the heart of New Covenant Christians, but the rest of Christendom teaches that we may safely disregard, to one degree or another, the Ten Commandments, which is contrary to Scripture.
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Again......what you say is just not true!!!!
 
Only not true .... but a reflection of highly apostate thinking designed to destroy the very fabric of the Lord's word in scripture

In fact the real sham used to accuse the the opposite
 
Straightshot said:
Only not true .... but a reflection of highly apostate thinking designed to destroy the very fabric of the Lord's word in scripture

In fact the real sham used to accuse the the opposite
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Yes sir.....I have said the very words to him personally. He is entrenched in the SDA dogma, heavy into works based theogy and hates the RCC. Makes for very confusing conversations.
 
Agreed

Ellen G. White was a false prophetess and the historical SDA still places her "Great Controversy" writings on par with the Bible

I do detect a preteristic flavor as well particularly with regard for Israel .... that 70 AD was the time of the end and that the Lord is finished with Israel .... this is replacement theology

White taught that her church was the "new Israel" the same as do the SDAs today

This false teaching is all extra-biblical nonsense and not supported by scripture
 
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Abdicate said:
That's just simply not true... you hate the catholics so much that whatever "thought" you disagree with you camouflage it in a coat of Catholicism. Just because the Catholics claim something doesn't mean they own it - like Augustine of Hippo - Catholics didn't even exist then! So stop and I mean STOP with all the different slanders and stick to the word of God, not pseudo dogma.
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Abdicate, your reckless accusation of hatred needs to stop, and I mean stop it now. I do not hate anything but that which Jesus hated: false doctrines that blind people to satanic deception, and that's exactly what Jesuit Futurism does. Case in point: only a blinded person would fail to see that the reason Paul warns us not to "sleep" is so that we can successfully avoid being overtaken by the day of the Lord which will do so to the lost who are yet now in darkness and asleep. If Jesuit Futurism is true, then who cares if we sleep or not since we're going to be gone long before that day overtakes the lost?
 
Major said:
Yes sir.....I have said the very words to him personally. He is entrenched in the SDA dogma, heavy into works based theogy and hates the RCC. Makes for very confusing conversations.
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What is this "hate the catholics" that I'm being accused of? The only thing I hate is false, unBiblical doctrine. Paul spoke of these false doctrines as "smooth sayings". What could be "smoother" a saying than to tell people that the guilt of their sinful habits has been removed by Jesus' blood so they are free to continue that sinful habit and still make heaven, or that you don't have to prepare for the "Tribulation" because you won't be here and if you happen to be left behind when the church is raptured, you still get a second chance at salvation (some teach you have a chance during the millennium)?
 
Straightshot said:
Agreed

Ellen G. White was a false prophetess and the historical SDA still places her "Great Controversy" writings on par with the Bible

I do detect a preteristic flavor as well particularly with regard for Israel .... that 70 AD was the time of the end and that the Lord is finished with Israel .... this is replacement theology

White taught that her church was the "new Israel" the same as do the SDAs today

This false teaching is all extra-biblical nonsense and not supported by scripture
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You are absolutely incorrect. The Bible clearly teaches that God is through with Israel, from Isaiah 5 down to Jesus' very own words. It's dispensationalism which is unBiblical.
 
Enough.

This thread will be closed and any attempt to start a similar one will result in warning points.
 
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