Very Disheartened And Tired

JustPassingThru said:
Actually, it's not our sins that keeps us from inheriting Heaven, it's our sin nature.

Jesus died, paid the price and took the penalty for all of the sins of the World on the cross, Father, in His sovereignty, has willed to not remember them and they have been placed in a sack, tied close and thrown into the deepest part of the ocean, our sins have been separated from us as far as the East is from the West.

To go to Heaven we need to be inheritors of the country, that comes with our new birth (Paul tells us we are citizens of heaven), with the Holy Spirit as our father and the Word of God our mother 1 Pet 1:23, we are new creations in Christ. 2 Cor 5:17, ...hence, as children of the owner of Heaven we inherit Heaven, which is illustrated in Lev chapters 1-7, the five offerings, two are obligatory, the sin and the trespass offerings and the other three, burnt, grain, peace are optional.

Blessings,

Gene
Click to expand...

Yes, that is the truth. It is our unrighteous nature, unredeemed by the blood of Christ that prevents us from gaining heaven.

I should have explained more---that even in a person that others deem a good person, should he merely commit only one sin in his life---that would keep him from heaven's reward, because he is not good in God's eyes without the blood covering that comes with faith in Jesus Christ.
 
Euphemia said:
Yes, that is the truth. It is our unrighteous nature, unredeemed by the blood of Christ that prevents us from gaining heaven.

I should have explained more---that even in a person that others deem a good person, should he merely commit only one sin in his life---that would keep him from heaven's reward, because he is not good in God's eyes without the blood covering that comes with faith in Jesus Christ.
Click to expand...


Yes you are correct, that is the trespass offering, but there has to be the sin offering and that corresponds with being born again, that's what is so sad with those that reject the Gospel, their debt is paid in full, all they have to do is get their ticket punched, i.e., be born again, just receive Jesus into their hearts! It's so simple that even a simpleton like me understood it. PTL

Blessing,

Gene
 
JustPassingThru said:
Yes you are correct, that is the trespass offering, but there has to be the sin offering and that corresponds with being born again, that's what is so sad with those that reject the Gospel, their debt is paid in full, all they have to do is get their ticket punched, i.e., be born again, just receive Jesus into their hearts! It's so simple that even a simpleton like me understood it. PTL

Blessing,

Gene
Click to expand...
LOL Gene you are not a simpleton! You are actually really smart!
 
JustPassingThru said:
Are you saying I wasn't a sinner before I was born again (?) and also I'm not a sinner now?

1. To answer your question, no the blind man did not write the book, John did, what has that have to do with anything, the Holy Spirit inspired John to write the record of the Life of Jesus as he saw it, that doesn't change the fact that what the blind man said was merely conjecture, the Word records the words of many people, animals, Angels, the devil and demons, so are you saying everything that was spoken in the Word is Divine Truth?

2. What about James saying earthly wisdom comes from demons, and Jesus said the devil is a liar and the father of lies, so then, ...earthly demonic wisdom and the lies of the devil is to be considered Divine Truth too?

3. Or the witnesses at the trial of Jesus that said, "He said destroy this Temple and I will raise it up in three days," that was what Jesus said, but that wasn't the meaning of what He said, is that Divine Truth, does that mean we can tell half truths and it's not lying?

4. Or let's take Simon Magnus, he said to Peter, "sell me this power," talking about being filled with the Holy Spirit (which incidentally is being perpetrated by many charlatans today in the ilk of Simon), is that Divine Truth, can we buy the filling of the Holy Spirit?

5. Surely you don't believe these few examples I have given, and there are hundreds more, are Divine Truths we are to receive and appropriate into lives?

6. I have learned there is a simple test to determine if what I believe is correct, ...is there just one single verse in all of the Word that contradicts what I believe, that makes Jesus a liar, if so, then what I believe is wrong, ....it's as simple as that. John 6:44, 39

Blessings,

Gene
Click to expand...
1. Yes, everything spoken in the word is divine truth 2 Tim 3:16. As you said, the unsaved blind man did not write John. What has that got to do with anything? Everything! God wrote it, not an unsaved / ungodly blind man. I am not saying you are wrong to question the context of a single verse. But why would you question one that reads so easily? A clear and simple statement of fact about God.

2. No, what demons say is not divine truth. As you noted James said they give earthly wisdom and Jesus says they are all liars. What you smoking Gene?

3. There is some discernment required with that statement, like all prophecies, unlike John 9:31.

4. There is no statement of fact about God here. In that verse you do need to read the full story. John 9:31 is a statement of fact about God. Like, 'God is good'. God is loving. God does not listen to sinners. No need to read anything for context really...unless the statement swims against the current of all scripture.

5. You are sounding like River Jordan now. Do you remember her disregard for all scripture because it was all a case of ''1/3 of the stars cast to earth..... can mean anything and not 1/3 of angels cast to earth''. Would you question Psalm 136:1 like this?

6. Not necessarily. There are many stand alone verses stating facts bout God's character and nature like Jonah 4:2. An honest statement by Jonah. Just like the honest statement by John of the blind man. But as rule what you say is good ;) I agree with that. Hence I gave you these Psalm 66:18, Prov 15:29, Isa 1:11-15, Psalm 109:7, Prov 15:8, Job 27:9, Job 35:13.

Psalm 66:18 If I had cherished sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened;
Prov 15:29 The Lord is far from the wicked, but he hears the prayer of the righteous.
 
Last edited:
Euphemia said:
All sin---even just one---will keep us out of heaven.
Click to expand...
I disagree. Sin did not keep us out of Abrahams bosom BC. Jesus cleaned all them sinners (like us) and took them to Heaven. Sin never condemned to hell. Rejection of Jesus / God does. Consider how God approached Cain to give account. You think if he did he would be in hell? Giving in to mortal sin on a continuous basis is ...rejecting Jesus... whether we call ourselves Christians or not, whether we believe OSAS or not...it's all irrelevant really as God does not change. Hence verses like 1 Cor 11:31 and 1 Cor 6:9-13.

I would like to hear your commentary on Heb 10:29 and the many other verses like it. How can we ignore such verses?

I am not suggesting we not gain confidence in our salvation. But do it with all scripture.
 
Last edited:
KingJ said:
1. Yes, everything spoken in the word is divine truth 2 Tim 3:16. As you said, the unsaved blind man did not write John. What has that got to do with anything? Everything! God wrote it, not an unsaved / ungodly blind man. I am not saying you are wrong to question the context of a single verse. But why would you question one that reads so easily? A clear and simple statement of fact about God.

2. No, what demons say is not divine truth. As you noted James said they give earthly wisdom and Jesus says they are all liars. What you smoking Gene?

3. There is some discernment required with that statement, like all prophecies, unlike John 9:31.

4. There is no statement of fact about God here. In that verse you do need to read the full story. John 9:31 is a statement of fact about God. Like, 'God is good'. God is loving. God does not listen to sinners. No need to read anything for context really...unless the statement swims against the current of all scripture.

5. You are sounding like River Jordan now. Do you remember her disregard for all scripture because it was all a case of ''1/3 of the stars cast to earth..... can mean anything and not 1/3 of angels cast to earth''. Would you question Psalm 136:1 like this?

6. Not necessarily. There are many stand alone verses stating facts bout God's character and nature like Jonah 4:2. An honest statement by Jonah. Just like the honest statement by John of the blind man. But as rule what you say is good ;) I agree with that. Hence I gave you these Psalm 66:18, Prov 15:29, Isa 1:11-15, Psalm 109:7, Prov 15:8, Job 27:9, Job 35:13.

Psalm 66:18 If I had cherished sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened;
Prov 15:29 The Lord is far from the wicked, but he hears the prayer of the righteous.
Click to expand...

You have told us you have the gift of teaching..........,

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2Ti 3:16

That means the Holy Spirit told the men what they were to write, include in their book, that doesn't mean everything is Divine Truth.

Rebuke not an elder, but entreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren; 1Ti 5:1

What's this and what place does it have in your conversation?

What you smoking Gene?

This is what I was taught and what I teach,

And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. Eph 5:11, 12

Now, are you teaching that (I don't even know how to say this it is so unScriptural), ...a human before they are born again is NOT a sinner and is ALREADY righteous?

Man, that's another Gospel! Gal 1:9

Gene
 
JustPassingThru said:
Thanks GiL

But I'm not smart, neither can I take the credit, what little I know is because I've been rubbing elbows with the One who is smart, ...my Jesus, God's only Son, He's the only One! (words by Petra, YouTube - Captured in Time and Space)
Click to expand...
I know what you mean, but you are smart though haha, it's obvious xD. Count it a blessing, God made you smarter than you think :)
 
JustPassingThru said:
You have told us you have the gift of teaching..........,

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2Ti 3:16

That means the Holy Spirit told the men what they were to write, include in their book, that doesn't mean everything is Divine Truth.

Rebuke not an elder, but entreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren; 1Ti 5:1

What's this and what place does it have in your conversation?

What you smoking Gene?

This is what I was taught and what I teach,

And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. Eph 5:11, 12

Now, are you teaching that (I don't even know how to say this it is so unScriptural), ...a human before they are born again is NOT a sinner and is ALREADY righteous?

Man, that's another Gospel! Gal 1:9

Gene
Click to expand...
Where did you get this? ''''You have told us you have the gift of teaching.........'''' and this '''a human before they are born again is NOT a sinner and is ALREADY righteous?''' from my posts or past posts????

I propose you quote my passages. Because you are making no sense.
 
KingJ said:
Where did you get this? ''''You have told us you have the gift of teaching.........'''' and this '''a human before they are born again is NOT a sinner and is ALREADY righteous?''' from my posts or past posts????

I propose you quote my passages. Because you are making no sense.
Click to expand...

That's just a ploy to cover your tracks, ...YOU said it and YOU know YOU have said it, most recently back in the speaking in tongues debate (and I'm certain others here remember too), and I not going to waste my time searching for it because it's trivial compared to what you are saying here, TODAY, ...which is much, much more important!

Now please answer my question,

...are you teaching that (I don't even know how to say this it is so unScriptural), ...a human before they are born again is NOT a sinner and is ALREADY righteous?

If not, then explain what you are trying to say or imply with all of your cut and paste verses.

Please listen,

For every New Testament doctrine there is an Old Testament illustration, the Old Testament illustration of the gift of teaching is found in the book of Nehemiah,

So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading. Neh 8:8 KJV

A born again child of God with the gift of teaching given to them by the Holy Spirit and empowered for ministry by prayer and the laying on of hands by the elders in their church will be able to read the verse(s), by revelation from the Holy Spirit explain the meaning and be able, by revelation from the Holy Spirit also, to help the church understand so as to appropriate into their soul and put into practice in their daily lives/walk, the Wisdom the Holy Spirit is teaching the Church. 1 Jn 2:27

So please, no more cut and paste, anybody can do that, the problem is those reading don't/won't understand the meaning YOU have for the verse(s), so explain what you are saying and then help us to understand so that it will be beneficial to us and we will grow in the Grace and Knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ being further conformed into His image!

Gene
 
JustPassingThru said:
That's just a ploy to cover your tracks, ...YOU said it and YOU know YOU have said it, most recently back in the speaking in tongues debate (and I'm certain others here remember too), and I not going to waste my time searching for it because it's trivial compared to what you are saying here, TODAY, ...which is much, much more important!

Now please answer my question,

...are you teaching that (I don't even know how to say this it is so unScriptural), ...a human before they are born again is NOT a sinner and is ALREADY righteous?

If not, then explain what you are trying to say or imply with all of your cut and paste verses.

Please listen,

For every New Testament doctrine there is an Old Testament illustration, the Old Testament illustration of the gift of teaching is found in the book of Nehemiah,

So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading. Neh 8:8 KJV

A born again child of God with the gift of teaching given to them by the Holy Spirit and empowered for ministry by prayer and the laying on of hands by the elders in their church will be able to read the verse(s), by revelation from the Holy Spirit explain the meaning and be able, by revelation from the Holy Spirit also, to help the church understand so as to appropriate into their soul and put into practice in their daily lives/walk, the Wisdom the Holy Spirit is teaching the Church. 1 Jn 2:27

So please, no more cut and paste, anybody can do that, the problem is those reading don't/won't understand the meaning YOU have for the verse(s), so explain what you are saying and then help us to understand so that it will be beneficial to us and we will grow in the Grace and Knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ being further conformed into His image!

Gene
Click to expand...
You have made little sense from your first post here. I have asked you to quote my post. You making random statements that are just dumb. Take your question as an example. Can you quote the section that makes you think I said that....

Your silly points and questions tell me you are not reading my posts. I am not gonna reply if you can't quote.

''ploy to cover my tracks'' , ''So please, no more cut and paste, anybody can do that''....what? Please grow up!
 
Last edited:
KingJ said:
You have made little sense from your first post here. I have asked you to quote my post. You making random statements that are just dumb. Take your question as an example. Can you quote the section that makes you think I said that....

Your silly points and questions tell me you are not reading my posts. I am not gonna reply if you can't quote.

''ploy to cover my tracks'' , ''So please, no more cut and paste, anybody can do that''....what? Please grow up!
Click to expand...

Okay, ...I'm wrong, ...by your protesting you are stating/admitting you do not have the gift of teaching, I'm good with that, and that explains why you can't explain what you post, let alone answer the questions I've asked. :cool:

Blessings,

Gene
 
Gene you have been rude from post 1. I got ugly above. I apologize for that. I know its not like you. Must be something else wrong.

There is nothing I don't want to answer. Your question just seems silly like you have not read my post. I am asking you nicely to quote what I said that makes you ask that, pleeease. :love:
 
KingJ said:
When we decide to repent we are not exactly a 'sinneR'.

Then for context:

1. Did the blind man write the book of John?
2. is equally interesting / clear. We know that God does not hear sinners; but if anyone is God-fearing and does His will, He hears him. ''Since the beginning of time it has never been heard that anyone opened the eyes of a person born blind. “If this man were not from God, He could do nothing.” They answered him, “You were born entirely in sins, and are you teaching us?” So they put him out.
3. There are many verses supporting this , , , , , , .


That is not proper context though. You are twisting it. Read it 'as is'.

Work out = work out. It is inline with .

I am not suggesting work 'for' or work 'in'. No, working out is not like sports! Work out salvation in fear and trembling = judge yourself harshly that you are in the faith = you say you are saved, are you sure?= do you judge your actions and heart harshly? = How do you know that you didn't just repeat a common catch phrase at alter call = are you sure you not just brainwashing yourself into believing you are saved? = judge yourself harshly = examine yourself truthfully....daily and especially as you see the last days approaching.

Work out your salvation in fear and trembling = work out your salvation in fear and trembling.
Click to expand...


Okay, explain what you mean by this,

When we decide to repent we are not exactly a 'sinneR'.

And where did this come from?

2. is equally interesting / clear. We know that God does not hear sinners; but if anyone is God-fearing and does His will, He hears him. ''Since the beginning of time it has never been heard that anyone opened the eyes of a person born blind. “If this man were not from God, He could do nothing.” They answered him, “You were born entirely in sins, and are you teaching us?” So they put him out.

Here's the same verse from the KJV,

Joh 9:32 Since the world began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind.
Joh 9:33 If this man were not of God, he could do nothing.
Joh 9:34 They answered and said unto him, Thou wast altogether born in sins, and dost thou teach us? And they cast him out.

Compare the two:

your version,
but if anyone is God-fearing and does His will,

KJV
If this man were not of God, he could do nothing.

You aren't quoting from the King James but from some modern heretical version, so tell me how you can think you are stating Truth when the verse you are using is heresy?

Pleeeeese answer/explain these two questions and then we can talk about the other verses you have posted. :cool:

Oh, one more thing,

I know its not like you. Must be something else wrong.

It is exactly like me, I always confront false teaching, ...heh, heh, heh, I'm not from some seeker friendly church, ...I was taught to always protect the sheep!

Gene
 
False teaching :giggle: ...no, you attacking me harshly because I don't agree with you...overlooking the scriptures I am supplying.

JustPassingThru said:
Okay, explain what you mean by this,

When we decide to repent we are not exactly a 'sinneR'.
Click to expand...
Well, you made this statement...
JustPassingThru said:
I have a question about what you say, if God doesn't listen to the prayers of sinners, ...how then did I, the chief of sinners, get saved?
Click to expand...
John 9:31 says 'sinners' in contrast to 'worshippers of God' ...now you are asking me....which category someone who decides to repent of sin, falls under...

JustPassingThru said:
And where did this come from?

Compare the two:
your version,
but if anyone is God-fearing and does His will,
KJV
If this man were not of God, he could do nothing.
You aren't quoting from the King James but from some modern heretical version, so tell me how you can think you are stating Truth when the verse you are using is heresy?
Click to expand...

Gene, you are comparing verse 31 to verse 33.
 
KingJ said:
False teaching :giggle: ...no, you attacking me harshly because I don't agree with you...overlooking the scriptures I am supplying.

Well, you made this statement... John 9:31 says 'sinners' in contrast to 'worshippers of God' ...now you are asking me....which category someone who decides to repent of sin, falls under...



Gene, you are comparing verse 31 to verse 33.
Click to expand...

Yep, my bad, that's what happens when I'm in a hurry and don't use the magnifying glass, I apologize for that.

So, if I understand you correctly, you are saying at the moment I was born again I was a worshiper of God?

Blessings,

Gene
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top