Unanswered Prayers

Brother Paul said:
I believe a careful exegesis of Isaiah 53 shows that the diseases for which healing is promised are those diseases of the soul mentioned right before the promise. Physical healing of physical diseases is not promised here (though God also will and does heal these on occasion as He wills).
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Absolutely correct!!!

We can not and should not try and make the Scriptures say what they do not say but instead, accept and love what they do in fact say!
 
Relentless said:
Excellent points, JohnC. And this is the issue I have with "name it and claim it", as if we can command God to do our bidding. But the examples you gave show that we are arranged in the Body as God sees fit, and if we were all one part there would be no Body (1 Cor. 12:17-20). We are meant to work together as one Body. And to demand more spiritual gifts seems to me ingratitude for the ones we already have. But sometimes that wish for more comes from a false sense of guilt instilled by those who tell us that we only lack certain gifts because of some fault in us.
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I agree and sometimes (Most of the time) what we wish comes from a sense of pride...."Look at what I can do! Can you do that?"
 
Major said:
The Targum says: ....
"so thick was the hedge, so strong the fence, that Satan could not find the least gap to get in at, to do him any injury to his body or mind, without the divine permission; which he envied and was vexed at, and maliciously suggests that this was the motive of Job's fear of the Lord; and indeed it was an obligation upon him to fear him, but not the sole cause of it:".

Then there is this........ Eccl. 10:8 states..... “whoso breaketh an hedge, a serpent shall bite him.”

The hedge God built around Job and all his house and all he had was for his protection. God builds hedges around believers as well. There is an invisible, Spiritual wall of protection around believers. Remember these three thoughts:
1. God builds the hedge
2. Man breaks the hedge,
3. Satan enters through the broken hedge and bites.

Just had a thought.
Until 1963, children in our public schools were permitted to pray the following prayer: .......
“Almighty God. We acknowledge our dependence upon Thee and beg Thy blessings upon us, our parents, our teachers, and our country.”
On June 17, 1963, the Supreme Court ruled that prayer illegal.

Did we as a nation then remove God's hedge of protection???

The Holy Spirit is a gentleman—He does not intrude where He’s not wanted. When told to leave, He will go. We have as a nation, through our elected leaders and those they’ve appointed as judges, told God to leave the public square. We created a vacuum.

Nature abhors a vacuum. Satan was ready to step in.

Again......just a thought!
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I believe Adam also failed in protecting the garden in which God place him. We are also told to give the Devil no place in our lives. If we are disobediant we to shall suffer the consequences.
 
Brother Paul said:
I believe a careful exegesis of Isaiah 53 shows that the diseases for which healing is promised are those diseases of the soul mentioned right before the promise. Physical healing of physical diseases is not promised here (though God also will and does heal these on occasion as He wills).
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I would disagree here. According as God's divine has already given to us all things that pertain to LIFE and GODLINESS, through the knowledge of him.....

Every thing that we need for physical and spiritual life, which includes healing is given to us as a promise through his Word.
If we fail to see this, then it does us no good.
 
CCW95A said:
I would disagree here. According as God's divine has already given to us all things that pertain to LIFE and GODLINESS, through the knowledge of him.....

Every thing that we need for physical and spiritual life, which includes healing is given to as a promise through his Word.
If we fail to see this, then it does us no good.
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Sorry my brother but I can not agree with that. I wish I could because that is exactly what I would love to see.

Isaiah 53:3 says...........
(Christ) “was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, And by His stripes we are healed”.

That being the case, Peter then builds on this understanding when he writes, “He himself bore our SINS in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed”.

Furthermore, while healing for the body is not referred to in Isaiah 53:5, it is referred to in the verse immediately preceding it. Isaiah writes in 53:4....
“Surely he has borne our griefs and carried our sorrows; Yet we esteemed Him stricken, Smitten by God, and afflicted”.

Physical healing here is not only clear in context but affirmed by the Gospels where it is given an important qualification.

Matthew 8:16-17.......
“When evening came, many who were demon-possessed were brought to him, and he drove out the spirits with a word and healed all the sick. This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophet Isaiah: ‘He took up our infirmities and carried our diseases’.

So we can now see and understand that the healing here was during the ministry of Christ and does not guarantee healing today.

Now then, we should I think consider that in a real sense Christ’s atonement on the cross does extend to physical healing. One day it will but not today. I am not saying that God does not and can not heal at the request of His people.
What I am speaking to is the idea of a MAN having a "physical healing gift". We need to make sure we are on the same page.

Rev. 21:4 is coming and...........
“there will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away”.

But what does Paul tell us in Romans 8:25.......
“We hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently”.

In the meantime, we will all experience sickness and suffering. Indeed, those who live before Christ returns will all die of their last disease—unless the Rapture comes before death.
 
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Wow! The thread is swinging so much :D We started with something else and now at something else.. Probably all relevant to the OP..

One thing I would highlight.. We can blame Job for the events that happened in his life or blame satan for doing such atrocities.. Ultimately, Job was blessed abundantly at the end.. Lord did not point at anything or anyone.. Instead, Lord blessed Job and brought healing to his friends through Job..

Some one can claim I lack faith.. And may be say I am missing blessing because I am not claiming the promise.. I would never look at it that way.. It is not lack faith.. It is faith on whom we have that matters.. It if not faith on the outcome.. When I am sick, I would put all my trust in Lord that He is control.. And I will stop there.. Some might claim that Lord has already promised healing and pray accordingly.. For both such personalities, below promises hold good.. When I am sick, instead of claiming for healing, I would rather pray "Create in me a clean heart O Lord.. And renew a right spirit within me..". Because when this is right, I know Lord is going to take care of the rest.. Some ask for it.. Some don't.. Personally, I don't think that matters..

Romans 8:28
And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.

Mathew 6:33
But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well

On a personal note.. The closest I have felt being with Lord were at the times of great trouble.. When everything seems to be falling off, I felt Lord holding me in His arms.. I have never felt the presence of Lord greater than when I was broken down in tears and cry.. I have had a greatly blessed life.. When I look back, I can see mostly pride at high times of my life.. It was during the low times that I felt the presence of Lord more.. That is my personal testimony.. I have no regrets of facing those hardships.. Those experiences helped me to taste the Lord and see that He is so so so good..
 
Brother Paul said:
I believe a careful exegesis of Isaiah 53 shows that the diseases for which healing is promised are those diseases of the soul mentioned right before the promise. Physical healing of physical diseases is not promised here (though God also will and does heal these on occasion as He wills).
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Matthew 8:16-17 (KJV)
When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with [his] word, and healed all that were sick: That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare [our] sicknesses.
​
Matthew 8:16-17 (ESV2011)
That evening they brought to him many who were oppressed by demons, and he cast out the spirits with a word and healed all who were sick. This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet Isaiah: “He took our illnesses and bore our diseases.”​

Don't over spiritualize everything just because it's not mainstream.
 
Abdicate said:
Matthew 8:16-17 (KJV)
When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with [his] word, and healed all that were sick: That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare [our] sicknesses.
​
Matthew 8:16-17 (ESV2011)
That evening they brought to him many who were oppressed by demons, and he cast out the spirits with a word and healed all who were sick. This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet Isaiah: “He took our illnesses and bore our diseases.”​

Don't over spiritualize everything just because it's not mainstream.
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Hi Ab.........!

May I say that the gospel accounts are filled with incidents of demon activity and even resistance to the ministry of Christ. His power over their influence IMO vindicates His divine Messiah ship.

By Isaiah means that is reference to 53:4 and tells us that these healings were only a partial fulfillment of what would be accomplished by Christ on the cross when He would deal with the cause of all physical pain and sicknesses.....SIN itself!
 
Ravindran said:
Wow! The thread is swinging so much :D We started with something else and now at something else.. Probably all relevant to the OP..

One thing I would highlight.. We can blame Job for the events that happened in his life or blame satan for doing such atrocities.. Ultimately, Job was blessed abundantly at the end.. Lord did not point at anything or anyone.. Instead, Lord blessed Job and brought healing to his friends through Job..

Some one can claim I lack faith.. And may be say I am missing blessing because I am not claiming the promise.. I would never look at it that way.. It is not lack faith.. It is faith on whom we have that matters.. It if not faith on the outcome.. When I am sick, I would put all my trust in Lord that He is control.. And I will stop there.. Some might claim that Lord has already promised healing and pray accordingly.. For both such personalities, below promises hold good.. When I am sick, instead of claiming for healing, I would rather pray "Create in me a clean heart O Lord.. And renew a right spirit within me..". Because when this is right, I know Lord is going to take care of the rest.. Some ask for it.. Some don't.. Personally, I don't think that matters..

Romans 8:28
And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.

Mathew 6:33
But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well

On a personal note.. The closest I have felt being with Lord were at the times of great trouble.. When everything seems to be falling off, I felt Lord holding me in His arms.. I have never felt the presence of Lord greater than when I was broken down in tears and cry.. I have had a greatly blessed life.. When I look back, I can see mostly pride at high times of my life.. It was during the low times that I felt the presence of Lord more.. That is my personal testimony.. I have no regrets of facing those hardships.. Those experiences helped me to taste the Lord and see that He is so so so good..
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Conversation tend to do that my brother. I allways thought that was the leading of the Holy Spirit myself.

Just the other day my neighbor and I were talking about our plants and back yard gardens and we wound up talking about how good I treated my wife. Go figure!!!!!:LOL:
 
trying to claim that Isaiah 53 only refers to spiritual ailments is not really right... It does include spiritual ailments - but when you look at "Blemishes" in the Old Testament - they generally always refer to physical...

But, it's not just Isaiah 53 - but Isaiah 58 - where there is a promise of healing as a consequence of Godly obedience....

Here's the greater thing.
God heals. We know this. We have experienced it - either personally, in our own flesh, or with a person we personally know....

BUT...
While you are waiting for HIS divine healing upon your body... Don't ever allow yourself to ball up in the corner.... That's where the attacks mount up on us.

Pray that the Holy Spirit comes in His promised role as COMFORTER to bring you HIS Comfort and encouragement. It's so critically important that during tribulation and suffering that we do not lose heart... and ESPECIALLY that we can close our ears to the "Worthless friends" who do nothing but throw rocks and besmirch our "Lack of faith" during periods of tribulation and suffering. We are promised The Comforter so that we might know peace, endurance, and fortitude while we ENDURE so that we do not become discouraged. That's an easy thing to say, but a very hard thing to do in real life...

Let Isaiah 40:31 ring while you feel like you are being ground up and God isn't listening..... That you would be able to Walk and not faint.... To be able to simply put one foot in front of the other... That you will be encouraged, strengthened, and comforted through the tribulation while you WAIT upon The Lord.

Thanks
 
JohnC said:
Pray that the Holy Spirit comes in His promised role as COMFORTER to bring you HIS Comfort and encouragement. It's so critically important that during tribulation and suffering that we do not lose heart... and ESPECIALLY that we can close our ears to the "Worthless friends" who do nothing but throw rocks and besmirch our "Lack of faith" during periods of tribulation and suffering. We are promised The Comforter so that we might know peace, endurance, and fortitude while we ENDURE so that we do not become discouraged.

Let Isaiah 40:31 ring while you feel like you are being ground up and God isn't listening..... That you would be able to Walk and not faint.... To be able to simply put one foot in front of the other... That you will be encouraged, strengthened, and comforted through the tribulation while you WAIT upon The Lord.

Thanks
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Again, well said. All I ever ask is that God would guide my steps. And I too take exception to the practice of pouring salt into the wounds of the suffering; that was my whole point about Job's friends. As it says in James 1:2-4, "Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything." Job was being tested, not punished, and his friends were rebuked by God for falsely accusing him. Instead, we should "suffer with those who suffer" (Heb. 10:34, 13:3) and bring the comfort of the Holy Spirit to them.
 
CCW95A said:
I would disagree here. According as God's divine has already given to us all things that pertain to LIFE and GODLINESS, through the knowledge of him.....

Every thing that we need for physical and spiritual life, which includes healing is given to us as a promise through his Word.
If we fail to see this, then it does us no good.
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And it is up to usto use them. Keys of the kingdom will do you know good if you first do not know what they unlock and know howto use them.
 
Relentless said:
Again, well said. All I ever ask is that God would guide my steps. And I too take exception to the practice of pouring salt into the wounds of the suffering; that was my whole point about Job's friends. As it says in James 1:2-4, "Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything." Job was being tested, not punished, and his friends were rebuked by God for falsely accusing him. Instead, we should "suffer with those who suffer" (Heb. 10:34, 13:3) and bring the comfort of the Holy Spirit to them.
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I like that. That is why we go and sit with families whose loved one are having surgery. Suffering and support!
 
Leemg said:
Job accused God after the calamities came upon him.
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Exactly. So the calamities had nothing to do with any sin that Job committed. If you read back through the thread, you'll see the argument made that all suffering is due to sin, such that if we are not healed then it must be some hidden sin in us. But the story of Job proves that wrong, since God called Job upright before then.
 
Relentless said:
Exactly. So the calamities had nothing to do with any sin that Job committed. If you read back through the thread, you'll see the argument made that all suffering is due to sin, such that if we are not healed then it must be some hidden sin in us. But the story of Job proves that wrong, since God called Job upright before then.
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I agree totally. The Word is quite clear. Job's troubles had nothing to do with any sin. “Have you considered my servant Job?” God asks Satan. “There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil” (Job 1:8).
 
Leemg said:
I agree totally. The Word is quite clear. Job's troubles had nothing to do with any sin. “Have you considered my servant Job?” God asks Satan. “There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil” (Job 1:8).
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Absolutely. But the claim has been made repeatedly in this thread that Job had to have sinned, even if it means turning the results of the calamities into the causes. Never mind the explicit statement from God about Job's innocence; that's apparently a proof-text, a theology built from a single verse. And the motivation is to claim, in spite of what God said about Job, that everyone who suffers is guilty of some hidden sin. The theology drives the exegesis, which is backwards.
 
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