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Boanerges(Inactive)
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trinity
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God is a family not a trinity! Part 1
There are many Scriptures on the subject let’s look at a few.
Mat. 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. You know God calls people and things what they are; so if God calls them sons of God, they are,or will be sons of God.
In 2Cor. 6:18 God says this to those who respond to Him by coming out of this world. “I will be a Father to you and you shall be My sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty.”
Now in Ro. 8:29...I want you to think Gen 1:26 while we read this...You know where God said that man was created in His likeness....You might say man was predestine to be like God.
Ro.8:29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image {or likeness} of His Son, that He (Jesus) might be the firstborn among many brethren...And then in Heb. 2:11Jesus says He is not ashamed to call us His brothers.
In Eph. 3:14-15 We are told that this Family is named after God the Father.
Father? Firstborn? Sons? Daughters? Brothers? Family name? That sounds like a family to me.
There is however, a damnable lie out there that nearly all professing Christians believe. It’s known as the trinity doctrine. This teaching
limits God...denies His plan for a family.
The catholic encyclopedia explains it this way. (and who would know more about the trinity than the Catholics, after all they invented it) and I quote...
“The trinity is unalterable forever.” That means that it’s sealed, closed, unable to grow.
The article gives no biblical reason for believing it, but if you don’t believe it, you’re going to hell... I guess it doesn’t have to make sense.
The trinity is a GIANT lie, that if believed, won’t let you understand the truth about God or the truth of God.
When Jesus came in the flesh, He revealed the Father... In Jo. 1:18 says “No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him”. Before that time God the Father was unknown to mankind in general.
Here Jesus reveals the Father, if the Holy Spirit was a 3rd individual in the Godhead, this was certainly the time to reveal him too...Don’t you think?
Although the people didn’t know who Jesus was when He came in the flesh, they knew Him in the O.T. as the I am who worked with Moses and as the God who led the children of Israel 40 years in the wilderness.
1Cor. 10 speaks to this. Verse,1Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloudand in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.
In Jo.1 Starting in verse 1 we read...In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. {this was another ideal time to tell us about this 3rd individual if it was true}
In John 8 Jesus plainly says that He was the God of the O.T….It might not be as plain to people today as it was to the people He was talking to, but it was plain to them. Jo. 8:58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” That of course being the one who called Moses from the burning bush. The I was, the I am, and the I will bei.e. the Eternal One. They knew exactly what He meant...In verse 59 they tried to stone Him for it.
We need to handle God’s word with great care.
There are many Scriptures on the subject let’s look at a few.
Mat. 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. You know God calls people and things what they are; so if God calls them sons of God, they are,or will be sons of God.
In 2Cor. 6:18 God says this to those who respond to Him by coming out of this world. “I will be a Father to you and you shall be My sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty.”
Now in Ro. 8:29...I want you to think Gen 1:26 while we read this...You know where God said that man was created in His likeness....You might say man was predestine to be like God.
Ro.8:29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image {or likeness} of His Son, that He (Jesus) might be the firstborn among many brethren...And then in Heb. 2:11Jesus says He is not ashamed to call us His brothers.
In Eph. 3:14-15 We are told that this Family is named after God the Father.
Father? Firstborn? Sons? Daughters? Brothers? Family name? That sounds like a family to me.
There is however, a damnable lie out there that nearly all professing Christians believe. It’s known as the trinity doctrine. This teaching
limits God...denies His plan for a family.
The catholic encyclopedia explains it this way. (and who would know more about the trinity than the Catholics, after all they invented it) and I quote...
“The trinity is unalterable forever.” That means that it’s sealed, closed, unable to grow.
The article gives no biblical reason for believing it, but if you don’t believe it, you’re going to hell... I guess it doesn’t have to make sense.
The trinity is a GIANT lie, that if believed, won’t let you understand the truth about God or the truth of God.
When Jesus came in the flesh, He revealed the Father... In Jo. 1:18 says “No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him”. Before that time God the Father was unknown to mankind in general.
Here Jesus reveals the Father, if the Holy Spirit was a 3rd individual in the Godhead, this was certainly the time to reveal him too...Don’t you think?
Although the people didn’t know who Jesus was when He came in the flesh, they knew Him in the O.T. as the I am who worked with Moses and as the God who led the children of Israel 40 years in the wilderness.
1Cor. 10 speaks to this. Verse,1Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloudand in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.
In Jo.1 Starting in verse 1 we read...In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. {this was another ideal time to tell us about this 3rd individual if it was true}
In John 8 Jesus plainly says that He was the God of the O.T….It might not be as plain to people today as it was to the people He was talking to, but it was plain to them. Jo. 8:58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” That of course being the one who called Moses from the burning bush. The I was, the I am, and the I will bei.e. the Eternal One. They knew exactly what He meant...In verse 59 they tried to stone Him for it.
We need to handle God’s word with great care.
Part 2
There are well over 100 scriptures in the N.T. that refer to God the Father and The Son, Jesus Christ and none that mention the Holy Spirit as a 3rd person in this relationship.
The greeting “Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ”... or something similar to this is used by Paul in Romans... 1st and 2nd Corinthians...Galatians...Ephesians...Philippians...Colossians...1st and 2nd Thessalonians...1st and 2nd Timothy...Titus...and Philemon. Similar greetings are given in James, 1st John, 2nd John...Jude...and Revelation. All of these can be found within the first 7 verses of these books.
These all seem to me like ideal times to have mentioned the 3rd member of a trinity if one existed, but nothing! You reckon they forgot?
In the 4th and 5th chapters of Rev. there is quite a description of “The Throne Room in Heaven.” In this description we see God on His throne, 24 elders on their thrones, 4 living creatures, and the Lamb, Jesus Christ receiving the prophecy of all prophecies. It seems every one of import was there at this most important event.
Everyone that is, except the Holy Spirit. Do those who teach the trinity think his invitation got lost in the Mail or something?
It should make everybody angry who loves God and his message of salvation. {that message being, that He is bringing many sons to glory}
Heb. 2:10
But then Satan {the father of lies} isn’t going to let a small thing like the truth get in his way.
Now the trinitarian idea has been around for a long time in pagan religions, around the world.
And though it had been kicked around for a while...
It didn’t really get started good in Christendom until 325 A.D. at the council of Nicaea. This council wasn’t called by the religious leaders of the day but by the Pagan Emperor Constantine. His only concern was to quell a dispute among the people, so he wouldn’t have riots on his hands. He wasn’t concerned about truth being taught in the church.
The proponents of the trinitarian teaching have no truth, no facts, and no proof; only blind faith.
Some cite parts of 1Jo. 5:7-8 which no reliable manuscript contains. 1Jo.5:7-8 should read 7 For there are three that bear witness the Spirit the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.
{Of course they agree. The water represents our baptisms, the blood cleanses us of our sins, and God gives us His Spirit to help us along the way. All three are major factors in our conversion. Of course they agree!}
The words added to 1Jo.5:7-8 were added to the margin of the Latin Vulgate in about 545 A.D. then into Greek in about 1215A.D. The added words are totally bogus. They’re meant to lead people into the false doctrine of the trinity.
By the time the KJV was published, the people who worked on it were so steeped in the trinity doctrine, that they thought they’d help God out by referring to the Holy Spirit as he, or him, or himself.
In Greek, as in some other languages nouns are assigned gender, although the gender assigned to something doesn’t mean that, that particular thing is male or female.
It’s a grammatical thing that’s foreign to those of us who only speak English.
Now in the N.T. the Holy Spirit or Spirit of God is referred to 107 times by my count and 102 are assigned the neuter status...or IT status, if you will.
Five times John uses a term that was assigned a masculine gender. This word is translated “The Comforter.”
On top of that, the Hebrew word used in the O.T. is assigned a feminine gender...How does that work? For 3/4 of the Bible the Holy Spirit is a female?...and then in the last 1/4 of the Bible, (because of a word use 5 times that’s assigned a masculine gender) it’s a male?
I guess it doesn’t have to make sense.
So basically, they have taken a few words that were added hundreds of years after the Bible was written, and 5 out of 107 references to the Holy Spirit in the N.T. that were assigned a masculine gender in Greek and built a false doctrine on it.
See what I mean about Satan not letting the truth get in the way of his lies?
Truth?...What truth? The political spin doctors of today couldn’t hold a candle to this guy.
I hope we all treasure the basic doctrines God has given us. They are a light in this dark world...they are a high wall that protect us from the evil one.
They ARE truly, perils of GREAT price.
There are well over 100 scriptures in the N.T. that refer to God the Father and The Son, Jesus Christ and none that mention the Holy Spirit as a 3rd person in this relationship.
The greeting “Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ”... or something similar to this is used by Paul in Romans... 1st and 2nd Corinthians...Galatians...Ephesians...Philippians...Colossians...1st and 2nd Thessalonians...1st and 2nd Timothy...Titus...and Philemon. Similar greetings are given in James, 1st John, 2nd John...Jude...and Revelation. All of these can be found within the first 7 verses of these books.
These all seem to me like ideal times to have mentioned the 3rd member of a trinity if one existed, but nothing! You reckon they forgot?
In the 4th and 5th chapters of Rev. there is quite a description of “The Throne Room in Heaven.” In this description we see God on His throne, 24 elders on their thrones, 4 living creatures, and the Lamb, Jesus Christ receiving the prophecy of all prophecies. It seems every one of import was there at this most important event.
Everyone that is, except the Holy Spirit. Do those who teach the trinity think his invitation got lost in the Mail or something?
It should make everybody angry who loves God and his message of salvation. {that message being, that He is bringing many sons to glory}
Heb. 2:10
But then Satan {the father of lies} isn’t going to let a small thing like the truth get in his way.
Now the trinitarian idea has been around for a long time in pagan religions, around the world.
And though it had been kicked around for a while...
It didn’t really get started good in Christendom until 325 A.D. at the council of Nicaea. This council wasn’t called by the religious leaders of the day but by the Pagan Emperor Constantine. His only concern was to quell a dispute among the people, so he wouldn’t have riots on his hands. He wasn’t concerned about truth being taught in the church.
The proponents of the trinitarian teaching have no truth, no facts, and no proof; only blind faith.
Some cite parts of 1Jo. 5:7-8 which no reliable manuscript contains. 1Jo.5:7-8 should read 7 For there are three that bear witness the Spirit the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.
{Of course they agree. The water represents our baptisms, the blood cleanses us of our sins, and God gives us His Spirit to help us along the way. All three are major factors in our conversion. Of course they agree!}
The words added to 1Jo.5:7-8 were added to the margin of the Latin Vulgate in about 545 A.D. then into Greek in about 1215A.D. The added words are totally bogus. They’re meant to lead people into the false doctrine of the trinity.
By the time the KJV was published, the people who worked on it were so steeped in the trinity doctrine, that they thought they’d help God out by referring to the Holy Spirit as he, or him, or himself.
In Greek, as in some other languages nouns are assigned gender, although the gender assigned to something doesn’t mean that, that particular thing is male or female.
It’s a grammatical thing that’s foreign to those of us who only speak English.
Now in the N.T. the Holy Spirit or Spirit of God is referred to 107 times by my count and 102 are assigned the neuter status...or IT status, if you will.
Five times John uses a term that was assigned a masculine gender. This word is translated “The Comforter.”
On top of that, the Hebrew word used in the O.T. is assigned a feminine gender...How does that work? For 3/4 of the Bible the Holy Spirit is a female?...and then in the last 1/4 of the Bible, (because of a word use 5 times that’s assigned a masculine gender) it’s a male?
I guess it doesn’t have to make sense.
So basically, they have taken a few words that were added hundreds of years after the Bible was written, and 5 out of 107 references to the Holy Spirit in the N.T. that were assigned a masculine gender in Greek and built a false doctrine on it.
See what I mean about Satan not letting the truth get in the way of his lies?
Truth?...What truth? The political spin doctors of today couldn’t hold a candle to this guy.
I hope we all treasure the basic doctrines God has given us. They are a light in this dark world...they are a high wall that protect us from the evil one.
They ARE truly, perils of GREAT price.
ExCordeChristi
Inactive
Well, that is true, but unity is a divine thing--disunity is the work of the devil. I remember in Acts it said, "They shared all things in common", which is how the people fo God should be.
I would have to disagree that the Trinity is completely false and doesn't allow us insight into the nature of God. Rather, I think it is quite the opposite.
God is complete without us, because He is complete in Himself. He is perfect because He is completely united with Himself: Father, Son, Holy Spirit. I believe in John, Jesus says, "I and my Father are one and the same" (I'm paraphrasing because I don't have a Bible on me right now and I don't remember the verse). The Father is the lover, the Son, the beloved who accomplishes the Father's will, and the Spirit is the unifying bond between them. These three are one in the same substance. The Holy Spirit enters into us and makes us one in God's family, adopted (since we are not of the same substance of God as Jesus was) children of God. It is through God we are one with God, and through God we can do His works. God is one; God is not disunified. We have been invited into unity with God. There should be no disunity between the children of God because we should be like God, since God is one, and we are one with God. Because there is disunity, it tells me that there is an enemy of God who is trying to take His children away and claim them for himself, namely, the devil. Therefore we must work against the devil from leading people astray and into disunity from God.
daniel_1012
Inactive
catholics christians,prodestant christians and jewish christians.3 who are seprate but work as 1.in other words stop knocking your brothers who have a diffrent view.
What about Baptist and Charismatic? What about Calvinists and... well, you get the idea. It doesn't work.
There is one body, that is true.
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Boanerges(Inactive)
Guest
One body- many members. Unity in doctrine- not till Christ comes back. Unity in Spirit- hopefully. Unity under one leader (besides Jesus)- oh yeah that is going to be tried by the anti-Christ.
As far as the Holy Spirit one should be careful how one puts Him down, lowers Him positionally, and or mocks/criticizes Him as that is called balshphemy by Jesus.
As far as the Holy Spirit one should be careful how one puts Him down, lowers Him positionally, and or mocks/criticizes Him as that is called balshphemy by Jesus.
16 When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He[a] saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him. 17 And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” Matthew 3:16&17
This an appearance of all three. Father(speaking) Jesus(being baptized) Holy Spirit (descending)
And the Holy Spirit descended in bodily form like a dove upon Him, and a voice came from heaven which said, “You are My beloved Son; in You I am well pleased.” Luke 3:22
Notice the Spirit came in bodily form?
And John bore witness, saying, “I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him. 33 I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, ‘Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’ John 1:32 & 33
And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; 5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” 6 Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority. 8 But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me[a] in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.” Acts 1:4-8
Do you reckon that the God that spoke the world into existence is not completely understood? I mean.....If He can speak the world into existence, is it possible that He'll have concepts that we don't understand?
This an appearance of all three. Father(speaking) Jesus(being baptized) Holy Spirit (descending)
And the Holy Spirit descended in bodily form like a dove upon Him, and a voice came from heaven which said, “You are My beloved Son; in You I am well pleased.” Luke 3:22
Notice the Spirit came in bodily form?
And John bore witness, saying, “I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him. 33 I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, ‘Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’ John 1:32 & 33
And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; 5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” 6 Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority. 8 But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me[a] in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.” Acts 1:4-8
Do you reckon that the God that spoke the world into existence is not completely understood? I mean.....If He can speak the world into existence, is it possible that He'll have concepts that we don't understand?
I'm often surpised that christians who ask for unity and world peace don't realize what they're asking for. They are asking for the tribulation.
andiclare
Inactive
But Jesus prayed for unity and peace, didn't he? It's a central theme of the gospels. I'm not sure it's wise to place an interpretation of the book of Revelations over Our Lord's own mission and prayers for his disciples.
I agree that doctrinal differences between Christian denominations can be vast and significant. No matter what though, IMO we shouldn't dismiss the fact that what we do have in common- the Person of Jesus Christ- is no small thing.
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Boanerges(Inactive)
Guest
While I agree with this in principle the Lord Himself said He came not to bring peace but a Sword. His mission is to divide His children from all that is unholy. Unity in spirit will be found amongst those who have the Spirit of God but their will be no world peace until Christ Himself returns and rules upon this earth.
Love ye one another- these are the Words of our Lord. If we follow these we will not find ourselves wanting at His return.
Not to sound snippy, but do you have scripture for that?
andiclare
Inactive
elijah, I don't take it as snippy- I understand why you would ask. I was referring specifically to Jesus's high priestly prayer in John's gospel, Chapter 17:
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Boanerges(Inactive)
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are you jewish andiclare.?we have a new testament now.
Mike those scriptures were from the Book of John.
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Boanerges(Inactive)
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So this was a prayer for the then and future church to walk in unity but not a prayer for world peace.
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Boanerges(Inactive)
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That happens to the best of them Mike!
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