Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by grigoryamitai, Jan 12, 2016.

  1. What is the Holy Bible to GOD? And, what is the HOLY BIBLE to MAN?
  2. I cannot know what is the Holy Bible to God. All I know is what the Holy Bible is to me. It points to Truth that unveils the reality of this world.
    Major likes this.
  3. Prov 30:5 (KJV)
    Every word of God [is] pure: he [is] a shield unto them that put their trust in him. ​

    Luke 4:4 (KJV)
    And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God. ​

    Luke 11:28 (KJV)
    But he said, Yea rather, blessed [are] they that hear the word of God, and keep it. ​

    There's so much more, but this is enough.
  4. Can we not think that to God the Holy Bible is His "love letter" to us? Why, actually He is wooing people to be with Him in His Eternal Kingdom. And every person in his right mind wishes to be with Him! No wonder the Christian religion expanded covering many areas in the world. And every professing Christian is happy with this belief.

    One thing though that needs to be ironed out. Why can't we, all belonging to different groups of believers cannot agree on the "way to eternal life", when JESUS CHRIST said:

    John 14:6 "I am the WAY, the TRUTH....

    Does not this indicate something is wrong with which "we read and interpret" God's 'LOVE LETTER"? I am only thinking.
    How about you, my brethren?
  5. The Bible is the Holy Written Word of God to us. It is His way and it is our life operating instructins.

    To answer your question - simply put man brings his own ideas and understanding in. This is why we have so many doctrines and denominations.
    Major likes this.
  6. What the Holy Bible is to God is what the Holy Bible should be to man .

    That man has a different opinion to God on the matter is no hurt to God .But an immeasurable hurt to man .

    That man thinks there is no consequences to having a low opinion of the Holy Bible does not make it so.

    That when God says "ALL scripture is inspired by God" But men think only part of it is .Will not change the effects of ignoring or changing those parts that man thinks he can change or are not inspired by God.

    in Christ
  7. One thing I noticed, the Holy Bible is written in the respective language/dialect of the BELIEVERS. It is obvious everybody thinks they can understand or interpret what is "written". I read the following, and this may be the cause for the difference or variance of "beliefs or doctrines" for SALVATION:

    2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

    In the Old Testament, regarding the word of God:
    Psalms 78:2 I will open my mouth in a parable: I will utter dark sayings of old:

    In the New Testament, regarding the words of Jesus Christ:
    Mark 4:34 But without a parable spake he not unto them: and when they were alone, he expounded all things to his disciples.

    Could it be that, "what is written" in the Holy Bible is what MAN understands, but "further revelation" must come from God by "divine revelation", as in the following?

    John 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
    Matthew_16:6 Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

    In the foregoing, "temple" and "leaven" are "LETTERS" that are parables that our Lord does not expect His Disciples to understand without "divine revelation". Therefore, they are not yet the "intended message" of God. And so, we cannot yet depend our own understanding.
  8. The natural man cannot receive the things of God for they are spiritually discerned .
    The natural who is born of earth is spiritually dead .
    That is the man born of Adam. "you MUST be BORN again of heaven,
    The carnal mind cannot receive the things of God either .
    That is to say those BORNagain but not willing or have not been renewed in the mind . Often because they have been led to believe that having been BORNagain they can finish in the flesh .
    If a mans words cannot be heard or understood at all unless his breath or life is given to his words ;how much the less is Gods Word neither heard or understood unless the Spirit of God quickens it?
    We have so many denominations because like of old when God said go men stayed and for they found a pleasant valley and decided to make a name for themselves and build big 'steeples'
    In Christ
  9. I believe the Holy Bible to GOD, a Spirit, is His "love letter" wooing us to be with Him in His Eternal Kingdom. He must be talking "spiritual things".

    However to us, the Holy Bible being written in our respective language or dialect, we believe we already understand what (He is saying) we are reading. Of course, we just take the "letter" or the literal meaning of His words.

    I am thinking, this is the cause of variances or differences of "beliefs or doctrines" for salvation. And so, His warning:

    2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
  10. I believe the reason for the warning in:
    2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

    Jesus Christ demonstrated this right at the beginning of His ministry. Everybody reads how He told His listeners after driving out the "merchants in the temple".
    Joh 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

    For the listeners, this is the result:
    * Joh 2:20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
    * Mat_27:40 And saying, Thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days, save thyself. If thou be the Son of God, come down from the cross.
    * Mar_15:30 Save thyself, and come down from the cross.

    For the Apostles present, they just kept silent knowing 2 Corinthians 3:6.
    * Joh 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.
    * Joh 2:22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

    Many more examples may be given to prove the "LETTER", or literal understanding, does not yet render the "INTENDED MESSAGE" of God from His words.

  11. "Intended message" = "man's misguided interpretation" :D
    Major likes this.
  13. The Bible
    B= Basic
    I= Instructions
    B= Before
    L= leaving
    E= Earth
    The Bible is an instruction manual on how to live your life. I am no expert at following these instructions but I do try my best and what I do get from it is Love, peace salvation and a promise from God that John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 "For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
    That is how I interpret my Bible :)
    RainingBlessings, Fish Catcher Jim, CCW95A and 1 other person say Amen and like this.
  14. We must not only know the Word of God but the God of the Word.
    The one is not an automatic of the other .

    in Christ
  15. I think, the "letter" is not pertaining to "literal understanding" ....
    it is referring to the Law of Moses...
    refer to the following verses, in red font underline

    2COR 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
    2COR 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
    2COR 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
    2COR 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
  16. There is the body of truth which is the Bible .The letter .
    and there is the Spirit of truth.

    There is the Word of God and there is the God of the Word.
    A person can know the Word of God and know not God of the Word.

    If you have the Word of God but not the Spirit of God you dry up.
    If you have the Spirit of God but not teh Word of God you blow up.
    But if you have the Word of God and the Spirit of God you will grow up.

    To know but the Word of God ,the letter . and know not the God of the Word . You will die in your sins .
    "These things are written that ye may know ........"
    "Ye know the scriptures but know not Him of whom they speak"
    Jesus started at Moses went through all the scriptures pertaining to himself .
    Saul of Tarsus was eminently qualified and was steeped in the scriptures from his youth. He sat under the greatest theologian of his day . He was a pharasse of the pharassees.Hebrew was his mother tounge and he knew other languages .
    But knew not the Lord.
    "Little children ye know the father and your sins are forgiven"
    "ye fathers ye know Him who is from the beginning"
    Many may say they know the father and their sins are forgiven.
    But very few "know Him who is from the beginning"

    "That they might know thee and Jesus Christ whom thou has sent" John 17

    in Christ
  17. How can we depend on the "letter" or literal understanding of man, when for example, how Eve actually caused our FALL:

    By the way Adam was not deceived:
    1 Timoth_2:14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

    Here is the cause of our FALL:

    Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
    Gen 3:2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
    Gen 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
    Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
    Gen 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
    Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat...

    Who among our PREACHERS give the meaning of the "fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden" and expound how this "sin" was transferred to mankind?

    I read sin is non-transferable in:
    Deuteronomy_24:16 The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.
  18. #18 aha, Jan 18, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2016
    Ok, this the second rebut and am not going to 3rd : ) and seems mr. geralduk seems to agree, but it may not be referring to 2 Cor 3:6

    Since you quote 2 Cor 3:6 and it mentions “letter”…

    The “letter” is not referring to “literal understanding” it refers to "Moses Law"

    The letter is the clear INSTRUCTIONS: that is: “written law” or “letters of the law”

    The “will” or the “intent” of the Author/s of the Law is: the “Spirit of the Law”…

    one may obey the instruction: the letters, but may misses the “will” of the Author/s, thus, missing the “Spirit of the Law”….

    or one may seems to disobey the "Written Law", but actually fulfilling the "Spirit of the Law"...

    I would say, I can agree "letter" can be referred to the Scriptures…. Yes can be possible, am yet thinking of related Bible verse....

    but the point, not that Bible verse 2 Cor 3:16,,, the “letter” there is referring to Law of Moses and not “literal understanding”…
  19. #19 geralduk, Jan 18, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2016
    Ah I hope you do not take this as a reproof more of a reinforcement of what I had said already .
    The letter is what it says .
    The external law WRITTEN then on tablets of stone .
    If the Jews with ALL that they had could not keep the written law how on earth do people today think they will?
    The 10 commandments are literal are they not?
    And all the laws of Moses they too are literal and the failure to keep them was death.
    What then do you mean by literal?
    If in very truth Jesus said "when the Spirit of truth shall come he will lead you into all truth"
    It does beg the question that as he said "Thy Word is truth " meaning the scriptures .
    Why then do you need the Spirit of truth to lead us into all truth?
    If by the scriptures we have already the truth?

    But consider this if you may.
    Jesus said I am the truth .
    He also said in another place " The Word is the seed"
    and in another speaking of himself " Unless a seed fall into the ground and die it abideth alone , but if it does it bringeth forth much fruit"
    Did not the Lord die and was buried? If then he was the seed that died (and buried) even as a seed is buried and dies .
    Then it needed the Holy Spirit to quicken his body and raise it from the dead to such an extent that he spoke later of "flesh and BONE" rather than flesh and blood.
    For the body of his flesh was animated by his blood thus liek all men was 'flesh and blood'
    But His blood was shed for the sin of the world and was presented to the Father as an eternal offering being of an eternal life .For thee life is in the blood.
    What animated Him then was not blood but the Spirit of God .
    Thus flesh and bone .
    If then He beign the Word needs must be quickened by the Spirit.,
    So then also must the written Word be so quickened .
    For we are BORN again by the Word of God and the Spirit of God and we must needs live by the Word made alive by the Spirit of God.
    For is it not written "Man shall not live by bread alone but by every Word that proceedeth from the mouth of God?
    Now if a mans words cannot be heard or understood unless that man gives his breath or life to his words;how much the less can God be heard or understood unless he gives his breath or life to His word?

    For in truth if we can only LIVE by that word that comes out of his mouth .We not only have the Word but must needs also have the Spirit .
    In truth did not Jesus say " Only the father has life in Himself ,and he has also given this to the Son so that he has life in Himself "
    He then that has the Son has life for he that receiveth my words recieveth the one who spake it .
    For they are not my words but as the father so taught me so do I teach.
    "He then that has not the Son has not even seen life yet"
    Though the Word of God and the Spirit of God are in very truth indivisible .
    For the eternal resting place of the Spirit of God is the Word of God.
    and the Word of God is meant to lead us to know Him .The God and father of the Word.
    For he then that has but the scriptures though he knows them well (?) but does not know the God of the Bible is dead still and will be dead again also untill he does .
    "For this is eternal life that they may know thee and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent "
    It is not therefore 'knowing' just the scriptures. The letter.

    in Christ
  20. The meaning of the phrase "fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden" which you are asking about is somewhat confusing but I shall try to explain.

    It means that we do not understand God. The woman was greedy. She wanted the fruit and she wanted to be like God. However, God had made the woman like himself already. God had given power to her and her husband, so that they had power over everything else. The woman could have and should have sent the snake away. She of course had the power of FREE CHOICE and she made the wrong choice.

    Now, as for sin being non-transferable according to Deut. 24:16. You are taking that out of context my friend.

    Look at Deut. 24:14 where we see, "Thou shalt not oppress a hired servant that is poor and needy........".
    God wanted people to receive their wages. Employers used to pay their workers every day. If they did not pay them, the workers would call to God. God would consider that the employer was guilty. Moses told them that that would happen.

    James accuses rich Christians who are in a poor world. James 5:4....
    "‘You have not paid the wages of those who worked in your fields. The money that you kept from them calls to God against you. The Lord of all power has heard the cries of the workers.’

    As for the effects of sin be passed on to others, that is confirmed in Romans 5:12.......
    "Wherefore as by one man sin entered into the world and death by sin and so death passed upon all men, for all have sinned"!

    That is called "Federal Headship" my brother. As the head of the human race, Adam was also the seminal head. His seed implies that everyone existed in seed form within Adam and that he was the head of humanity. Therefore, we were ALL in Adam just as Levi was in the body of Abraham when he met Melchizedek. That means we all sinned when Adam sinned and that sinned has been passed down to all men.

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