The Great Debate...

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by followerofchrist72, Mar 13, 2015.

  1. Shalom to you...

    I am writing this post to vent what is on my mind. I have been on a journey. A journey that causes friction with many of the people around me in my life. Trust me I am not doing this to cause such problems. As I have been reading and researching the scriptures and other lost writings, I have felt myself looking at the world for what it is. It is hard not to see that we are nothing but puppets, pawns, or sheep as it is stated in the Bible. Being controlled by false doctrines made by man. On here it is hard to see the person for who they are and they go about their daily lives. In turn it is easy to assume and throw assumptions at them without seeing the time and research into the subject.

    So here is my debated questions...
    1. What do you know about the history of your denomination?
    2. Where does your denomination have its roots?
    3. Does what they teach go along the lines of what is taught by Christ, Disciples, and Apostles?
    4. Where does it state in the scriptures that the Law has been nullified, or completely done away with?
    5. What calendar do we follow? Is it God's calendar? Or is it the man made Gregorian Calendar?
    6. What is the history of the holidays like Christmas, Easter, and Halloween, etc.
    7. What is the true Gospel? Is it though God? Or is it following what a man teaches us?
    8. Is God Triune? Or is He One like He reveals Himself as?
    9. Who is our enemy? What do we know about Satan, that Serpent of old?
    10. Last question is this... Who am I in Christ? Am I walking, talking, and being a reflection of Him?

    This just touches the surface of the questions I had, and have had answered in my life. Jesus says Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it. We need to seek the truth and not follow the ways of the world. There is still time. AMEN
     
  2. I think I need to ask you a question first.

    1. What authority do you give to "other lost writings"?

    As sheep of the Lord's pasture, we are not pawns at all, but loved creatures who love our Master and follow only Him and hear only His voice.
     
    Ravindran, Fish Catcher Jim and calvin says Amen and like this.
  3. We are to test the scriptures against scripture... The Lord leads us to all truth.

    All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.
     
  4. I will ask again:

    What "other lost writings" are your authority in matters of faith?
     
  5. The Dead Sea Scrolls, the Nag Hammadi, The Works of Josephus, the book of Enoch, Acta Pilate, The Book of Nicodemus, and so on. I read anything that has to do with scriptures of old, or lost letter and so on. I read the Bible we know today, but there is so much more out there to read. I am not closed minded. That is my opinion. It has helped me to stand stronger in my faith. We all have our own walk. I ask these questions to myself. I am not perfect. Nor do I claim to be all knowing. It is humbling to bring these question to the forum to hear what many say. At least it is to me.

    I cannot deny God. With the comet ISON starting the scenario before the blood moon lunar eclipses happening on High Holy Feast Days, and solar eclipses also. I see the signs. Rivers turning blood red, pestilence, wars, sounds like trumpets blowing around the world in our upper atmosphere, great earthquakes, floods, major storms, earthquakes in diverse places, meteorites falling from the sky, animals, and fish dying by the 1000's with no explanations. The list goes on and on. This is the time for the great awakening. I want to make sure I am doing His will, and not following the so called Pharisee type of man-made religions. Also to repent from my ways if they are not right.
     
    Abdicate likes this.
  6. What is more edifying and educating in the things of God that the bible? God doesn't want us to be so open-minded that we would gratify ourselves with writings of others that are not God-inspired. Perhaps this desire to embrace non-canonical writings is the result of some inner hunger that only God Himself can fill.

    Just my impression.
     
    calvin likes this.
  7. Euphemia... I am reading other non-canonical writings for more enjoyment. It is enjoyable to read what these other writing say. We go where we are led. I always question everything, including myself. It helps me to be this way so I won't be led astray. The Gospel of Nicodemus is a good read. It goes along with the Bible. Same thing with Acta Pilate. I hope you understand.

    Can I ask what do you believe? Have you read other books like The Purpose Driven Life, or The Late and Great Planet Earth? If so what makes what I am doing any different?
     
  8. I read books by anointed authors, for sure (and I have read both 'The Purpose Driven Life', and 'The Late, Great Planet Earth'). What I believe is God's word, with nothing added, which gives me the confidence in the truth---so much so, that I find that my flesh just doesn't question very much.

    With that out of the way, I will next endeavour to answer your list!
     
    Fish Catcher Jim likes this.
  9. There are seven "books" mentioned in the scriptures that are not part of the scriptures.
     
  10. You have a list you can share? I can think of two, though only Enoch comes to mind right now.
    Referring to a book does not elevate its status.
    The book of Enoch is one such, where because it is referred to by Jude, many people think it must be inspired.
    The book of Enoch is full of nonsense, but was widely read and known in earlier times. Jude referred to a very small part of it to make a point.

    I could say EG. "Even the enemies of Christ condemn ISIL" We wouldn't grab a copy of the q'ran and look for spiritual teaching and inspiration in it though......or would we?
     
  11. Sirach, Tobit, Wisdom, Judith, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and Baruch, as well as longer versions of Daniel and Esther. Those are a few.
     
  12. Sorry, it was 9 books, here they are:

    Books mentioned in the scripture but not part of the scriptures
    Book of Wars, Num 21:14
    Book of Jasher, 2 Sam 1:18
    Book of Acts of Solomon, 1 Kings 11:41
    Book of Nathan, 1 Chr 29:29
    Book of Gad, 1 Chr 29:29
    Book of Shemaiah, 2 Chr 12:15
    Book of Iddo, 2 Chr 12:15
    Book of Jehu, 2 Chr 20:34
    Book of the Chronicles of the kings of Media and Persia, Esther 10:2​

    Book or scroll or ???
    Prophecy of Ahijah, 2 Chr 9:29​

    Heavenly Books
    Book of Life
    Book of Records
    Book of Remebrences​
     
  13. These are all uninspired and much has been used by the enemy to undermine the truth of the word.
     
  14. Who told you that they were uninspired?
     
  15. Thanks. The book of Jasher was the other one I was aware of but couldn't recall the name.
     
  16. 1. What do you know about the history of your denomination?

    I am non-denominational

    2. Where does your denomination have its roots?

    In Christ Jesus.

    3. Does what they teach go along the lines of what is taught by Christ, Disciples, and Apostles?

    Yes, all the time.

    4. Where does it state in the scriptures that the Law has been nullified, or completely done away with?

    Ephesians 2:14-16
    For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, 15 having abolished (G2673 - katargeō ) in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, 16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

    Romans 10:4
    For Christ has already accomplished the purpose for which the law was given. As a result, all who believe in him are made right with God.

    Christ IS the end of the Law for righteousness for all who believe. The Law is abolished for those in Christ.

    Romans 7:4-64
    Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. 5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered (G2673 - katargeō) from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.

    G2673 - katargeō is translated as both 'abolished' in Ephesians. 2:15 and as 'delivered' in Romans 7:6.

    Ephesians 2

    Colossians 2

    5. What calendar do we follow? Is it God's calendar? Or is it the man made Gregorian Calendar?

    Our day-to-day activities are marked by the Gregorian calendar, but God’ calendar is one we need to be made familiar with. It really doesn’t matter what calendar we live by. God is above it all.

    6. What is the history of the holidays like Christmas, Easter, and Halloween, etc.

    There are pagan roots for the celebration of these holidays, and many holidays that commemorate certain people deemed as saints are basically just as pagan. The only true holy days we should be remembering are Passover, and the day we remember the Lord’s resurrection.

    7. What is the true Gospel? Is it though God? Or is it following what a man teaches us?

    The true Gospel is the message of God’s grace and His righteousness supplied to us in the Person of Jesus Christ. It includes the message of a blessed hope and of the condemnation of those who reject it. We as human beings, changed by God’s grace, are the ones who deliver the gospel message to the world, enabled and empowered by Holy Spirit to do so.

    8. Is God Triune? Or is He One like He reveals Himself as?

    God is One, in Three Persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

    9. Who is our enemy? What do we know about Satan, that Serpent of old?

    Satan and our own flesh are our enemies. We know enough about Satan through God’s word and through experience to know that he is not as powerful as people claim. The true evil that we encounter more often than not is the human heart itself.

    Jeremiah 17:9
    9 “The human heart is the most deceitful of all things,
    and desperately wicked.
    Who really knows how bad it is?

    10. Last question is this... Who am I in Christ? Am I walking, talking, and being a reflection of Him?

    I am chosen by God (Ephesians 1:4)

    I am adopted by God (Ephesians 1:5)

    I am a child of God in His family (1 John 3:!)

    I am seated in the heavenlies in Christ (Ephesians 2:6)

    I am forgiven by God for all my sins (1 John 1:9)

    I am reconciled to God, in Harmony with Him (Romans 5:10)

    I am seen by God as holy, blameless above reproach (Colossians 1:21-22)

    I am sealed with God's Holy Spirit (Ephesians 1:13)

    I am called to accomplish God's purpose (Romans 8:28, 30)

    I am a full citizen among God's people (Ephesians 2:19)

    I am justified -- declared right in God's sight (Romans 5:1)

    I am sanctified -- set apart by God's Spirit (1 Corinthians 6:11)

    I am redeemed -- bought with Christ's blood (Ephesians 1:7)

    I am cleansed by Christ's blood for all my sin (1 John1:7)

    I am heir of God and a joint-heir with Christ (Romans 8:16,17)

    I am complete in Christ (Colossians 2:10)

    I am an ambassador for Christ (2 Corinthians 5:20)

    I am the righteousness of God in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:21)

    I am being conformed to the character of Christ (Romans 8:29)


    Thank you Lord, for giving me worth and letting me see I have purpose.
     
    Fish Catcher Jim and CCW95A say Amen and like this.
  17. #17 Euphemia, Mar 13, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2015
    If they were, they would not contain spiritual error, and God would include them in His word.
     
  18. Thank you for your comments... I will rebuttal.
     
  19. These "questions" are not questions, they're land mines. They're not necessarily invalid questions, but the particular way they are designed is more likely to generously extend the banned topics list here than result in any manner of genuine discussion.

    Knowing the answer to the last question is the only one that's relevant. It's not like I don't understand where you're coming from -- it used to be really important to me as well to know I was right about the rest of your list, but committing myself to understanding the answer to #10 transformed my thinking about the rest.

    Luke 13:22-30
    22And He was passing through from one city and village to another, teaching, and proceeding on His way to Jerusalem. 23And someone said to Him, “Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?” And He said to them, 24“Strive to enter through the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25“Once the head of the house gets up and shuts the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock on the door, saying, ‘Lord, open up to us!’ then He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know where you are from.’ 26“Then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets’;27and He will say, ‘I tell you, I do not know where you are from; DEPART FROM ME, ALL YOU EVILDOERS.’ 28“In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but yourselves being thrown out. 29“And they will come from east and west and from north and south, and will recline at the table in the kingdom of God. 30“And behold, some are last who will be first and some are first who will be last.”

    This is a very challenging passage. You have this person approaching Jesus and asking Him if he's among the only ones "in," (apparently believing that he's following all the right rules and knowing all the right answers) and He tells him that he's actually the one who is going to be "out," while others (foreigners!) from all over the world will be reclining at the table in the kingdom of God.

    When I talk about "relevance," I hope you know I mean no insult; I don't mean that it's of no value to consider the problems you've addressed. But I think scriptures demonstrate that "knowing the right answer" to these questions is not what makes one acceptable to God. Insisting on a "right answer" to the rest is not relevant compared with continuously striving toward a greater understanding of #10.
     
    Fish Catcher Jim, calvin and Euphemia says Amen and like this.
  20. Why would there be a necessity to refute anything there?
     

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