The body of truth and the Spirit of truth.

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by geralduk, Oct 16, 2015.

  1. May you be filled with all joy in believing, @geralduk
    In Christ Jesus
    Our risen and glorified
    Saviour, Lord and Head
    Chris
     
  2. As I said before the Voice of the Lord God is Jesus Christ.

    "The VOICE of the Lord God walked in the colol of the evening"
    if it had said and the Lord God walked in the cool of the evening it would have been a normal asumption of a body.
    But it says the VOICE of the Lord God.
    Abel saw his day he could see it as it were afar off . So too did Abraham. Every person of faith in the old testement saw it as afar off and walked accordingly.
    It is not I who says the scriptures do not mean voice . It is for you then to prove he had a body like ours BEFORE "This day have I begotten theee" not me.
    It is not written 'that Abraham rejoiced that he WOULD see my day '
    " Your father rejoiced to see my day :and he SAW it and was glad"
    faith involves seeign things afar off that are promised .
    He saw the Lords day and was glad.
    He did not see the Lord in the flesh in a body . But he believed God who said that the seed fo the woman shall have a child it will be male but it would not be of Adams seed .(the womans seed)
    Man is a tripart being .of mind body and spirit .
    He is a tripart being because he is made in Gods image .
    No man hath seen God at any time .
    Yet Moses by Gods testimony talked with God face to face as men talk to men .
    There is the father . The Son and the Holy Spirit .
    Jesus said God is Spirit .
    God is omnipresent ,omniscient and is at the end as he is in the beginning all at the same time NOW .
    If you care to tell me what body he had by SCRIPTURE then I will listen to you .
    What did Moses see in the burning bush?
    What does the scripture say? The angel of the Lord apeared unto him in aflame of fire .........."
    Know ye not that our God is a consuming fire?
    In truth God SPOKE to him. out fo the midst of the burnign bush.
    As far as I am aware he was too terrified ot be looking at God . he was just about able to hear Him.

    you will have to answer your own questions .
    and if you cannot then go back a step and see if you can answer that one .
    I simply go by what the scriptures says it was the VOICE of the Lord God that walked in the cool of the evning .

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  3. I would draw your atention to Ephesians 1:18 as to a clue about "as seeign him who is invisible"
    and then to john 20:29

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  4. What does the word, "know" mean is Eph 1:18?

    (The Complete Word Study)
    eídō. To see. This verb is obsolete in the pres. act. for which horáō (G3708), to see.

    What do you suppose happens when the "eyes" of your heart is enlightened? What does that cause? Blindness, or vision?
    What is the purpose of light?

    Eph 5:13.. But when anything is exposed by the light, it becomes visible,
    Eph 5:14.. for anything that becomes visible is light. Therefore it says, "Awake, O sleeper, and arise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you."

     
  5. If there was a "voice" then there had to be a body. Where does a "voice" come from? thin air? Words come from a "mouth" which when spoken come out as a voice. Does God himself have a mouth?
     
  6. God's presence is "omnipresent" but he himself is not!
    If God himself was "omnipresent" then there would no reason to come boldly to the throne of God.
     
  7. How do you reconcile ,NO one has seen God at any time , with seeign him who is invisible.

    To know is experientially it is the same "knowing" as in "Adam knew Eve his wife"

    To walk by sight is to see with the naked eye .
    To walk by faith is to see with understanding that which is invisible.
    Ephesians 5:14 where fore he says awake thou that sleepest and a rise from the dead and Christ shall give thee light"

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  8. Brother, do you know what "faith" is? What does faith see? It sees the invisible!!! How else are we to look at the things not seen?
    Surely as a Christian you should know we walk by faith, not by sight. What is eternal the physical, or the spiritual?
     
    Euphemia likes this.
  9. You surmise a lot of things that the scripture does not say .
    The scripture does NOT say the Lord God walked in the cool of the evening . From which you can surmise a body .
    What the scriptures actually say is "The voice of the Lord God walked in the cool of the evening "
    Why does there have to be a body?
    Did not the children of Israel hear the voice from heaven? from mount Sinia and saw only smoke and fire?
    Did not Elijah hear but a still small voice but saw only a whirlwind etc?
    "Man shall not live by bread alone but by every word that proceedeth from the mouth of God"
    A mans VOICE is heard when air passesd through his vocal chords . His WORDS are both ehard and understood when he gives his life or breath to his words .
    Does God have a mouth?
    Good question.
    Do you mean God the father ? God the Son or God the Holy Spirit ?
    He who made the ear he can hear . But does that mean God has ears ? No not really .
    He who made the eye can he not see? Does that mean God has eyes ? as you or I do? No not really .
    I do know Jesus has eyes . I do know he has ears I also know He speaks .I also know he walks .
    But that body was "prepared for him"
    God who was before all things that were ever created does not.
    For God is Spirit ..
    You need to clarify what sort of 'body' you are talking about .
    For a body that needs air and breath to make a voice is a created thing. and while in some measure and likeness God can use in comparison for our sakes.
    What says the scripture "with what can you compare me with "?~

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  10. I have already answered this .
    not only here but in another post as to what faith IS (as defined by Hebrews) and what it is not .
    I think then perhaps your post should be directed elsewhere.

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  11. Gods presence is but God is not!?
    Are you tryign to tell me that where you are ; you are not?
    That statement is nonesense .
    GOD is ominpresence .
    He is everywhere all at the same time now and is present where his presence is .

    "Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace" There is more than one throne .
    But what is a throne ?
    If not a place of rest . Not that God needs to rest in that he never tires.
    But it is written he rested on the 7th day and we are "to rest from our works even as God did from His."
    and in another place that fater Jesus had acomplished the will of God he sat down on the right hand side of the majesty on high ........"
    When the scripture says if we draw near to God ;God will draw near to us.
    It does not mean geographically .
    But in mind or phsycoligically and in likeness .
    When it is written God came DOWN to see if the stench from Sodom was as bad as it seemed when it reached heaven .
    There is the coming down from above from the place of authority and power and with authority and power to execute judgment .
    Let us now come boldly to the throne of God is to have aware and alive to the fact that we come not to our feelings a denominational tradition but to one who has enetered into the most Holy place before us and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks of better things than the blood of Abel.
    When The Lord met the two on the road to Emaus and after he broke bread and they recongsised him by the doing of it .
    It is written that he disapeared from thier sight . That does not mean he had left the room or them.
    We are not always aware of the Lords presence . Nevertheless he said "I will never leave you now forsake you "
    Is it not written of some they stood before the throne fo God day and night?
    I would argue if we were more alive to that fact and to the presence of God we would be more effective in the kingdom of God.
    Jesus was always aware of the continous presence of the Father . Save for one awful moment of time when the Father left him.
    In a little wrath and for a moment I hid my faced from thee ........
    All other times he said " I am not alone ......."
    Though that great love of God; past telling, he was separated from the father that we might be reconciled to the father and so that the Spirit of God may abide with us forever .

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  12. #32 CCW95A, Oct 21, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2015
    Did you notice the word "omnipresence" is made up of two words, "omni", and presence". There is no where anyone can go to get away from God's presence with us, but his presence being with us is NOT the same thing as we being in his presence!!! They are two different things, which is why scripture tells us to come boldly to the throne room of grace. If God himself is with us, then there would be no purpose for the Bible to tell us to come to where he is!!!! To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord!!!(2 Cor 5:8) How can one be present with the Lord when he is absent from him while living in his body? Notice: to be "present WITH the Lord" is not the same thing as God's presence being with you. Yes God is resting, and where he is resting is where his presence (light) originates from.

    Psa 132:13.. For the LORD has chosen Zion; he has desired it for his dwelling place:
    Psa 132:14.. "This is my resting place forever; here I will dwell, for I have desired it.
     
  13. If you knew what faith is then you would understand what I am saying, after all it is by faith we "understand"......
     
  14. Man is a tri part being .

    If we are christs then they that are joined to the Lord are of ONE Spirit .
    WWe then have to be transformed by the renewal of our minds so that we are of the same MIND .
    At the moment we are GEOGRAPHICALLY separated from the Lord.
    But there is com ing a day when we will be geographically in the same place as it were.
    A brother in the Lord .That is one of the same father and of the same household of faith .
    May be geographically separated ,.But spirituly we are IN Christ . and of one spirit .
    we each may be phsycolicaly seperated by degree or measure that invloves maturity as well as spiritual understanding . But we are still of the one household and of the oen faith and of the same body.

    To be in the presence of God does not mean or cannot mean that He is not present!
    Man may well be geographically in the one place but his mind is somewhere else .
    Not all who gather togther do so in Jesus name though many say they do. For it is more than beign geographically in the same place .
    Any preacher worth his salt knows this that people can be in the same place but far away .
    A errent son can be in the same place geographically but be a 1000 miles away from his father .
    The prodigal son was in every way father far from his before he thought thoughts of repentance then acts of repentance
    But his thoughts of repentance drew him near to his father logn before he got geographically in the same place .
    In truth the elder brother thopugh living in the same place as his father turned out to be far away from his father in his attitude to the prodigal son.

    The only way the presence of God is 'different ' is in dens of iniquity he is indeed present. But not as his presence is when he is with believers who gather in His name .
    One would hope that beleivers are closer to God than that !

    Absent from the body is this body which though redeemed is still subject to corruption.,and is buried.
    But to be present with the Lord is to be with HIM , and not with US.so to speak.
    The body which is the redemption "yet to be revealed" is that glorious body raised from the grave when mortal shall put on immortality andcorruption shall put on incooruption.
    When the Lord stood in the midst of his disciples after the resurection. He was with them and they were with HIM!
    He was always with them. They were not always aware they were with him!
    Many a time ;Jacob for instance knew not the presence of God .
    But not only does the Lord say "Lo I am with you always " The Spirit of God has come to abide with us forever "
    It is not then just for Israel . For we have become partakers of those promises as well through Jesus Christ.

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  15. By faith we understand the world was created by God .
    But faith in God comes by understanding the Word of God.

    In Christ
    gerald
     

  16. Genesis 3:8 (ESV)
    And they heard the sound of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God among the trees of the garden.
     
    CCW95A likes this.
  17. The is a vast difference between the VOICE of the Lord God and the SOUND of the Lord God.
    The sound of someone walking through a garden is very different from the voice walking.
    Another example of men translating scripture to conform to thier thinking ,Rather than men conforming thier minds to scripture .
    and would explain your reasoning .
    I will stand on and hold to what the scriptures say .

    in Christ
    gerald
     
  18. Brother, does not "faith" come by hearing the Word of God, and "understanding of the Word of God is called "Wisdom"?

    Pro 14:33.. Wisdom resteth in the heart of him that hath understanding: but that which is in the midst of fools is made known.
     
    Euphemia likes this.
  19. Most Christians do not understand the very nature of God, and so get rather upset when they hear someone say that God's presence with them is not the same thing as you being in his presence. The Lord God knew this which is why he gave us a huge "visual aid" so we could grasp this as it is stated in the book of Romans.

    Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

    We can see invisible things and how they are in the realm of the spirit by looking at the physical things created by God at creation. Even God's "eternal power and Godhead" The Lord created something in the physical world that gives us understanding in how God is in the spirit!! Something we can see with our physical eyes and get a revelation of God's eternal power and Godhead.

    What the Lord God created was the "sun" which gives off it's light to all the world, yet it is millions of miles away from us. The light from the "sun" would be the same thing as God's "presence" with us. God's light shines upon his children, yet he still far away sitting on his throne on mt Zion. This is why scripture tells us to "come to the throne room of grace...." to where our presence is in his presence. God is NOT the sun, he is only like the sun as a visual aid given unto man so he could get a grasp of the eternal nature of God. Are there scriptures to back this up?

    Psa 84:11.. For the LORD God is a sun and shield; the LORD bestows favor and honor. No good thing does he withhold from those who walk uprightly.

    Mathew 17:1-2
    (1)And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an
    high mountain apart,
    (2) And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was
    white as the light.

    Revelations 21:22-23
    (22) And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
    (23) And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory
    of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

    John 8:12
    (12) Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth
    me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

    Psalms 84:11
    (11) The LORD God is like the sun that gives us light. He is like a shield that keeps us safe. The
    LORD blesses us with favor and honor. He doesn't hold back anything good from those whose lives
    are without blame. (NIrV

    Since God is "light" there must be a place where this "light originates from". As the "sun is at rest" within our solar system, and gives us light, if we knew where God is at rest then we will know where he himself is and the source of light (his presence) to us.

    Psa 132:13.. For the LORD hath chosen Zion; he hath desired it for his habitation.
    Psa 132:14.. This is my rest for ever: here will I dwell; for I have desired it.

    Now we know exactly where God "himself" is, and where the source of his presence to us streams from, My Zion the city of the living God!!

     
    Euphemia likes this.
  20. This is all your own personal interpretation, but the scripture is clear it was the sound of God walking in the Garden that was heard---and while He was walking, He spoke out to Adam and Eve. God had the habit of walking in the Garden with them.

    I stand on this as what scripture is telling us all. It's really very simple.
     

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