Supreme Purpose

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Noblemen, Oct 13, 2016.

  1. It is God's purpose to demonstrate, before all intelligences, principalities, powers, celestial being, and terrestrial beings, the exceeding riches of His grace.
    He does this by means of that gracious thing He did when he birthed in the creature His own dear Son. He literally took a part of Himself, His own seed, and placed it in the creature by an act of love and birthed within that creature a whole other life, Jesus.
    All intelligences in heaven and in earth will in time know the depth of sin and the hopeless state of lost humanity as they come to see what God has done in creating of a whole new race of people to be His own, His people of His nature and of His seed. All powers will in time behold these lost, damned, hellbound souls as new creations with Christ as their life. This transformation will measure and demonstrate the exceeding riches of His grace.
    The supreme purpose of God is to be realized by coming to understand the liberating secret. The theme of the liberating secret, which runs through the whole Bible, shows that from the beginning the supreme purpose of God has been that the creature come to union with Christ.
    So fully does that supreme purpose now dominate the divine undertakings in the universe that everything in heaven and earth is contributing solely to that one end.
    Ephesians 1:4 says, " According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world," This verse clearly states that the ultimate theme in the creation of the world was that the Father have sons in Christ, therefore, the whole universe would be created to contribute to this one thing.
    As often as being "in Christ" is stated in the New Testament, it was still a secret for more than 4300 years of the Old Testament, hidden from prophets and unknown through the ages. Yet, all that took place was so that the Father might manifest His glory before men. That glory is a especially manifested by the old testament in that all men who live during those 4300 years could never keep the law and never prove themselves faithful to God.
    This, of course, would necessitate God's greatest act. He would have to put a part of Himself in the creature to bring about that faithfulness. This is what happens in our Union with Christ, for as Galatians 2:20 says, the life we now live we live by the faith of the Christ who is in us.
  2. #2 Complete, Oct 26, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2016
    Hello Noblemen,

    I am going to go through your OP section by section if you don't mind Noblemen, similarly with the two which you have posted since this one, for although I find myself in agreement with some things, there are others which cause me concern.

    'Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given,
    that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
    And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery,
    which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God,
    who created all things by Jesus Christ:

    To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places
    might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
    According to the eternal purpose

    which He purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
    (Eph 3:8-11)

    * Amen.
    * Are you referring to the virgin birth here, Noblemen?
    If so, I don't think it is correct to say that God 'literally took a part of Himself, His own seed, and placed it in the creature' , for 'the seed' is spoken of as, 'her seed'.

    'And I will put enmity between thee and the woman,
    and between thy seed and her Seed;
    it shall bruise thy head,
    and thou shalt bruise His heel.

    * Also when Mary enquired, 'How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?' The answer was, 'The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.' (Luke 1:34,35). Nothing is said to her about God implanting a seed within her. Also, our Lord is spoken of as, 'the seed of David' and 'the seed of Abraham'. (Heb.2:16; Rom.1:3)

    * The Holy Spirit does not speak in terms of, 'a whole new race of people', anywhere in Scripture, Noblemen. 'The Church which is the Body of Christ' is a spiritual company, and 'One Body', 'in Christ Jesus' only, so cannot be viewed in terms of 'race', for our origins are diverse in the flesh. 'In Christ' we are One 'in Spirit', but not in the flesh.

    * We are a new creation, corporately, as 'The Church which is His Body', but were never 'lost', 'damned' or 'hellbound', for we were chosen, 'in Christ', before the foundation of the world, receiving in Him the promise of life, and nobody so designated as part of that new creation will be lost.

    'And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
    Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world,
    according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
    Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh,
    fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind;
    and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
    But God, Who is rich in mercy,
    for His great love wherewith He loved us,
    Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved

    (Eph 2:1-5)

    * This does indeed demonstrate the wisdom of God, and the glory of His grace.

    Praise His Holy Name!

    * Sonship is spoken of as being received by 'adoption', though, Noblemen.

    * I just find that you are using words, born of your own understanding, which do not always reflect what the Holy Spirit has written for our learning, thereby investing what is true with an element of what is born of your own imagination, and that is not safe.

    Sorry, Noblemen,
    In Christ Jesus
    Noblemen likes this.
  3. Thank you Chris, I'll respond later, blessings.
  4. "Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever" 1st Peter 1:23.
    Im talking about the seed of God, which is Christ.
  5. Correct, it is a term myself and a few others have come up with. I use some other language, like "the birthing."
    But think about this, there are three races of people on this earth right now. There is the Jewish race, Gentile race, and new Creation race.
    Yes the body of Christ, but we are a race of people, new race of people. There has never been a people (children) like us before.
    We are the first to ever contain Christ.
    It's not a doctrine thing just a term when studied out, does make sense.
    I don't mean to confuses you or anyone, I just like to use certain language when I'm writing.
    There is so many pat answers and jargon in religion, even in writing, I try to stay away from.
    Marilyn C likes this.
  6. I'm not quite understanding your statement.
    Maybe you didn't understand mine. I'm saying before we came to God, we were lost and needed a Savior.
  7. We have been birthed by our Father as believer's.
    Adoption is the process of learning the family spirit.
    Prior to coming to God we knew nothing about spiritual things. Now as His bonified offspring we need to learn, taught by the Holy Spirit, the things of God.
    That is the spirit of adoption.
  8. #8 Complete, Oct 27, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2016
    Hello Noblemen,

    I acknowledge your responses, and thank you for them. However, I will leave this with the Lord now. I will not comment further, on this, or your further threads on this subject as I planned, for we both are answerable to only One, and that is our Beloved Lord Himself.

    May God's perfect will be done in each one of us, for His Name and glory's sake.

    In Christ Jesus
    Noblemen likes this.
  9. The virgin birth was a spoken Word.
    Mary was only the means by which the Word entered into this fallen condition.

    Much could be said but see where this goes.
  10. #10 Noblemen, Oct 28, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2016
    God placed His seed (Christ) in Mary, she brought forth a child (Jesus is the Mary body), but it is God that brought forth the Son, Isaiah 9:6. Now we have that same Christ in us (seed) that was brought forth in Mary.
    I understand "The word became flesh," I'm not really getting your point. Yes the word did enter this world as a person.
    Luke 1:35, says "The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."
    I'm not seeing anything about a spoken word over Mary that brought forth the Son.
  11. I would say to you that there are actually two races of people on the earth today my brother. The Saved and the Lost.
    Noblemen likes this.
  12. I question the idea of ......."The virgin birth was a spoken word".

    Luke 1:35............
    "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the Power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that Holy Thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."
    Noblemen likes this.
  13. Not sure what you are saying.
    - Jesus is the Mary Body
    - Now we have that same Christ in us (seed) that was brought forth in Mary.

    I'm with you if you're referring to the eternal life dwelling in us.

    Perhaps I was reading too much into the discussion hearing that Mary had something to do with the conception other than being a carrier.

    Spoken Word:
    In the being when things were perfect Adam came into existence by a spoken word.
    After the fall we are manifested through God's permissive will - sexual desire...
    The second Adam (Jesus Christ) could only come the perfect way.
    God spoke it and it was.
    Noblemen likes this.
  14. Yes the (Mary body) I'm referring to is the body of Jesus she brought forth.
    But she did not give its content, God is the Father. There is a real Bible truth here that seems to be missed.
    For example; Jesus had no sin nature, granted on the cross "He was made sin that, we might be made the righteousness of God in Him." But God was His Father and He had the nature of His Father. In Him, is always the correct context of studying the scriptures.
    For example; when reading the scriptures or studying a verse, you must keep in mind that you are "in Christ," by a birthing. There is nothing you did in your natural birth, and there is nothing you can do to bring about the act of a birthing by the Father.
    It is a divine act of God the Father, that should be good news but the exact opposite is true, accept for those that have that understanding.
    It seems we want to please God so much, we do alot of unnecessary things, when He would like us to have an understanding of who we are, and begin to express it. That is the pleasing of the Father. We, as the church would accomplish more with knowledge, than all of the works of men today.
    Religion has God loving Christians on a merry-go-round of programs and always doing something.
    They have us still trying to conquer sin and it's effects, and add more and more law. Tell someone who they are and they will live the life. It becomes a love thing, do you love the Christ in you more than you love yourself. If you do you will live the life, but at least you have heard that it's so, you have a choice. Religion gives you a choice, it's their way or your out, but the catch is there is no knowledge in that, greatest evil there is. Christians suffer and some stay in utter confusion and in a state of lostness.
    Major likes this.
  15. And that is the Key. Jesus did not have a sin nature so it makes no difference if Mary was free of sin or not. Of course she wasn't but that is a non starter.

    I agree totally with you. Our salvation is totally a God thing from beginning to end.

    Personally, I am disturbed at the Christian teaching that is trying to make "works" part of our salvation. Christ in us is the hope of glory and it is a gift of God "so that we would not boast".
    Complete and Noblemen say Amen and like this.

  16. There is a reason for all this.
    1. A man had to go to the cross for the Holy Spirit could take no sin .

    2. Jesus had to be born of a virgin.
    ....the blood type is dictated by the father and the mother has nothing to do with the blood.

    Being a virgin there was no sin filled seed of a man in her. God being the source or Father kept out All tainted sin filled blood.
    Major and Noblemen say Amen and like this.
  17. Not sure what this and some of the other is saying.

    If you are playing down works as if we have to do nothing from being born again through out our time in Christian on this earth then you would be in error.

    It may be that reading through all the replies and all the changed direction one gets as they read through the thread has made it tough to understand.

    So for me bro I just ask....
    Thanks and blessings my brother
    Noblemen likes this.
  18. Hi @Nobleman,

    Great topic there bro. I also believe that a purpose of God is to have many sons made like unto the Lord - new creations, of a special order - kingpriests unto God set to rule & reign with Christ on His throne in the third heaven. (Rev. 1: 6, & 3: 21)

    However....I do not believe it is God`s supreme purpose -

    `...having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself. that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven & which are on earth - in Him.` (Eph. 1: 9 - 10)

    This tells me that it is the glorified Son who will bring all rulership under His feet & reign in bodily form, & not just in the Godhead beyond the created order. God the Father desired that all rulership will be under His Son & that all things will be restored through Him - in heaven (plural) (third heaven & Universal & atmospheric heavens) & earth.

    Much to think about & maybe discuss. Marilyn.
    Complete and Noblemen say Amen and like this.
  19. Jim, I would add here that the holy God cannot let sin go unpunished. To bear our own sins would be to suffer God’s judgment in the flames of hell. Praise God, He kept His promise to send and sacrifice the perfect Lamb to bear the sins of those who trust in Him. Jesus had to die as a Man to pay the penalty for the sins of Man because He is the only one who can pay the penalty for our sins.

    Then, as you stated correctly IMO, it would seem that the sin nature is passed down from generation to generation through the father Romans 5:12, 17, 19. The Virgin Birth circumvented the transmission of the sin nature and allowed the eternal God to become a perfect man.

    You would almost be persuaded to believe that God was in control and has had a plan wouldn't you?????
    Noblemen and Fish Catcher Jim say Amen and like this.
  20. Sadly enough I think some believers have never put the pieces together and seen how on purpose or better yet by purpose and that is God's purpose everything from the Virgin birth to the cross unto hell and back to the right side of God was a perfect strategically plan from the beginning.

    They never grasp why things were done as they were.
    Thank God one can still have their name in the book of life though.
    Major, Cturtle and Noblemen says Amen and like this.

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