Something I was wondering

I'll take your word for it because its just confusing otherwise.
Judas did not seem to have a repentive heart. He ignored things and questioned things and did his own thing.

Compare it to people today, both saved and not saved.

If you insist on your way then you will get things your way opposed to God's ways.

A believer a born again Christian has the right to follow God's ways or ignore things. If they ignore then they get out in an area where the devil has right to interfere. So if they get killed then yes it's sad but not God's doing.

God's protection is for us but if we don't follow His ways then we step out side of His protection for the most part. Why do bad things happen to good people? Good people make bad choices....

Another thought. How do you know for sure what was said to Judas all along? Scriptures do Not record every conversation but they do instruct us.

Blessings
FCJ
 
autumn oddity Hi,
Was reading this article and I really feel it is something you should read.
I only got half way through it and the thought to share this with you was strong, so here you go I am going back to finish reading .
Blessings

http://www.awmi.net/reading/teaching-articles/sovereignty_god/
I read most of it, its very nice..but it makes it seem like God isn't in control. God is the alpha and omega, he knows all things, even when Job was tested satan was only permitted to do what God allowed. idk it just confuses me... I'm not trying to blame God but he does know what is coming our way, God isn't a small God, he's very powerful... I just don't know where his soveriengty ends and our free will begins... woo if I keep trying to understand my brain might snap in two lololol..I think its one of those things best left alone..because I honestly cant understand it or grasp it. people that try to make it seem like God doesn't mean to let calamity befall you make God out to be small and somewhat helpless and the other extreme makes it seem like God just has scripts written for us all and no matter what we can't deviate. I feel the truth is someowhere smack dab between the two... but my mental energy is spent just trying to understand this lololol
 
I read most of it, its very nice..but it makes it seem like God isn't in control. God is the alpha and omega, he knows all things, even when Job was tested satan was only permitted to do what God allowed. idk it just confuses me... I'm not trying to blame God but he does know what is coming our way, God isn't a small God, he's very powerful... I just don't know where his soveriengty ends and our free will begins... woo if I keep trying to understand my brain might snap in two lololol..I think its one of those things best left alone..because I honestly cant understand it or grasp it. people that try to make it seem like God doesn't mean to let calamity befall you make God out to be small and somewhat helpless and the other extreme makes it seem like God just has scripts written for us all and no matter what we can't deviate. I feel the truth is someowhere smack dab between the two... but my mental energy is spent just trying to understand this lololol

God is only in complete control in Heaven (Matthew 5:10). The earth has He given to men Ps 115:16....
So if God has given the earth and dominion of it to men...and people just sit around waiting in God, when the earth, our bodies and God are waiting on us....then nothing gets done and the devil just runs free inflicting judgement upon all God's people and God's people blame God, because they are expecting Him to do what He told them to do.

When job was attacked by the devil....God did not give him permission...job gave him permission by worrying and not putting his faith and trust in God. God told.the devil that job was already in his hands...meaning job opened the door to allowing the devil to sift him, and bring destruction upon him and his household.

God is alpha and omega...which means beginning and end. He is all knowing, but when He decided to give the earth to men...He also chose to trust men to take care of things, and to do those things that He gave them to do. God told man to be fruitful and multiply...that was not just about having kids. It was about filling the earth with His goodness, and making it like the garden of eden. However when Adam gave his alegiance to the devil, by listening to him instead of God....the curse came and messed every thing up. God had to send His Son to buy it all back...
 
God is only in complete control in Heaven (Matthew 5:10). The earth has He given to men Ps 115:16....
So if God has given the earth and dominion of it to men...and people just sit around waiting in God, when the earth, our bodies and God are waiting on us....then nothing gets done and the devil just runs free inflicting judgement upon all God's people and God's people blame God, because they are expecting Him to do what He told them to do.

When job was attacked by the devil....God did not give him permission...job gave him permission by worrying and not putting his faith and trust in God. God told.the devil that job was already in his hands...meaning job opened the door to allowing the devil to sift him, and bring destruction upon him and his household.

God is alpha and omega...which means beginning and end. He is all knowing, but when He decided to give the earth to men...He also chose to trust men to take care of things, and to do those things that He gave them to do. God told man to be fruitful and multiply...that was not just about having kids. It was about filling the earth with His goodness, and making it like the garden of eden. However when Adam gave his alegiance to the devil, by listening to him instead of God....the curse came and messed every thing up. God had to send His Son to buy it all back...
With job I have to disagree God gives Satan the okay to test him its I the very first chapter .. He says job 1:12 " all right, you may test Him the Lord said to Satan." Do whatever you want with everything He posesses but do not harm him physically...it wasn't because he worried it was simply a test God permitted. If he worried it would have said so but I doesn't.
 
I don't know if I fully agree. If someone cries before the Lord it must be genuine. Everyone knows we can't fake it with God. True tears = true remorse = part of Psalm 51:17. Bad people don't break down before God.

2 Co. 7:10: For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation without regret, whereas worldly grief produces death.

Grief over sin does not necessarily equal repentance. Some people are just sorry they got caught, but not sorry enough to turn away from their sin.
 
With job I have to disagree God gives Satan the okay to test him its I the very first chapter .. He says job 1:12 " all right, you may test Him the Lord said to Satan." Do whatever you want with everything He posesses but do not harm him physically...it wasn't because he worried it was simply a test God permitted. If he worried it would have said so but I doesn't.
No that's not quite true. God never gave satan permission to do anything.
God said Behold.....the word behold means pay attention or look around.

So God said....pay attention look around job is already in your hands But you will not kill him.

Job just like a person today can step out side of God's protection which satan called a hedge which in all truth was simply the blessing of the Lord over his life.

Doubt and fear (words) give satan a right to get in.
Job even tells why all this happened.
Blessings
 
2 Co. 7:10: For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation without regret, whereas worldly grief produces death.

Grief over sin does not necessarily equal repentance. Some people are just sorry they got caught, but not sorry enough to turn away from their sin.
I do agree some people are sorry they're caught red handed
 
With job I have to disagree God gives Satan the okay to test him its I the very first chapter .. He says job 1:12 " all right, you may test Him the Lord said to Satan." Do whatever you want with everything He posesses but do not harm him physically...it wasn't because he worried it was simply a test God permitted. If he worried it would have said so but I doesn't.

Now lets read this in the king james shall we.....
Job 1:12
And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord.

And again in 2:6....
Job 2:6
And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life.

See the word behold in both Scriptures? The word behold means look...pay attention... and then God said he is already in your power or hand. Which means that God said look and pay attention, he is already in your hand....so how could he have already been in satan's hands except...by jobs own admission (for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually (which is all the time or constantly....job1:5).....he had been worrying and saying wrong words. Just like your learning, words are powerful and when job was worrying and fretting his faith in God was low (full of doubt and unbelief) and he opened the door to the devil to harass and attack him because worry, doubt and unbelief...by the Bibles definition is evil...therefore a sin for any believer.

Blessings
 
autumn oddity
Hi,
Something to remember.
Job was not different in life then we are as far as attitude and emotions and actions.

We can allow thoughts to take control of our entire being and thus driving us to do things.

Job said in 3:25-26
25For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me, and that which I was afraid of is come unto me. 26I was not in safety, neither had I rest, neither was I quiet; yet trouble came.

Look at verse 25
What he feared and was afraid of.
This shows us that he gave into thoughts the enemy sent him.

This means he has now turned from trusting God and acting on it unto trusting fear and worry more.

This always places us out side of God's protection and gives the devil right to come in and steal kill and destroy.

Now look at verse 26
Had no rest
Was not in safety
Was not Quiet

Not quiet.....fretting and speaking his now obtained fear and worry.

Had no rest........probably up all night fretting and worrying And Without Peace. Nerves shot or on edge.

No Safety. ....stepped out side of Thee Blessing Of God.

Now if he would have said No to those thoughts and trusted God and spoke Faith Filled Words Fully Trusting God over his children.

See he should have grasped that he taught his kids well and instead of worrying simply went to where they were had some fun and talked about the things of God.

satan would not have had an open door.

When God said BeholdAnd the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life.

Behold means look around or pay attention. God could not lie. So He told the truth......job had already opened up that door But you will Not take his life.

Think about this and compare it to life now.......it's not changed.
Stay in faith or stead fast we are operating in Grace

Trade Faith and Trust for fear, worry and doubt, you then step outside of that Grace and satan has free right.

Fight the good fight of faith means just that.......one must fight or get trampled on.
Blessings
FCJ
 
2 Co. 7:10: For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation without regret, whereas worldly grief produces death.

Grief over sin does not necessarily equal repentance. Some people are just sorry they got caught, but not sorry enough to turn away from their sin.
I don't imagine worldly grief involving crying alone before God or as in Judas's case, wanting to return the money. He could have run for the hills and had grief there. But I guess the evidence is in what transpires after. In Judas's case it does not look for him, that's for sure.
 
'That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man,
which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind
;
(Eph 4:22,23)

Hello autumn oddity,

Fish Catcher Jim and Cturtle's points concerning our thoughts, and what we allow our minds to dwell on, is good. For our faith in God is of paramount importance, and the enemy of our souls would seek to destroy it. When we look at passages in Scripture which we find disturbing for one reason or another, as you have with thoughts of Judas, then I believe we must not allow those doubtful mental disputations to get the upper hand. For our understanding is flawed through human frailty and limited by the confines of our experience.

We have to trust God, and not let human sensibilities and fleshly considerations get in the way of that. Our sympathies and feelings of injustice are not to be trusted, for they are full of human bias, and so they can be used to deceive us. We have to stand on what we know to be true of God, commit these thoughts to Him, and move on in faith.

With love in Christ Jesus
Cariad
 
I don't imagine worldly grief involving crying alone before God or as in Judas's case, wanting to return the money. He could have run for the hills and had grief there. But I guess the evidence is in what transpires after. In Judas's case it does not look for him, that's for sure.

I was curious as to what various commentaries had to say on this subject of Judas' repentance, so I looked up Matthew 27:3 on Biblehub.com. I learned something I did not know before. The Greek word translated "repented" here is not the same word for "repent" when speaking of turning away from sin. Anyway, I copied some of what these various commentators said, because I wanted to know what they believed was meant by Judas' repentance. So, here is what they said in case anyone is interested. FYI: I don't know the theological bent of any of these commentators, but I think they are not all the same.

Ellicott’s Commentary on Matthew 27:3:

Repented himself.—The Greek word is not that commonly used for “repentance,” as involving a change of mind and heart, but is rather “regret,” a simple change of feeling. The coins which he had once gazed on and clutched at eagerly were now hateful in his sight, and their touch like that of molten metal from the furnace. He must get rid of them somehow. There is something terribly suggestive in the fact that here there were no tears as there had been in Peter’s repentance.

3338 metaméllomai (from 3326 /metá, "change after being with," and 3199 /mélō, "care, be concerned with") – properly, to experience a change of concern after a change of emotion and usually implying to regret, i.e. falling into emotional remorse afterwards (note the force of 3326 /metá).

Pulpit Commentary on Matthew 27:3:

Repented himself (μεταμεληθείς). This word (differing from μετανοέω, which expresses change of heart) denotes only a change of feeling, a desire that what has been done could be undone; this is not repentance in the Scripture sense; it springs not from love of God, it has not that character which calls for pardon.

Barnes’ notes on Matthew 27:3:

Then Judas, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself - This shows that Judas did not suppose that the affair would have resulted in this calamitous manner. He probably expected that Jesus would work a miracle to deliver himself, and not suffer this condemnation to come upon him. When he saw him taken, bound, tried, and condemned - when he saw that all probability that he would deliver himself was taken away - he was overwhelmed with disappointment, sorrow, and remorse. The word rendered "repented himself," it has been observed, does not of necessity denote a change "for the better," but "any" change of views and feelings. Here it evidently means no other change than that produced by the horrors of a guilty conscience, and by deep remorse for crime at its unexpected results. It was not saving repentance. That leads to a holy life this led to an increase of crime in his own death. True repentance leads the sinner to the Saviour. This led away from the Saviour to the gallows. Judas, if he had been a true penitent, would have come then to Jesus; would have confessed his crime at his feet, and sought for pardon there. But, overwhelmed with remorse and the conviction of vast guilt, he was not willing to come into his presence, and added to the crime of treason that of self-murder. Assuredly such a man could not be a true penitent.

Jamieson-Faussett-Brown Commentary on Matthew 27:3:

Repented himself—but, as the issue too sadly showed, it was "the sorrow of the world, which worketh death" (2Co 7:10).

Gil’s Exposition of Matthew 27:3:

repented himself: not for the sin, as committed against God and Christ; but as it brought a load of present guilt and horror upon his mind, and exposed him to everlasting punishment: it was not such a repentance by which he became wiser and better; but an excruciating, tormenting pain in his mind, by which he became worse; therefore a different word is here used than what commonly is for true repentance: it was not a godly sorrow for sin, or a sorrow for sin, as committed against God, which works repentance to salvation not to be repented of; but a worldly sorrow, which issues in death, as it did in him. It did not spring from the love of God, as evangelical repentance does, nor proceed in the fear of God, and his goodness; but was no other than a foretaste of that worm that dieth not, and of that fire which cannot be quenched: it was destitute of faith in Christ; he never did believe in him as the rest of the disciples did; see John 6:64, and that mourning which does not arise from looking to Jesus, or is not attended with faith in him, is never genuine.

Source: http://biblehub.com/commentaries/matthew/27-3.htm
 
I was curious as to what various commentaries had to say on this subject of Judas' repentance, so I looked up Matthew 27:3 on Biblehub.com. I learned something I did not know before. The Greek word translated "repented" here is not the same word for "repent" when speaking of turning away from sin. Anyway, I copied some of what these various commentators said, because I wanted to know what they believed was meant by Judas' repentance. So, here is what they said in case anyone is interested. FYI: I don't know the theological bent of any of these commentators, but I think they are not all the same.

Ellicott’s Commentary on Matthew 27:3:

Repented himself.—The Greek word is not that commonly used for “repentance,” as involving a change of mind and heart, but is rather “regret,” a simple change of feeling. The coins which he had once gazed on and clutched at eagerly were now hateful in his sight, and their touch like that of molten metal from the furnace. He must get rid of them somehow. There is something terribly suggestive in the fact that here there were no tears as there had been in Peter’s repentance.

3338 metaméllomai (from 3326 /metá, "change after being with," and 3199 /mélō, "care, be concerned with") – properly, to experience a change of concern after a change of emotion and usually implying to regret, i.e. falling into emotional remorse afterwards (note the force of 3326 /metá).

Pulpit Commentary on Matthew 27:3:

Repented himself (μεταμεληθείς). This word (differing from μετανοέω, which expresses change of heart) denotes only a change of feeling, a desire that what has been done could be undone; this is not repentance in the Scripture sense; it springs not from love of God, it has not that character which calls for pardon.

Barnes’ notes on Matthew 27:3:

Then Judas, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself - This shows that Judas did not suppose that the affair would have resulted in this calamitous manner. He probably expected that Jesus would work a miracle to deliver himself, and not suffer this condemnation to come upon him. When he saw him taken, bound, tried, and condemned - when he saw that all probability that he would deliver himself was taken away - he was overwhelmed with disappointment, sorrow, and remorse. The word rendered "repented himself," it has been observed, does not of necessity denote a change "for the better," but "any" change of views and feelings. Here it evidently means no other change than that produced by the horrors of a guilty conscience, and by deep remorse for crime at its unexpected results. It was not saving repentance. That leads to a holy life this led to an increase of crime in his own death. True repentance leads the sinner to the Saviour. This led away from the Saviour to the gallows. Judas, if he had been a true penitent, would have come then to Jesus; would have confessed his crime at his feet, and sought for pardon there. But, overwhelmed with remorse and the conviction of vast guilt, he was not willing to come into his presence, and added to the crime of treason that of self-murder. Assuredly such a man could not be a true penitent.

Jamieson-Faussett-Brown Commentary on Matthew 27:3:

Repented himself—but, as the issue too sadly showed, it was "the sorrow of the world, which worketh death" (2Co 7:10).

Gil’s Exposition of Matthew 27:3:

repented himself: not for the sin, as committed against God and Christ; but as it brought a load of present guilt and horror upon his mind, and exposed him to everlasting punishment: it was not such a repentance by which he became wiser and better; but an excruciating, tormenting pain in his mind, by which he became worse; therefore a different word is here used than what commonly is for true repentance: it was not a godly sorrow for sin, or a sorrow for sin, as committed against God, which works repentance to salvation not to be repented of; but a worldly sorrow, which issues in death, as it did in him. It did not spring from the love of God, as evangelical repentance does, nor proceed in the fear of God, and his goodness; but was no other than a foretaste of that worm that dieth not, and of that fire which cannot be quenched: it was destitute of faith in Christ; he never did believe in him as the rest of the disciples did; see John 6:64, and that mourning which does not arise from looking to Jesus, or is not attended with faith in him, is never genuine.

Source: http://biblehub.com/commentaries/matthew/27-3.htm

Thanks Sue for your thoughtfulness
Blessings
 
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