Sin That Leads To Death 1 John 5:16

I know the scripture, and I am curious as to what you feel it means in an expanded way. Sincerely because you have a good way with words.

Scriptually speaking Silk.......there is no sin committed yesterday that the Lord God would not forgive today. IS THAT CORRECT??

Because He, Jesus, dies as the payment for ALL sin . Again. IS THAT CORRECT???

OK, so then the Holy Spirit came into the world to make real the salvation of Christ to the hearts of all men.

John 16:7-11 (ESV)...........
"Nevertheless, I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. 8 And when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment: 9 concerning sin, because they do not believe in me; 10 concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no longer; 11 concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged."

So then, Biblically, the Holy Spirit wants to present evidence in our hearts and minds to convict us and that of course leads us to a place of a decision. There must be a conviction before we can turn in faith and believe upon the Lord Jesus Christ.

That being the case, then when one rejects that convicting Spirit to move to Christ, one is actually rejecting the Lord Jesus Christ. If that is the case then that sinner remains a sinner and he is lost. It is just that simple Silk. Rejecting the Lord Jesus is the sin that can not be forgiven because after death comes the judgment and all who reject Jesus will spend eternity in hell because of their lack of choosing Christ. To reject Christ is the ultimate sin because it is the one of un-belief.

Jojn 15:22 says.........
"If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin; but now they have no cloak for their sin".
 
Great post, Major. I would go one further, to not accept Jesus is rejecting God, and to not accept the Holy Spirit is rejecting God.
 
Major, how do you reconcile (in the light of the above), Jesus' statement that there would be no forgiveness in this life for blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?
While I do not disagree with what you said, I feel it does not address the issue.

Rejecting Jesus is a bit like rejecting a dinner invitation This is not rocket science. If someone invites you to dinner and you decline, unless you change your mind you will never eat at their table.....The operative thing here is a change of mind.

But if you not only declined the invitation, but also vilified the person and his whole family, the while abusing his wife and children then what? Would not the invitation at that time be withdrawn forthwith never ever to be offered again? Would that not classify as an eternal sin? cf Mark 3:29 I see that as something more serious than just declining an invitation
If one dies rejecting Jesus, then that rejection is 'set in stone' but if one repents before death then the invitation is still good to go.
 
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Hey Calvin, I see your light with joy! (Silk <-----has a snowball melting in her hand :)). Christ said He had to leave because if He didn't, the Holy Spirit, our two way connection to God, couldn't come. If you cut the wire to your phone, there goes that communication. But metaphors fall below what cutting the Holy Spirit does.
 
All sin? 'The wages of sin is death' is it not? Pretty straight forward if you ask me...

If, when God made man in His image, the soul, not the flesh was what "they" were talking about, the Original Sin Fall would have been referring to the death of the flesh, not the soul.
 
Major, how do you reconcile (in the light of the above), Jesus' statement that there would be no forgiveness in this life for blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?
While I do not disagree with what you said, I feel it does not address the issue.

Rejecting Jesus is a bit like rejecting a dinner invitation This is not rocket science. If someone invites you to dinner and you decline, unless you change your mind you will never eat at their table.....The operative thing here is a change of mind.

But if you not only declined the invitation, but also vilified the person and his whole family, the while abusing his wife and children then what? Would not the invitation at that time be withdrawn forthwith never ever to be offered again? Would that not classify as an eternal sin? cf Mark 3:29 I see that as something more serious than just declining an invitation
If one dies rejecting Jesus, then that rejection is 'set in stone' but if one repents before death then the invitation is still good to go.

Good point calvin. In the Scripture in question where we find the record of Jesus speaking on blasphemy, He had just healed a demon possessed man who was blind and could not speak....."So that the blind and mute man both spoke and saw". The people following Jesus said...."This man cannot be the Son of David, can He"? They were wondering if Jesus was in fact the Messiah.

But the Pharisees accused Jesus of being controlled by Beelzebub, the ruler of all demons. It was Jesus' response to them that He refers to "blasphemy". I know that you are aware of that but for the sake of anyone reading this and not knowing the context, I thought it would be helpful,

So then, the term "blasphemy" can be defined as "defiant irreverence". We would apply the word to sins like cursing God or willfully degrading things considered holy. In this passage the term refers to the declaration of the Pharisees who saw the miracle performed which was in the power of the Holy Spirit. Yet they gave credit of those miracles to Satan. In the face of irrefutable evidence they ascribed the work of the Holy Spirit to that of Satan.

They saw the proof of Christ's diety but instead of giving glory to God they gave credit of the supernatural power to Satan instead of the work of the Holy Spirit. This incident is the only one in which a sin is declared unforgivable.

It seems to me then that what we are talking about is more of an "unforgivable STATE"........the state of unbelief and that is the only sin that can not be forgiven if we die in that state. There is no pardon for a person who dies in the STATE of un-belief.
Therefor IMHO the un-pardonable sin is not a singular event for which a person later feels bad about but instead it is an on-going and active rejection of the testimony of the Holy Spirit concerning the person and truth about the Lord Jesus Christ and it can only be committed by an unbeliever.
 
SNIP.
bout is more of an "unforgivable STATE"........the state of unbelief and that is the only sin that can not be forgiven if we die in that state. There is no pardon for a person who dies in the STATE of un-belief.
Therefor IMHO the un-pardonable sin is not a singular event for which a person later feels bad about but instead it is an on-going and active rejection of the testimony of the Holy Spirit concerning the person and truth about the Lord Jesus Christ and it can only be committed by an unbeliever.
I agree that this can only be committed by an unbeliever.
Now in the topic passage, (1 John 5:16), though John begins his argument by focusing on 'brother' ie a fellow Christian, his observation that there is sin that leads to death is in contrast to the sins of a brother. In John's mind, we are to pray for a brother who is sinning, but we need to be a bit more thrifty when it comes to prayer for those who are not yet brothers in Christ. Not all, but some unbelievers have so hardened their hearts that they have placed themselves beyond redemption. These would be those John has reservations about praying for.
To my mind, this is a dangerous playground because it invites us to judge the 'salvation' prospects of persons. We are left with the rather uncomfortable position of trying to decide which unsaved can be and which unsaved can not be saved :cautious::unsure::cautious:.
It seems to me therefore that John gave only advice here rather than a clear instruction.
Sadly, I used to know one such person who after much prayer for, I was given the conviction that he has gone beyond redemption.
I'm not comfortable about my former friend, but what can one do??
I figure the best we can do is pray for the lost until such time as the Holy Spirit says 'stop'.
We need to focus on grace not grief.
 
Surprisingly (well at least to me), I thought I knew what this scripture meant, altho, it has often (it seems to me) been used to condemn other Christians. And to condemn other denominations, as well as non-christians. When I first came to this forum, I thought I had a good understanding of God. Out of pride, I thought maybe I knew better than most. I also knew very little about the Holy Spirit. Maybe because I really had it in a separate category. I accepted Christ as a toddler. I have always known God and Jesus - it's a gift of grace and I never doubted. I learned what the block was here reading posts and writing them. I knew I could talk to God/Jesus, what I didn't know was how to listen to the "Holy Spirit" (dunno if I am explaining this right). I gave myself credit for actually how the Spirit was working in me - out of me- around me. It is this part of the Trinity that makes Christianity a very personal thing. To reject that part of myself seems inconcievable to me, once it is there. I think we don't actually do alot of explaining what the Holy Spirit it is and what it's for - either to non-believers or newer Christians. But it is the part of us that grieves when someone walks away from salvation. The unbeliever doesn't understand that concept and has not felt it. For someone who has felt the Holy Spirit and never stops to listen and then rejects - I can't think of anything worse.
 
I agree that this can only be committed by an unbeliever.
Now in the topic passage, (1 John 5:16), though John begins his argument by focusing on 'brother' ie a fellow Christian, his observation that there is sin that leads to death is in contrast to the sins of a brother. In John's mind, we are to pray for a brother who is sinning, but we need to be a bit more thrifty when it comes to prayer for those who are not yet brothers in Christ. Not all, but some unbelievers have so hardened their hearts that they have placed themselves beyond redemption. These would be those John has reservations about praying for.
To my mind, this is a dangerous playground because it invites us to judge the 'salvation' prospects of persons. We are left with the rather uncomfortable position of trying to decide which unsaved can be and which unsaved can not be saved :cautious::unsure::cautious:.
It seems to me therefore that John gave only advice here rather than a clear instruction.
Sadly, I used to know one such person who after much prayer for, I was given the conviction that he has gone beyond redemption.
I'm not comfortable about my former friend, but what can one do??
I figure the best we can do is pray for the lost until such time as the Holy Spirit says 'stop'.
We need to focus on grace not grief.

I agree with you calvin. It can be just exactly as you have stated.
Please know that I am not advocating the judging salvation prospects of people, only trying to explain what the passage is saying IMHO.
 
I agree with you calvin. It can be just exactly as you have stated.
Please know that I am not advocating the judging salvation prospects of people, only trying to explain what the passage is saying IMHO.

I, too, agree with Calvin and it was put in a logical way that I hadn't quite grasped before.
 
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