Sin-Nature

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Noblemen, Mar 31, 2016.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. oh, I agree with you. I tell it all the time that it is dead and to leave me alone. But it just laughs at me and continues. Actually, I am sure that I am the only one on this forum who has let a word slip out, or had an impure thought when I see that pretty little woman in her swim suit and I positive that not another single person has told a little lie.

    And Lord knows that I am the only person who looks in envy at my neighbors brand new Cadillac wishing that I had one too.
     
  2. The reality is that folks like to pick and choose their theology, ignore, reject, and abuse the word of God to push their views so they can boast in the flesh and live a self-centered empty life while blaming God for their issues all while denying their conscience. They live like there's a contradiction in the word of God and disbelieve what they don't have faith for and discount most of the power of the word of God. That's why they have no manifestations of God in their lives, can't overcome sin, they don't believe when others do, and they look at the word of God more as a historical book than our owner's manual or for finding the Lord God ALMIGHTY. They believe it's for others and not them. ALL wrong thinking, but then the word of God warns of this too.
     
  3. It's not that you GOT the thought, but what you do with the thought. That's what makes all the difference. Jesus was temped, so the thought were there too! How can you overcome if it's not presented. Not giving into or think on those things is the key. EVERYONE including Jesus had those thoughts and He rejected them. It's when we ACT on those thoughts to give in, even pondering them without mind's eye, it becomes a sin. This is why Jesus said that looking upon a woman with lust (playing out scenarios in the mind's eye) is the same as physically committing it. Learn what sin is and you'll see you're more an overcomer than you think. God bless brother.
     
  4. My first comment wasn't directed at Major, nor anyone else specific. I was replying to the sin nature question. @Major replied to you right when I pressed enter. We ALL have to deal with sin nature. Major replied to you and then I to him in my second comment. A lot of people listen to the lie that "because I had the thought, I sinned". That's not scriptural. It's what we do with that thought that matters. How can we capture a thought to keep from sinning if the thought itself is considered a sin!?
     
  5. I agree completely. But when that is done, what then to we say to those who will not accept it just as it is printed? I uselly do not make long posts and I do not place this much time into conversations. But this seems to be a very active thread so I am going to do what I do not do to see if the Scriptures will really do what you ask. Lets see shall we????????

    You have stated that Rom. 7:14-25 is speaking of Paul before he was saved. Of course the reason for that is to spiritualize what Paul wrote so as to make it look like he was not saying that as a Christian he was affected by his old nature of sin and in fact was still a sinner.
    Now, what you said and believe may or may not be true but the fact is that it does not say that.

    You have stated if I remember correctly that verse 14 is the key: .........
    “I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin”.

    Then point to verse 18, which says, “For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.”

    The conclusion then being that Paul has to be a non-Christian because a Christian knows how to do what’s good. There seems to be an obvious lack of the Holy Spirit’s power here. Now that is what I remember but I may not be correct but it seems like we had that conversation and I just do not feel like going thru all the posts to find which one.

    So then, the change in verb tenses is a clue that this passage applies to a Christian. The verbs in Romans 7:7-13 are in fact in the past tense. It is those verses which refer to Paul’s life before his conversion and the process of conviction he experienced when he stood face to face with the law of God. However in verses 14–25, where we see the battle with sin taking place, they are in the present tense.

    I believe Romans 7:14-25 is Paul’s own testimony of how it is to live as a Spirit controlled, mature believer. He loves the holy law of God with his whole heart, but finds himself wrapped in human flesh and unable to fulfill it the way his heart wants him to because he still has that old nature of sin.

    Now notice the despair of verse 24—“Wretched man that I am!” (I am being present tense.)

    It seems far removed from the promise of Rom. 5:1-2..........
    “Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our introduction by faith into this grace in which we stand; and we exult in hope of the glory of God.”

    But lets move from chapter 7 and to chapter 6 of Romans keeping in mind that we are talking about Paul BEFORE he was saved being the thesis for your thinking of the Old Sin Nature.

    Chapter 6 emphasizes the new creation, the new nature, the new identity, the new person in Christ, and the holiness of the believer. In his new redeemed self, the believer is no longer under sin’s dominion. However, chapter 7 gives the other side, isn't that correct??????

    Every Christian knows from experience that though he is a new creature in Christ, sin is still a problem. In fact, that conflict is pointed out even in chapter 6:12-13...........
    “Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness”.

    Because it’s still possible for Christians to yield to sin, even though we are commanded not to.

    Arguing that chapter 7 cannot refer to a Christian because of statements in chapter 6 is to misunderstand the intention of chapter 6.

    Paul says in Rom. 7:22............
    “For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man”.

    That certainly isn’t something a non Christian could accurately claim.

    Romans 8:7 says that the unregenerate person is not subject to the law of God.

    In Romans 7:25 Paul says.............
    “Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, on the one hand I myself with my mind am serving the law of God.”

    That sounds like a Christian.

    Romans 3:23 tells us that the unsaved person has no such longing to do the will of God.......
    “There is none who understands, there is none who seeks for God....There is none who does good, there is not even one".

    Then Romans 3:11-2 & 18 says..........
    "There is no fear of God before their eyes”.

    Can you then see and understand that the conflict described in Romans 7 can only be true of a redeemed person????

    Some say that Romans 7:14-25 describes Paul’s struggle before he was saved. But again, it is the mature Christian who possesses an honest self evaluation of himself. Isn't that exactly what Paul exhibited that in passages other than Romans 7.

    To the Corinthians Paul said in 1 Corth. 15:9-10........
    “I am the least of the apostles, and not fit to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am” .

    Then in Ephesians 3:8 he said to the Ephesian Christians that he considered himself..............
    "the very least of all saints.)

    That 1 Corinthians was written before Ephesians shows he became more sensitive to sin as time went on. Although in our judgment Paul is the supreme man relative to other men, he saw himself as having fallen from the position of the least of the apostles to the least of all believers.

    Then back to Romans 7 we see the terms Paul uses in Romans 7 are so precise that we can’t miss his struggle with sin. He states that he hates committing sin (v. 15), loves righteousness (vv. 19, 21), delights in the law of God from the bottom of his heart (v. 22), and thanks God for the deliverance that is his in Christ (v. 25). Those are the responses of a mature Christian.

    Although Christians are not in the flesh, the flesh is still in us. Were no longer held captive to it, but we can still act fleshly or carnal.

    In 1 Corinthians 3:1, 3 Paul says..............
    “I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ.…For you are still fleshly; for since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking like mere men?”.

    He reproved the Corinthian Christians for acting in a fleshly or non-Christian way.

    1 Corinthians 15:53 & 57............
    “For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality....Thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ”.

    That is almost the same phrase Paul uses in Romans 7:25 in reference to our bodily resurrection and glorification.

    2 Corinthians 5:4...............
    “While we are in this tent, we groan, being burdened, because we do not want to be unclothed but to be clothed, so that what immortal will be swallowed up by life” (v. 4).

    Philippians 3:20-21............
    “We eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; who will transform the body of our humble state into conformity with the body of His glory”.

    Yet the battle goes on. We cry with Lord Tennyson, who wrote.........
    “Ah for a new man to arise in me, that the man I am cease to be!” (Maud, x. 5).

    The battle won’t be over until Jesus gives us immortality. Full deliverance awaits glorification. But we can experience victory here and now in the power of the Holy Spirit.

    Now you said that we "must read the scripture as there written".
    I have agreed with and given you a lot of Scriptures JUST AS THEY ARE WRITTEN. But you know what??????
    They will not change one single mind!

    My experience of over 50 years of doing this is that when someone is entrenched in what they believe truth is, no matter what is said, they will not budge even when the Scriptures stare them right in the face.

    So having said all of this, I bid you a wonderful day tomorrow and encourage you to go to your church and give God all the praise and glory because He is worthy to be praised.
     
    Big Moose likes this.
  6. You are right. It is called "Cafeteria Christianity" and it is used by a lot of people.
     
  7. #48 Major, Apr 9, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2016
    I have no clue Chris. Maybe I read it wrong but it sure seemed it was directed at us.
     
  8. You said........
    "My first comment wasn't directed at Major."............"nor anyone else specific".

    There are FOUR people on this thread. ME, CCW95A, Complete and Marilyn.

    Your 1st response was to this posting of mine to @Complete which I really thought everyone knew was facetious and silly.............
    "oh, I agree with you. I tell it all the time that it is dead and to leave me alone. But it just laughs at me and continues. Actually, I am sure that I am the only one on this forum who has let a word slip out, or had an impure thought when I see that pretty little woman in her swim suit and I positive that not another single person has told a little lie.

    And Lord knows that I am the only person who looks in envy at my neighbors brand new Cadillac wishing that I had one too."


    Now where exactly in that post are the words ""because I had the thought, I sinned".
     
  9. Your words may have been idle, Mat 12:36, but they still speak a lot of truth that some people would rather give up thinking it's possible to cease from sin and just stop trying altogether, 2 Peter 2:14, living a defeated life.
     
  10. So they are NOT there at all.
     
  11. Huh? I don't understand your statement.
     
  12. I asked you where the words ""because I had the thought, I sinned" were? (45).

    Those are your words in #45. You began that idea of me saying something like that in #43................

    "It's when we ACT on those thoughts to give in, even pondering them without mind's eye, it becomes a sin" (#43).

    I simply asked you where I said those words to which you said..............
    "Your words may have been idle, Mat 12:36, but they still speak a lot of truth that some people would rather give up thinking it's possible to cease from sin and just stop trying altogether, 2 Peter 2:14, living a defeated life."

    Not only did I not say those words, I never even implied them. Abdicate, your response and comment was hurtful and insulting to me and as Complete said to you "Why are you resorting to this"?
     
  13.  
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page