Questions for Americans - From Africa with love

[Lanolin]

Hey Lanolin,
Hope your good.

America holds a key prophetic position biblically. Whatever she goes through is a stage indicative of the times (either bygone, current or to come).

I like to see her as a litmus test. God did not always abandon for ever though He punished sin faithfully. After all, He chastises the one He loves.

I am no bible scholar, but even I can see that the current events and their interrelationship are spookily coincidental. I know God is up to something.

The good thing about this forum, is that we have the wealth of knowledge and resources from those who have gone really deep in the word of God. So you get to learn a lot.


In my view though, there is something about America and Israel and I just can't shake it.

well, alot of God's chosen ones (the jewish people) were exiled to america (in bible, spiritually part of mystery babylon) and so there's that connection I suppose. But, the wandering jews went to every nation. my country has many jewish people that were influential in politics, eg now we have a PM whose background is Jewish. i.e circumcised if I want to be graphic about that covenant. Covenant means 'to cut' even if they aren't practising jews, they assimilated into the gentile world.

I just want to comment that, I never really knew that George Washington swore on a MASONIC bible before but there you go. Freemasonry is everywhere as well. Its trying to build the kingdom, but its a satanic one.

 

[Major]

News outlets ? Really ? Brother here is the deal - if a born again believer is going to judge another servant of God they better be walking a faultless life. Everything they say and stand for better be 110 percent correct in the eyes of God and I am talking about spiritual under standing of Hos written word.

Now then if one looks to everything these accusers post- say and agree with then it is clear they are not in-line to make such judgment calls.
So where is it that God has instructed His children to speak out against His ?

Jim, if the Pope was recorded as saying in the Washington Post, Newsweek Magazine and posted on the internet from UPI and YOU fact checked the comment of:
"Jesus is not the only way a man is allowed to enter heaven by. We MUST ALSO believe that Peter is His co-redeemer and accept him as Saviour also".

and you find it to be a truthful statement, would you ignore it and say nothing about it as you are encouraging us to do now ..........?

When heresy is spoken, are you telling us to ignore it and just leave it alone???

 

[Lanolin]

Poverty can also be in spirit. One can be broken emotionally with billions, but still know their need for God.

True. Like Mr getty. He was really rich and had everything but later realised it was nothing. I read a memoir written by his last wife and it was heartbreaking. Their only son together died really young and he was way to busy with his business and womanising to care or go to the hospital to see him when he was sick.

 

[Major]

News outlets ? Really ? Brother here is the deal - if a born again believer is going to judge another servant of God they better be walking a faultless life. Everything they say and stand for better be 110 percent correct in the eyes of God and I am talking about spiritual under standing of Hos written word.

Now then if one looks to everything these accusers post- say and agree with then it is clear they are not in-line to make such judgment calls.
So where is it that God has instructed His children to speak out against His ?

Galatians 2:14................
" But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, why do compel Gentiles to live as Jews?"

1 Timothy 5:20.............
"Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear."

John 7:24..................
"Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”

1 Corinthians 14:29..............
" Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others judge. "

2 Timothy 2:17-18.............
"And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort, who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some. "

 

[Lanolin]

On benny hinn....

I have read a few books by him.
I would say, since I havent actually met him in person, that hes sincere but gone astray at times and people miscontrue his actions. I dont know that his doctrine is completely sound on some things.

But he might have repented on that.
As for visitng kathryn khulmans grave, i think thats just what any normal believer would do if they had a friend that passed on. I have read a few books by her as well. She seems genuine. Of course these are people who have a gift from God but are also human and make mistakes. But God can still call them to reach out to people anyway, they are not perfect but being perfected.

I think they just rankle some believers cause they are 'showy'. But thats what many people are in america i suppose, its a 'showy' faith. You go to church and its all set up for the cameras. I know some people are really disappointed that when they go to healing services, not everyone is healed. But God does not always make miracles on demand for every single person.

 

[Lanolin]

I do know that many faith healers are kind of conmen in america doing the rounds though, so be cautious. Faith in Jesus is our salvation, not whther we are healed from this or that condition all the time.

 

[Penion]

I do know that many faith healers are kind of conmen in america doing the rounds though, so be cautious. Faith in Jesus is our salvation, not whther we are healed from this or that condition all the time.

Lanolin,

I like your posts. I have been disabled for 40 years. I went to a healing meeting and the guy said I was healed! Threw out my medication, and soon I was in the hospital. It wasn't a lack of faith on my part or his, just God Sovereignly choosing to do things in His way and time.

Joni Eareckson Tada, the quadraplegic whom God has blessed mightily, many times sought God for healing. Then she realized that it was His will to stay in her wheelchair. And what a ministry she has had!

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Jim, if the Pope was recorded as saying in the Washington Post, Newsweek Magazine and posted on the internet from UPI and YOU fact checked the comment of:
"Jesus is not the only way a man is allowed to enter heaven by. We MUST ALSO believe that Peter is His co-redeemer and accept him as Saviour also".

and you find it to be a truthful statement, would you ignore it and say nothing about it as you are encouraging us to do now ..........?

When heresy is spoken, are you telling us to ignore it and just leave it alone???

No Major I did not mean to ignore "REAL" HERESY" - The problem is that far to many people are accusing others to be false when it is only because they have no insight or understanding in what is being taught.

If it goes against Jesus is the only way then yea it is wrong and should be corrected. If it is simply because you dont like the way this man teaches or you dont think this man is really of God because you dont think what he says lines up with scripture - then the judgment is by what you think and NOT GOD. (( OBTW the word YOU is used in general as to any one and is NOT directed to YOU Major )

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Galatians 2:14................
" But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, why do compel Gentiles to live as Jews?"

1 Timothy 5:20.............
"Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear."

John 7:24..................
"Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”

1 Corinthians 14:29..............
" Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others judge. "

2 Timothy 2:17-18.............
"And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort, who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some. "

Major come on now - I know you better then this - to pull or clip a piece of scripture such as 1timothy5:20 and make it say - go ye into all the world anhd rebuk those who are sinning.

Keep the scripture true to why and for what reason it was being said.
This was talkiing about eldors so we can say leadership. We are told to NOT listen to accusations against them - we are told to confront them - meaning find out if this is true or not - then if it is - rebuke

So this would mean in your own church. This does not say - hey here is your badge and you are now authorised to go to and fro seeking any sinning you can find and expose it and rebuke it in front of crowds.

This sounds like our enemy the devil and the media
God Bless
Jim

 

[Major]

No Major I did not mean to ignore "REAL" HERESY" - The problem is that far to many people are accusing others to be false when it is only because they have no insight or understanding in what is being taught.

If it goes against Jesus is the only way then yea it is wrong and should be corrected. If it is simply because you dont like the way this man teaches or you dont think this man is really of God because you dont think what he says lines up with scripture - then the judgment is by what you think and NOT GOD. (( OBTW the word YOU is used in general as to any one and is NOT directed to YOU Major )

Jim, from Geneis to Revelation, one of the major themes in the Bible is correction.

I agree that gossip and rumors are infectious and destructive and I am in not way talking about those things. I am referring to admitted, know comments which are documented for all to read. When those things said are not in line with God's Word, then ALL people who are born again are called to challenge those teachings.

Our example is the Lord Jesus Christ who did not hesitate to call religious leaders "hypocrites", "vipers", Whited sepulchers", and "blind leading the blind".

Jesus, as far as I can tell did not take a Dale Carnegie course in How to Win Friends and Influence People. He presented TRUTH and condemned the false teachers, and He did it OPENLY.

IF there is to be a return to Biblical Christianity, then no one in any church denomination can claim immunity from correction when anything they say is not Biblical. We are living it seems in a world where a form of Christian guruism has placed certain leaders up on a pedestal of infallibility. Those leaders are not to be questioned in any way because to do so would be to go against the Scriptures with say "Do not touch mine anointed" in Psalms 105:14-15. We also tend to point to Saul and David.

Well the real truth is that those words have NOTHING to do with legitimate correction. It is wrong and inaccurate to use that Old Test. phrase as a basis of not correcting heretical teachings. But what is the REAL Biblical truth here??????

David did not kill Saul BUT he did REBUKE him publically in front of the army of Israel and his own men. So then a proper understanding of this Scripture would therefore require us to do the same thing and publically rebuke the anointed of the Lord for doing or saying that which is not Biblically true.

If you will remember, Paul correctly rebuked Peter publically in Galatians 2:14.

 

[Major]

Major come on now - I know you better then this - to pull or clip a piece of scripture such as 1timothy5:20 and make it say - go ye into all the world anhd rebuk those who are sinning.

Keep the scripture true to why and for what reason it was being said.
This was talkiing about eldors so we can say leadership. We are told to NOT listen to accusations against them - we are told to confront them - meaning find out if this is true or not - then if it is - rebuke

So this would mean in your own church. This does not say - hey here is your badge and you are now authorised to go to and fro seeking any sinning you can find and expose it and rebuke it in front of crowds.

This sounds like our enemy the devil and the media
God Bless
Jim

Jim........please! I did not say what you are implying my brother. You just stated I said........
"go ye into all the world anhd rebuk those who are sinning."

You know that is not what I said at all. In fact I did not say anything at all!!!!! I only posted the Word of God which does all the talking.

1 Timothy 5:20.............
"Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear."

Is that what Paul said. Is that what the Scriptures say. Does anyone see MY name associated with this Scripture.

Our conversation has been focused on whether or not anything should be said about those Christians who speak heresy and if they should be publicly challenged. YOU KNOW THAT.

To that end I posted exactly what the Word of God says.........
"Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear."

IF the facts are known that a church leader has sinned, or taught heresy, or is a false teacher, he is to be rebuked. The Bible verses I quoted said that YES, it was done in the past openly IN THE PRESENCE OF ALL.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Jim........please! I did not say what you are implying my brother. You just stated I said........
"go ye into all the world anhd rebuk those who are sinning."

You know that is not what I said at all. In fact I did not say anything at all!!!!! I only posted the Word of God which does all the talking.

1 Timothy 5:20.............
"Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear."

Is that what Paul said. Is that what the Scriptures say. Does anyone see MY name associated with this Scripture.

Our conversation has been focused on whether or not anything should be said about those Christians who speak heresy and if they should be publicly challenged. YOU KNOW THAT.

To that end I posted exactly what the Word of God says.........
"Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear."

IF the facts are known that a church leader has sinned, or taught heresy, or is a false teacher, he is to be rebuked. The Bible verses I quoted said that YES, it was done in the past openly IN THE PRESENCE OF ALL.

Major you seemj to have over looked a big point I made - YOU does not mean you major but you as in general or as any one in this world.

Yes I did say you pull out a tid bid piece of scripture.
Usi9ng this scripture in Timothy about open rebuke for anything you feel fit is not correct. Again YOU is NOT Major but YOU is any one.

I dont care if 15 pastors and 2 thousand members "think" some one is preaching heresy they need to be 110 percent clear on this. Most of the time it is simply lack of understanding..

Pastors and ministries attack ministries in which claim Gods healing is for today. They claim heresy.....does this make it so ? NO !!

Major now I am talking about something you said - Major said Jesus rebuked religious leaders and so should we. ( Short version ) Jesus rebuked them for falsely accusing - preaching other ways other then Gods Grace and so forth.

 

[Major]

Major you seemj to have over looked a big point I made - YOU does not mean you major but you as in general or as any one in this world.

Yes I did say you pull out a tid bid piece of scripture.
Usi9ng this scripture in Timothy about open rebuke for anything you feel fit is not correct. Again YOU is NOT Major but YOU is any one.

I dont care if 15 pastors and 2 thousand members "think" some one is preaching heresy they need to be 110 percent clear on this. Most of the time it is simply lack of understanding..

Pastors and ministries attack ministries in which claim Gods healing is for today. They claim heresy.....does this make it so ? NO !!

Major now I am talking about something you said - Major said Jesus rebuked religious leaders and so should we. ( Short version ) Jesus rebuked them for falsely accusing - preaching other ways other then Gods Grace and so forth.

You said............
"Major now I am talking about something you said - Major said Jesus rebuked religious leaders and so should we. ( Short version ) Jesus rebuked them for falsely accusing - preaching other ways other then Gods Grace and so forth."

YES I did say that and still contend it to be 100% Biblically true and it is the basis with which I have made any and all comments on false teachers who preach there things beside the Word of God.

IF...IF I post anything concerning a preacher/teacher you can take it to the bank that I have and always will post exactly what they said, including the resourse, chapter and page or TV show with the date it was said.

That complies with the rules of CFS aas well as good common sense.

 

[Silk]

You said............
"Major now I am talking about something you said - Major said Jesus rebuked religious leaders and so should we. ( Short version ) Jesus rebuked them for falsely accusing - preaching other ways other then Gods Grace and so forth."

YES I did say that and still contend it to be 100% Biblically true and it is the basis with which I have made any and all comments on false teachers who preach there things beside the Word of God.

IF...IF I post anything concerning a preacher/teacher you can take it to the bank that I have and always will post exactly what they said, including the resourse, chapter and page or TV show with the date it was said.

That complies with the rules of CFS aas well as good common sense.

Some people don't seem to understand what 100% means. Or what in-context scripture means. Scripture is replete, from OT to NT that you are to question/test what is told to you by anyone representing him or herself as of God. Truth welcomes this - the false does not. One poster has talked about gossiping among the forums. I only go to this one. Gossip is not posting questions and opinions for all to see nor is it gossiping to compare what people say to what scripture says. Gossip is what is sometimes done by critiquing fellow posters in PMs. Scripture doesn't always say what we want to hear but then we don't always want to hear truth. Correction is something every Christian should welcome -- none of us is 100% right. When correction is done out of love and still vigorously reject it, time to move on. When correction is done simply to show one's position is right or a sort of elitism, it should be questioned and rejected, particularly if it goes against context (or all of)scripture. We all want to get it right for our own salvation.

 

[Lanolin]

Ok im lost.
Jesus is the anointed one.
He is the christ, the messiah, not us.

We are in christ as his body, and i suppose therefore will be anointed like he was with the holy spirit.

But this does not mean we cannot see if a brother or sister is going astray to correct him or her. Remember Jesus is the only begotten son of God. The rest of us are adopted co heirs. Brothers and sisters. Anyone claiming they are something other is false. I dont think anyone is claiming that here, or we are 'touching' the anointed one, that verse seems to be taken completely out of contrxt and used to say we cant correct anyone and tell the truth in love. As for those preaching that have shown the error of their ways they will need to repent. Its not good to lead people astray esp if you in teaching position.

 

[Major]

Some people don't seem to understand what 100% means. Or what in-context scripture means. Scripture is replete, from OT to NT that you are to question/test what is told to you by anyone representing him or herself as of God. Truth welcomes this - the false does not. One poster has talked about gossiping among the forums. I only go to this one. Gossip is not posting questions and opinions for all to see nor is it gossiping to compare what people say to what scripture says. Gossip is what is sometimes done by critiquing fellow posters in PMs. Scripture doesn't always say what we want to hear but then we don't always want to hear truth. Correction is something every Christian should welcome -- none of us is 100% right. When correction is done out of love and still vigorously reject it, time to move on. When correction is done simply to show one's position is right or a sort of elitism, it should be questioned and rejected, particularly if it goes against context (or all of)scripture. We all want to get it right for our own salvation.

Absolutely correct my sister. Some people on this site have become very upset over Bible quotes posted. I have noticed that some then attack the poster as if they wrote what was posted from the Scriptures.

That just amazes me to no end. I have to say very frankly that there are many, many Bible verses and doctrines that I do not like.

For one, I hate the idea of any one having to go to hell. I just hate the thought!!!! But it is what the Word of God says and He did not ask me for any input whatsoever.

A lot of us must come to the simple fact that it is what it is for us to accept or reject instead of altering or spiritualizing its meaning.

When someone...anyone no matter who they are, openly twist or change or present false Bible doctrines, they themselves have opened the door of correction.

 

[Major]

No Major I did not mean to ignore "REAL" HERESY" - The problem is that far to many people are accusing others to be false when it is only because they have no insight or understanding in what is being taught.

If it goes against Jesus is the only way then yea it is wrong and should be corrected. If it is simply because you dont like the way this man teaches or you dont think this man is really of God because you dont think what he says lines up with scripture - then the judgment is by what you think and NOT GOD. (( OBTW the word YOU is used in general as to any one and is NOT directed to YOU Major )

But in all humbleness Jim.....some of us do in fact have insight and understanding in what is being said and taught.

Some of us were doing these kinds of things long before CFS was even a website tool. My calling from God has NOT been to formulate "ad hominen attacks" against anyone because I have no desire to win an argument and I certainly am not trying to improve my position because I have no position at all.

Arguing with the messenger doesn't prove that his message is wrong. My message is that the words that people actually say that do not agree with God's Word then makes them false teachers. When that happens they must be help accountable for what they have in fact said.

Really now........if a person is teaching false Bible doctrine, don't you want them to be challenged for the sake of the younger Christians so that they will not stumble and fall into sin????

 

[Major]

Hey Lanolin,
Hope your good.

America holds a key prophetic position biblically. Whatever she goes through is a stage indicative of the times (either bygone, current or to come).

I like to see her as a litmus test. God did not always abandon for ever though He punished sin faithfully. After all, He chastises the one He loves.

I am no bible scholar, but even I can see that the current events and their interrelationship are spookily coincidental. I know God is up to something.

The good thing about this forum, is that we have the wealth of knowledge and resources from those who have gone really deep in the word of God. So you get to learn a lot.

In my view though, there is something about America and Israel and I just can't shake it.

What Bible passage or passages would you post that will state that America has a ....
"America holds a key prophetic position biblically."

 

[Mercedes Benz E Class]

Ok I could be wrong.
Peace please.

 

[Silk]

Ok I could be wrong.
Peace please.

I kinda understood what you meant tho I would think America is a melting pot of all the tribes of man. It could mean that America isn't mentioned in scripture because it goes down before? the tribulation end days