Question About Something That Has Been Bothering Me

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Sweet Pea, Jan 26, 2014.

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  1. I am hesitant to ask this since several members have been in the hot seat, lately, but I have been wondering about it since I read about it in another thread. Before I ask, I would also like to ask that we remain respectful to each other. Please lets not turn this into an argumentative thread like the others. Once they go downhill, I stop participating, but I would really like answers.

    Why do people kiss bones of dead saints? I saw a skull on a platter (or pillow) and I googled it to find out about it, which led me to another site that showed other saints dressed up in jewels and posed. I have to admit I was bothered by the pictures that I saw. What is that all about?

    I'm not sure if I should post a link to the website to show you? I don't want anyone to think I am being critical... my FIL, step-MIL, and a couple of friends of mine are Catholic, which is probably why I have so many questions about Catholicism. I mean no disrespect. Again, please lets not turn this into an argumentative thread like the others.
  2. I am no Catholic, so as gently as I can say this in typing: the eyes and hears of those receiving the message can either discern the truth of a thing through the Holy Spirit-or they can't. Many will claim that Spirit, but few will actually KNOW that Spirit. I tread lightly saying these things lest I fall into the trap of my own vain pride.

    How do you discern what you saw?
  3. go ahead and post the URL .. I will do my best to give you my honest opinion ..
    if you posted it with negative opinion attached, then I doubt it would be received well .. but you are respectful and deserve a respectful answer ..

    in the meantime, why is there pictures of Michael Jordan kissing the floor when He won the NBA finals or the Blackhawks kissing the Stanley Cup .. my opinion is most likely a similar answer ..
  4. Brother Mike: Well, in all honesty, I felt very uneasy and then I got sick in my stomach. It seemed morbid and I couldn't figure out the purpose.

    The pictures I saw looked like the skeletons in the ride Pirates of the Carribean at Disneyland. You know how the skeletons are posed with jewels, cups, and treasures... but real. I don't mean that to be funny at all. I didn't think I should keep looking at the photos.

    I read about venerating... not quite sure what that really means, but if I were dead, I wouldn't like to be displayed like that.
  5. Okay, I will find it. I don't think the articles was positive, but maybe if you can see it, you can understand my last post.
  6. sure .. but what you must understand is cultures .. the Jewish and Italian cultures have always put people in crypts and about a year later, go in and clean the bones and put them in an ossuary box .. so they are not all "freaked out" by dead bones ..
    even Jesus was put into a shroud with herbs (scent control) and laid on the niche for decomposition .. a tomb like this was filled with many generations of ossuary boxes ..

    American Indians sometimes put the dead on an apparatus in the air ..

    the jewels etc are most likely their erroneous way to honor them ..
    I say erroneous, as that is very worldly ..
  7. a "bier" is a stand on which a corpse, or coffin or casket containing a corpse is placed prior to being entombed .. so why do people in America display the dead ???

    here is a typical 1st century Hebrew tomb ..
    a "niche" or "shelf for the body" (the correct term is loculus) was carved in the wall of tombs where a body would decompose .. after "a period of time" the family would re-enter and clean the bones and place them into an ossaray ..
  8. these were dug up from the catacombs .. and then transferred to private vaults .. nonetheless there are some Saints & Popes that are exhibited that have not undergone decay .. and as far as I am aware, there is no medical explanation for this .. in my opinion, it equates to nothing more then a perpetual wake .. and if a miracle by God, then why would you hide a miracle by God .. just saying ..

    again the gold and jewels are lavish .. and I doubt the Saint would have appreciated it .. however it is "their culture" to honor them such .. there are many customs in this world that seem strange to us, and then again our customs seem strange to those people .. for instance, when I die, I am donating my body to science .. many cringe at that .. but the net result is it makes ZERO difference what happens to your remains after you die .. so I personally am open-minded to other cultures and their right to do things as they wish ..
  9. I don't understand why they were parading around a skull with a gold mask, or displaying people's bodies in this manner. I don't think the actual person would like people seeing them in this manner, either. Why do they do this?
  10. #12 ixoye_8, Jan 26, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2014
    have you ever been to an Irish wake ???
    they are essentially a celebration ..
    sometimes they resemble "Weekend at Bernie's" ..
    I remember an attorney who died, and they put him in the passenger seat of his corvette and drove in procession that way ..

    people who are God fearing, are not sad at funerals ..
    my dad just before he died, was singing hymns because he was going to meet God ..
    RosaVera likes this.
  11. I'll tell you something else about that ..
    when he died, I was kinda mad and sad about it at first ..
    then it hit me .. I was only feeling that way because of my ego ..
    it was my loss not his gain that I was looking at ..

    God Bless you ..
    AllieWi and RosaVera say Amen and like this.
  12. Saints don't do this, so it could not be pictures of saints. There are scriptures about lifting up the dead and handling the dead. A person that serves God obeys the the scripture.

    There are things I do not participate in though others do because of the Word.
  13. just asking .. are those scripture you are speaking about under the Law of Moses ???
    because if they are .. then they don't apply to those under the Law of Christ ..

    BTW: did they not take Jesus down from the cross ???
  14. the Law is perfect and good, it's man that could not keep the law, nor do we steal, commit adultery or other things since we be in Christ and God never changes.

    However if God never changes is not good enough, or you believe we are free to do as we please now despite scripture..........

    Mat 23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
    Mat 23:27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

    what did Jesus compare dead bones to? we suppose to put severed heads on platters and parade them around? IT'S UNCLEAN!!! the Lord of the church said.

    If He said dead mans bones are full of ALL............ ALL.........ALL uncleanness then we don't bring them to church service do we?

    red letters trump everything.
  15. The use of ossuaries is also found among the laity in the Greek Orthodox Church. The departed will be buried for one to three years and then, often on the anniversary of death, the family will gather with the parish priest and celebrate a parastas (memorial service), after which the remains are disinterred, washed with wine, perfumed, and placed in a small ossuary of wood or metal, inscribed with the name of the departed, and placed in a room, often in or near the church, which is dedicated to this purpose.

    Jewish ossuary inscription from Second Temple period.
    During the time of the Second Temple, Jewish burial customs included primary burials in burial caves, followed by secondary burials in ossuaries placed in smaller niches of the burial caves. Some of the limestone ossuaries that have been discovered, particularly around the Jerusalem area, include intricate geometrical patterns and inscriptions identifying the deceased. Among the best-known Jewish ossuaries of this period are: an ossuary inscribed 'Simon the Temple builder' in the collection of the Israel Museum, another inscribed 'Elisheba wife of Tarfon', one inscribed 'Yehohanan ben Hagkol' that contained an iron nail in a heel bone suggesting crucifixion, another inscribed 'James son of Joseph, brother of Jesus', the authenticity of which is suspect, and ten ossuaries recovered from the Talpiot Tomb in 1980, several of which are reported to have names from the New Testament.

    During the Second Temple period, Jewish sages debated whether the occasion of the gathering of a parent's bones for a secondary burial was a day of sorrow or rejoicing; it was resolved that it was a day of fasting in the morning and feasting in the afternoon. The custom of secondary burial in ossuaries did not persist among Jews past the Second Temple period (70ad) nor appear to exist among Jews outside the land of Israel.

    which is incorrect as the large Jewish population of Rome is who passed it on to the church .. and Italy has had this custom from the time of the Apostles until today ..
    Rosa was born in Italy and affirmed this as a fact to me ..
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  16. lol .. let me help you with that ..

    Mat 23:26 “You blind Pharisee, first clean the inside of the cup and of the dish, so that the outside of it may become clean also.

    Jesus is using it as a metaphor ..
    the cup and dish are THEM ..
    he is saying CLEAN YOUR HEART (inside) and what is outside follows ..
    the same as when he said it is what that is in a man's heart that defiles them ..
    RosaVera likes this.
  17. #19 ixoye_8, Jan 26, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2014
    as to white-washed tombs .. that is what the Jews did just prior to Pesach (passover) they painted them white .. yet the decay was still within ..

    in other words, looking holy/clean on the outside doesn't help ..
    first clean what is inside (the heart) and what is outside (your words and deeds) is not a lie, and will be correct ..

    that is what Jesus was telling the Pharisees ..
    they acted all holy/clean, but inside had rotten tomato/unclean hearts ..
  18. this without a doubt shows he was using it as a metaphor for them ..

    Mat 23:28 “So you, too, outwardly appear righteous to men, but inwardly you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.

    however, if you read on ..

    Mat 23:29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous,

    there you go .. now THAT does address it ..

    Mat 23:30 and say, ‘If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’

    ok .. so Jesus is not actually saying it is bad, He is saying by them doing so, they are hypocrites because they are essentially claiming their righteousness when they do so ..

    Mat 23:31 “So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets

    as I said earlier, it is lavish .. Jesus says the lavish is their hypocrisy of their own guilt ..

    Mat 23:32
    “Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers.

    and as we know, these same ones who adorned the righteous, called for Jesus' blood as well and His saints ..
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