On The Verge But Need A Push (seeking Help)

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Angiogenesis, Sep 11, 2013.

  1. Hello all, hope you are having a lovely day. I'm in London at the moment enjoying the rain but if im lucky there may be thunder later on; fingers crossed. This is my first post here, as such I'm unsure of which forum to put this question in, if its in the wrong place let me know where it should go and I'll put it there. I wont rehash my background information, most of that is summarized in my bio. The takeaway point, in case reading chunks of text arent a hobby of yours is: I'm not a Christian yet but I have a desire to be for a plethora of reasons, some of which are in the bio.
    My only condition to calling myself Christian is that I am able to justify my position to myself and others with evidence. This may seem confusing so I'll include a quick analogy. By day [often by night :(], im a doctor and have to prescribe drugs frequently; however I will not, under any circumstance, prescribe a drug unless I have solid reasons to believe it to be effective. If anyone asks me "Dr. Angio, why did you prescribe this drug to patient Khan" you better believe that I'm able to justify my decision to anyone. The day I cant is the day I consider changing professions. Likewise if anyone asks me "Ang, why are you a Christian" I want to have a solid reason.
    The good news is that I think I'm close, Christianity provides meaning to people close to me and even to me at times. It has explanations to some deep rooted humanity based questions and Jesus' life is admirable to me. However what im seeking to solidify my belief is good evidence, for that is the only way I know of to evaluate the truth of a claim.

    Most of you are filled with evidence im sure and I cant wait to hear it, but what I am asking for today are answers to the aforementioned question, namely:

    "Dear reader, why are you a Christian"

    I ask this first, because it is the primarly hurdle for me. I have looked for this answer in oh so many books, but have found reasoning to be faulty. I attribute this partly to the distance between myself and the authors and the lack of interaction but mainly to the lack of verifiable evidence they provide. I should say however that my reading is not as extensive as I would like because reading for my job takes a lot of time. The Christians that I know are largely cultural Christian (i.e. "My parents are Christian, so that why I am".) Which is why I've come to you guys; I LOVE learning and will be a sponge to your knowledge, but please be patient, gentle, patient, kind and above all patient; solidifying ones outlook of the world takes time. Thanks and I look forward to responses.
  2. I, am a Christian, because when I was feeling alone, abandoned, and in need of someone to tell me I would be okay, and they loved me. God came, that is my only explanation for what happened. I spent the next few days in a kind of spiritual euphoria, read the Bible, and prayed. Doctrinal issues that had always made it difficult to believe suddenly resolved themselves for me, and remain resolved. While the euphoria has long since worn off, it's been difficult to better myself, and I've had to struggle with new doctrinal issues; whenever I feel alone and depressed, if I pray, I still get that overwhelming feeling that God loves me, and I can work the rest out later.

    I know I'm not sharing and "evidence" or solid argument for you to convert, but it's not about evidence, it's about choosing to believe, accepting God's love, and working out the details as you go.
  3. I am a Christian because I have felt God in my life, because I know He is real, because I know He sent His Son to die for me.

    My evidence is my experiencing of God, His peace filling my life in circumstances where I would have been filled with fear in earlier times.

    Some may come to believe based on what they read, but many don't.

    Christianity isn't a religion, it's a relationship with the God who created all we see and feel.

    BTW I am engineer by training.
    KingJ and Brewdaddy say Amen and like this.
  4. #4 Brother_Mike_V, Sep 11, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2013
    Well-being a 'Christian' is illogical and foolishness to the world-at least that's what my Bible says. Being a Christian is not practical or convenient; quite the opposite.

    Thing is-I don't get to really choose to be a Christian the way you may logically think. You see-God chose to make mankind in the beginning-we already belong to Him and His will whether we like it or not. The real question is: do you have faith in the True Holy and Awesome Creator. "Christian" is just a label-so is "Jew". A label like "Baptist" just identifies me as someone who believes the set of doctrines we follow in our Church are true and accurate.

    #1: We are ALL God's creation-like it or not-faith or not-you don't get to choose that.
    #2: God gave us free will-we get to decide if we accept God's gifts
    #3: When we accept that God offered Himself-His Son Jesus Christ as a Holy Sacrifice so we unholy humans can go to heaven-we become His children. When we accept we are sinners deserving an eternity (in Hell) separated from God and in need of a savior-we are 'saved' from hell when we call upon Jesus Christ to be THE Savior.
    #4: When we accept the responsibility of living in His Truth as His Children-we must learn what is to be Holy by beginning to obey Him.
    Step #1 in obedience after salvation is full immersion baptism as outlined by Jesus Christ in the Holy Bible.

    I asked Jesus Christ to be my savior in April 2005 when presented with the facts that the 'theory of evolution' is a fraud through a creation science ministry. (www.icr.org) I am thankful to God that he opened my eyes to the real Truth after years of bombardment in public school and secular college. The Bible says all we need to do is ask Him and believe in our hearts-when we do this we desire to learn of Him and follow Him-the God of the universe-the God of our Creation-the God of our body and soul. The God of Love, Light, Life, Truth, Honor, Holiness, Mercy, Righteousness-everything that this world lacks.

    Our God WANTS to give you heaven; will you let Him love you today? Will you accept what Jesus Christ did for you on the cross at Calvary? He paid your sin debt that separates you from our Holy God with His blood. Will you accept that payment-the gift-the sacrifice of God? He did not have to die for us-He chose to. Will you choose Him?

    "Christian" is a label-but is a label that tells the world you are in love with the God of the Universe.

    ...God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them... And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

    Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God....Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

    For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

    For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

    This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

    Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

    I am the way, the truth and the life.


    Jesus the Christ-Son of the Living God

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all.
    For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God.
    For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
    But God commandeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
    For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

    With Love,

    Paul-Apostle to the Gentiles
    Mercedes Benz E Class, KingJ and Brewdaddy says Amen and like this.
  5. My good friend and Dr. May I say to you that I am a Christian for one and only one reason. It is the very same reason that you my friend can be a Christian.

    I believe that Jesus is the Christ, that He was born of the virgin Mary, lived a life of no sin, went to the cross where He died for MY sin and 3 days later He rose from the dead to seal the experience.

    You can forget the reading to expand your knowledge.
    You can forget trying to explain it.
    Jesus was not a role model.
    Jesus was not someone to admire.

    Jesus is the Christ the Son of the living God who died to pay YOUR penalty for sin.

    You just like me are a sinner. (Rom. 3:23)

    The penalty for sin is death. (Rom. 6:23)

    But the gift of God is eternal life in heaven with Him and He fied for you while you were still in your sin. (Rom. 5:8)

    (Rom. 10:9)

    Why not do that right now as you read these words...........bow your head and say to God..........

    "Lord, I am a sinner. I know and believe that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God. I now believe and accept Him as my Lord and Savior and ask Him to come and live in my heart and cleanse me of all sin. I believe he rose from dead on 3rd day and lives in heaven now to keep me saved".

    If you say that prayer to God, and mean it, you will be saved and be one of God's children.

    Now, go to a Christian, Bible believing church and tell the pastor there what has happened and ask him to batize you.

    God bless you my friend! You wanted a PUSH. Well there it is. Now what are you going to do with it????? Go with the push........or go against the push.

    To do nothing my friend is a NO answer! To be saved you must do something. Make a choice for Christ!
    KingJ likes this.
  6. #6 KingJ, Sep 16, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2013
    Rational thought should lead you down this route....
    1. There is a God, just look at your thumb.
    2. He made you the most intelligent being on earth and capable of 'wondering / searching' Him...surely He would want to reach out to you.
    3. Jesus's impact on the world. http://www.thesacredpage.com/2008/04/napoleons-proof-for-divinity-of-jesus.html

    But the reality is, nobody here or in heaven and hell....really cares whether or not you believe in the 'existence' of God or Jesus.... as the devil is a firm believer James 2:19. The issue is.... do you accept or reject the teaching of Jesus and the Bible? Do you want to repent and walk in the light?

    Scripture is clear that we have a spirit and that God is seeking those who would worship Him in spirit and truth John 4:24. There is a spiritual revelation that we get of Jesus when our hearts are ripe. Without this nobody can ''truly'' call / know Jesus as God / Lord 1 Cor 12:3, Matt 16:16-24. If you want a spiritual revelation of Jesus you need to come to God on His terms...Psalms 51:17, Luke 9:23, James 4:8.
    Major likes this.
  7. When God created Man,

    There was perfect peace between them - He even took a daily walk with them.

    Man messed up

    Jesus was sent to restore relationship

    They had a choice if they wanted that relationship with God.

    I am a Christian because I choose that relationship and what it takes.

    Major likes this.
  8. Hey Ang,

    Welcome to the forum, looks like you have received a plethora of answers, and you have also received the Gospel message on how to become a "Christian."

    Here is my response to your question,

    I'm a Christian, per se, because other people call me that, here is something for you to read to help you understand,

    Then departed Barnabas to Tarsus, for to seek Saul: And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch. Act 11:25, 26

    You see, the disciples didn't call themselves Christians, they didn't take the name on themselves, it was the people in the town of Antioch that gave them that appellation, to better understand the word Christian we need to know it's meaning in the Greek language of that time, Christ was their word for the Messiah (the Savior of the world) and the suffix ian meant like, so what the people were saying about the disciples was they were like Christ, Christ-like, Christian, ...their lives exemplified Christ like character.

    So, to answer your question, most of us here are viewed to be Christian (or not) by the people around us, in our families, our neighbors, colleagues at work, ect., I think you see the point,

    ...so, since you stated you wanted solid, factual evidence, evidence you can hold in your hand, so to speak, then just look at the people that have responded to your question, we were all miserable, wretched, defiled sinners, so horrible and debauched that if you knew us before our conversion (born again) you wouldn't want anything to do with us, ...here's your rock solid evidence, after our new birth we were changed, the Holy Spirit came inside of us and empowered us to live this new life, ...so come on in, the water is fine and join us and you too will start to be Christ like, have a new life (born again), that is, have the character He does, the love He has for people, the self sacrificing service to others He has, you will become like your Teacher, ...and then you will have the evidence you are looking for, your transformed life will be your proof, ...one more thing, after you join us, you won't be worried about answering the question, but rather, people will ask you how do I become like you, ...ahhhh we have come full circle, you will be able to answer their question, like we can answer the question you have asked.


    Major and KingJ say Amen and like this.
  9. I am a Christian because it is the logical. I believe in an all-loving, all-free creator who made us in His image.

    I side with St. Thomas Aquinas's Quinque viae arguments in the existence of God.

    This is them in short:

    The first one is the Argument of the Unmoved Mover. This expresses that God must be the cause of motion in the universe and is a cosmological argument:
    1. Some things are in motion.
    2. A thing cannot, in the same respect and in the same way, move itself: it requires a mover.
    3. An infinite regress of movers is impossible.
    4. Therefore, there is an unmoved mover from whom all motion proceeds.
    5. This mover is what we call God.
    The second one is the Argument of the First Cause, which provides evidence that God must have been the cause, or the creator of the universe -- this one is also cosmological:
    1. Somethings are caused.
    2. Everything that is caused is caused by something else.
    3. An infinite regress of causation is impossible.
    4. Therefore, there must be an uncaused cause of all that is caused.
    5. This cause is what we call God.
    The third one is the Argument from Contingency, which is, again, cosmological:
    1. Many things in the universe may either exist or not exist and are all finite. Such things are called contingent beings.
    2. It is impossible for everything in the universe to be contingent, for then there would be a time when nothing existed, and so nothing would exist now, since there would be nothing to bring anything into existence, which is clearly false.
    3. Therefore, there must be a necessary being whose existence is not contingent on any other being or beings.
    4. That being is whom we call God.
    The fourth one is the Argument from Degree, which is a theological adaptation from Aristotle's teachings of Logos:
    1. Varying perfections of varying degrees may be found throughout the universe.
    2. These degrees assume the existence of an ultimate standard of perfection.
    3. Therefore, perfection must have a pinnacle.
    4. This pinnacle is whom we call God.
    And lastly, the fifth one is the Teleological Argument, which claims that many things in the Universe possess final causes that must be directed by God:
    1. All natural bodies in the world act towards ends.
    2. These objects are in themselves unintelligent.
    3. Acting towards an end is a characteristic of intelligence
    4. Therefore, there exists an intelligent being that guides all natural bodies towards their ends.
    5. This being is whom we call God.
    In the case for Christ, to begin, even some of the most prominent Atheistic historians and scientists overwhelmingly conclude the existence of Jesus. However, the case for the divinity and resurrection also must be evaluated. However, much of the New Testament writings have themselves been recognized as legitimate early writings--though many think there is an explanation for the postmortem appearances of Jesus was that the apostles were merely just hallucinating. Some think that the apostles' continuing faith in Jesus was just a reaction of the impact Jesus had on their lives. However, these positions are expressed without justifying the existence of God. In other words, the non-theist is restricted in following scientific evidence to the truth if it gives validity to God. While the theist can accept the evidence regardless as they align with the existence of God.

    It would take a whole lot more for me to go into this, so I did my best to keep this short yet with some detail. If you were to ask me if I know every single point fluently, then you'd be barking up the wrong tree--I am still, and probably will always be, learning as much as I can.

    But the logic behind my religion is the foundation for my faith, while my love for Him is what fuels it.
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  10. That was an interesting read, thanks Lysander.
  11. Thank YOU, KingJ. God bless you :)
  12. #12 aha, Sep 26, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2013
    I copy paste here a line of your reply to Jake in another thread…
    You are a doctor, so pardon me if I like to use some medicine words : )

    It will be killed… eventually.
    It may leave a scar for museum of history or at least leave few believer for sentimental/patriotism sake but most likely not a threat to recur.

    Why the old religion stays for long?
    I think because religion have this defense of faith.

    Faith what makes religion difficult to attack.
    Thus, it will attack other defenses: belief in the superstition.

    The weapon: Internet, wikipedia……. Science.

    Invention of the printing press revolutionized the world: it make access to education easier, book printing becomes cheaper….
    It results to changes in government, changes in culture, reformation in the Catholic church, etc…..

    What more when information is just one click away.
    Internet is relatively new…… thus, we are still in the beginning stage.
    Natural Science already killed or nearly killed belief in superstition….. next it is trying is the belief in the Supernatural.

    Science earned much respect for us human beings
    I think because the Scientific Method can predict future outcomes…. Ie. kinda prophecy…
    Prediction of future outcome: why it important? It is one of our measurement if something being told to us are true….

    Prophecy: this is one of the things that makes the bible different from other holy books.

    There are books in the bible that prophecise the future, and things I posted above is my limited knowledge of bible prophecies…..
  13. #13 Angiogenesis, Sep 27, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2013
    Hello all....again. A very quick update .

    Thank you to everyone who took the time to respond. To Brewdaddy, Hismany songs, brother Mike, Major, KingJ, Jake, Just passing thru, Lysander and aha, I thank you in particular and will be responding to each of you in kind after I have researched some more and changed specific aspects of my life.
    Im in Liverpool, England, currently. I recommend it to guys coming to England, it's a lovely city. Whilst here I have been attending a Catholic church around 3 days a week, one of my patients invited me, its a nice change from work and I get to immerse myself in the culture of this Church some more; I have to admit, its really refreshing to have a group of kind people to chat with when I'm away from my family and friends in London. Health care professionals here are cool but its hard to talk freely in a hospital, at least thats my experience.
    Im aware that some of you may not care (which is fair enough, no hard feelings :)), but considering that you took time to respond to me I thought it would be decent to let you know what im getting up to in response to your advice. Tc, expect replies soon.
  14. Just a few notes on Christ's character:

    He was anti-cultural
    He was anti-tradition
    He was anti-religion
    He was anti-favoritism

    'Repent' means to change or turn around; Christ does not expect instant perfection from us; however, He asks us to pursue enduring faith through persistent spiritual growth. The Bible says 'today is the the day of salvation'; 'call on the Lord and be saved'. Let the Holy Spirit guide you through a righteous repentance rather than trying to force the change in your will. Our flesh always fails (all of our bodies die doctor, correct?); Jesus Christ is the 'Great Physician' for our spiritual lives in the here and now and here after.

    Tithes, good deeds, works, church attendance, traditions, 'following the law', charity, generosity, etc...don't 'save' our spirits from eternal separation from God-But Jesus Christ does. All are created equal in the eyes of the Creator. All have the same opportunity to invite the Holy Spirit to dwell within them. How does that work for ALL people-I don't know. Invite the Holy Spirit in by accepting God's Gift-His Son's sacrifice. Meditate on the Word which is Jesus Christ-which is our Creator, seek His face, open your heart....

    He is there waiting for you. You CAN have a relationship directly with Him; we get to choose how close we get...
  15. I am intrigued by this. I'd love to hear your reasoning behind this statement.
    I do agree that He was anti-tradition of men and anti-religion when it came to empty religion (like addressed in Isaiah 29:13 and in James 1:26), but he seemed very pro-religion in the following verse (James 1:27), and then also in Matthew 5:17 when he said he didn't come to abolish the law, but to fulfill it.

    Jesus was a religious Jew, attended synagog, and wasn't apposed to a formal structure of worship. I think it's that he anti-hypocrisy and wanted people to follow the spirit of the law rather than just the law itself.

    But I'd love to hear a brief explanation on this. Maybe I'm misreading it or maybe you have a valid response. The case for Christianity and religion has always been something that fascinated me.
  16. #16 Brother_Mike_V, Sep 28, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2013
    I probably should have put "man-made" before 'religion'. Sorry for the confusion. This topic has come up before several times and it usually leads to the difference between man's idea for religion and 'True religion'. Which also tends to end up involving whether or not we are 'free from the law'. The answer that is -only when we are truly walking in the Spirit 100%. Which, since we are still in our fleshy earth tombs, would be never. But I think some may get to the 99% mark if they really are seeking His face. I would put the Apostle Paul near that benchmark.

    The answer is between Genesis 1:1 and Revelation 22:21.

    Also, although Jesus was physically born into the 'Jewish' culture and tradition-He came to fulfill not only the promises to the 'Jews' but also for the Gentiles (All the world); thus eliminating the elitist mentality of bloodlines/ birthrights/ nobility. Adam and Eve didn't start as "Jews" which is a man-made religious title that (eh hem) evolved with God's people much like the title "Christian". Remember the impartiality of God. We must be 'reborn of Spirit' no matter what culture we come from.

    Now that does not mean I am 'anti-tradition and culture' in general-as long as said traditions and cultures are either directly prescribed by God / Christ; like the observance of Passover. Or a representation of God's kingdom on earth; like a marriage celebration of two people who are following after God and pure in their hearts prepared for each-other.
  17. Hello Angiogenesis. I am writing this from sunny Spain. Sorry about your rain !. We could do with some over here.
    Anyway, I am writing to encourage you in your walk with the Lord. I am Spanish but have lived and worked in the UK for some 30 years. During this time I heard the Gospel several times as my sister is a christian and when we visited her
    in Bournemouth we ended up going to church. But one day my wife was converted and her life was transformed. I was not a bit interested in religion but due to her insisting that I should hear the new preacher in Bristol(where we lived) I went to church that Sunday. The sermon went through me like fire. Months later we were baptised together. 2 years later
    we were at bible college in London preparing to come back to Spain to preach the wonderful Gospel of Jesus. I have been a pastor here for 10 years. I am now retired.
    My experience as a christian has been the most fantastic time in my life. I encourage you my brother not to doubt, never doubt. Doubts come from the enemy. See James 1v6.
    What else can I say?. I gave up my job in the UK to serve the Lord and would do it over and over again!!. Just let the Lord touch you. May He bless you always. With christian love. Julio
    Mercedes Benz E Class likes this.

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