Mind Control

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by Noblemen, Mar 24, 2016.

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  1. The law could not destroy the sin nature all it could do was temporarily control or suppress the sin nature in them.
    It is quite obvious that the old sin-nature had to be controlled and that was why God gave the Mosaic law.
    This is the meaning of: "So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin," Romans 7:25.
    The law was given so that the soul mind could use the law to suppress or control the sin nature in them.
    The born-again believer thinks they do not attempt to control the new Christ in you nature but most unknowingly do.
    If the born-again believer attempts to live life by using the law or good morals etc. then this is nothing more than a method of the mind using morals to control The Christ in you nature, within. Christ will be automatically manifested when the believer who has the mind of Christ lives by the nature in them, Christ in you fulfills all morals.
    Marilyn C, crownoflife and Nanon says Amen and like this.
  2. Sweet :)

    God once said the most amazing thing to my heart:

    "Greg you have been trying for 15 years to live for me, but I have been waiting 15 years to live through you."

    That changed everything, espeically the way I think (my mind). Obviously I could type a huge doctrinal dissertation over this but I would prefer to have conversation instead. The summary verse (for me) would be

    Galations 2:20 (ESV) - I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me, and gave Himself for me.
    Single Serving, From Pieces To Peace, Cturtle and 9 others say Amen and like this.
  3. Thank you dear friend, Galatians 2:20 is keystone to the Christian life. christians have no life of their own, the only life we have is Christ.
    Read Galatians 1:11–12, 15–16, and allow the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ in you as he did in Paul.
    It's the answer to unlock the understanding of scriptures, and how he used the apostle Paul to bring in the dispensation of Grace, Christ in you the hope of glory.
    Elizabeth O and Complete say Amen and like this.
  4. Amen brother.

    Col. 1:27........
    "To whom God was pleased to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory."
    Complete and Noblemen say Amen and like this.
  5. Thank you for this, @Noblemen,

    Coming back to this,today, I am thinking about what you have said in more depth.

    I believe this (portion highlighted) is true: we do attempt to control the New Christ Nature, unwittingly. Even though we recognise that the attempt to live by either the law or by the introduction of good morals is of no value where the new nature is concerned, for it is spirit, and not flesh, and is not influenced by the flesh or anything that the flesh can do: being of God it cannot be influenced. Yet living within it, without giving place to our own understanding is not easy. Learning to rest, in thankgiving, love and praise, in Christ Jesus, regardless of circumstance, and living by faith and not by sight in both thought and deed, is accepted in concept by many believers, but not always in practice.

    Again, I have to thank you for making me consider and take stock concerning my own walk, in the spirit.

    In Christ Jesus
    Marilyn C, crownoflife and Noblemen says Amen and like this.
  6. All:

    Proverbs 23:7-8 (KJV)
    For as he thinketh in his heart, so [is] he: Eat and drink, saith he to thee; but his heart [is] not with thee. The morsel [which] thou hast eaten shalt thou vomit up, and lose thy sweet words. ​

    James 3:2 (KJV)
    For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same [is] a perfect man, [and] able also to bridle the whole body. ​

    Proverbs 18:21 (KJV)
    Death and life [are] in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof. ​

    Proverbs says whatever you think, that's what you are. You confess what you believe, so if you think you're loser, you'll be a loser. Confession of what we believe is part of our salvation, Romans 10:8-10. James says if one is able to control their words, they're able to control their whole body. Proverbs also reinforces this by saying that life and death are in the power of the tongue, and whoever loves (good or evil) will reap from it.

    Science is proving the word of God (no surprise) that when a study was done on people who came into emergency rooms with chest pains, those that told the doctors they were having a heart attack, had a heart attack, and those that just said they had chest pains and denied having a heart attack, did not have heart attacks! "... and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." True confession comes from what one believes. If you can't believe that God will heal you and you walk around saying all the time "I have this or that disease" then you'll have dis-ease! Actionable faith is done with words in confession.

    This is why God warns to think on the pure, wholesome, righteous, good, etc. Phil 4:8 and to take captive every THOUGHT, 2 Cor 10:5.
    Cturtle, PrayerWarrior, crownoflife and 1 other person say Amen and like this.
  7. Hello @Abdicate,

    I can't agree with the way that you are interpreting and applying the verses above, Romans 10:8-10, or the words of James, Philippians 4:8, or 2 Corinthians 10:5.

    In Christ Jesus
    Major likes this.
  8. That's a shame. :(
    Cturtle and crownoflife say Amen and like this.
  9. Cturtle likes this.
  10. Yes "Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaketh."

    You are what you eat, in the natural if you eat fat fluffy food, chances are you are going to be fat and fluffy.

    "As a man thinketh, so is he"

    "Both life and death are in the power of the tongue"
    Cturtle likes this.
  11. Hello @Abdicate,

    It is not the word of God that I disbelieve, but the use you have made of it, in your previous post. I have no need to apply to science or to the words of man's understanding, in order to properly interpret and apply what is written by inspiration of God.

    Our understanding has to be measured by what God has written, for there is no other means available to us, to determine was is true and what is false.

    In Christ Jesus
    Major likes this.
  12. Hello @Noblemen,
    The words you have quoted from Proverbs 23, and 18, have a context, and neither qualifies what either Abdicate or yourself are saying. However, I agree, that 'out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh', but look at it's context:-

    'O generation of vipers,
    how can ye, being evil, speak good things?
    for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.
    A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things:
    and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.
    But I say unto you,
    That every idle word that men shall speak,
    they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.
    For by thy words thou shalt be justified,
    and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.'

    (Mat 12:34-37)

    * Cautionary words indeed! Don't you think?

    In Christ Jesus
    Major likes this.
  13. Go Chris go
  14. So which part isn't the word of God?

    Proverbs 18:19 (KJV)
    A brother offended [is harder to be won] than a strong city: and [their] contentions [are] like the bars of a castle. ​

    Proverbs 18:20 (KJV)
    A man's belly shall be satisfied with the fruit of his mouth; [and] with the increase of his lips shall he be filled. ​

    Proverbs 18:21 (KJV)
    Death and life [are] in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.​

    Proverbs 18:22 (KJV)
    [Whoso] findeth a wife findeth a good [thing], and obtaineth favour of the LORD. ​

    So if I've taken verse 21 out of context, tell me why it doesn't mean what it says it means? I threw in verse 19 just in case...
  15. Hello @Abdicate,

    Proverbs 18:19-22 is obviously the Word of God. Regarding verse 21, and your use of it,
    'Death and life are in the power of the tongue:
    and they that love it
    (ie., the power of the tongue)
    shall eat the fruit thereof.'
    (Pro 18:21)

    In reply #6, you expressed the believe that this verse can be interpreted to mean that the mind has the power to affect our circumstances, (quote) 'If you think you are a loser - you will be a loser'. You also said that, if a person experiencing chest pains believe they are having a heart attack, they are more likely to experience one; but, If a person experiencing chest pains believe they are not having a heart attack, then they are not so likely to have one.

    1) Regarding the person experiencing chest pains, I can believe that it is likely that the very fear of those pains being a heart attack could bring on a heart attack, if, it was indeed the heart which was causing the pains being experienced, because fear would exacerbate the problem. Yet, in that case, it would not be the thoughts of the person experiencing those pains which caused the attack, but the affects of the fear engendered by them.

    2) As to being a loser, simply because you think you are one. Well, that may be so, simply because life experiences have conditioned the person to think that way: because failure has been the outcome so far in life, the tendency is to think that failure will continue to be the outcome.

    But neither of those thoughts of yours, @Abdicate, is a valid application of Proverbs 18:21.
    'Death and life are in the power of the tongue:' - can be illustrated by the example of the 10 spies who returned with a report from Canaan, born of fear and not of faith in what God had told them: which engendered disbelief within many of the Children of Israel, and resulted in their deaths in the wilderness; when they could have gone into the land and been victorious as God had said, if they had believed the report of Caleb and Joshua.

    Those who believed the words spoken by the 10 spies, were as those spoken of in Proverbs 18:21b,:-

    'and they that love it' (ie., the power of the tongue) ' shall eat the fruit thereof.' - they 'ate the fruit' of what they believed, which was death in the wilderness, because of their unbelief.(Numbers 13,14)

    * What they believed, resulted in judgment and death.

    In Christ Jesus
  16. Funny. You use what I said to apply to others, but not oneself. I wonder why. You use "they" when the word of God is referring to the speaker, not the hearer. If you read what I wrote closely, I first said Proverbs says whatever you think, that's what you are. You confess what you believe. But you didn't see that, you only saw "think". Your thoughts are what you confess, speak, utter, and because you speak them, then you believe them, Rom 10:17.

    Proverbs 18:21 (KJV)
    Death and life [are] in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.​

    Fact: Death and life are in the power of the tongue.
    Thought: Yes, as a ruler or king, their word was law and they can kill you or forgive you - life and death.
    Context: Also when I speak, my tongue is choosing life or death

    Fact: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof
    Thought: they are whoever speaks. If they speak death, they shall (a promise) eat of its fruit. "I am a loser" is spoken, my ears hear it, I believe it (faith comes by hearing, Rom 10:17), and then I shall act like a loser, even if I wasn't one before. If they speak life, they shall (a promise) eat of its fruit. "I have the righteousness of Christ" based on 1 Cor 1:30-31 and because I spoke it, my ears hear it, I believe it (faith comes by hearing, Rom 10:17), and I act like like I'm righteous, (1 Peter 1:16, Lev 11:44-45).
    Context: To be effective, God told Joshua 1:8 to no let the words of the teachings of God depart out of his mouth but to meditate in it day and night. The word meditate is to mutter, speak, groan, growl, roar, the word of God, why? Because you'll then eat the fruits of it, just as Proverbs says.

    So see, your response is the same as my original statement. :D
    Cturtle and crownoflife say Amen and like this.
  17. You're missing a crucial step - thought. What happened in this scenario? Chest pains, what happened? One group THOUGHT they were having a heart attack and confessed it. The other group rejected the THOUGHT "I'm having a heart attack" and denied (spoke) they were having a heart attack. One spoke death, the other spoke life. Remember, I only said "chest pains". The word of God is plain and 100% accurate in its words. Some need backup proof and so I suggested science. Listen, it's a known fact, the placebo effect is real. Analyse this for a second. Someone in authority on the subject (a doctor or scientist) gives someone with some ailment a pill and says "this will fix it" MANY times it'll work. That's the placebo effect. Ask anyone who's been through cancer with intense pain, the therapists teach pain management which doesn't involve drugs (unless you wish to sleep for nine months) but teaches you how to control it through thoughts. Does it work for everyone? Nope, nor can it. It only works for those that confess life and believe the confession.
    crownoflife likes this.
  18. Hi @Abdicate,

    I will indeed consider your responses carefully. However I do not believe you have done so in regard to my own, for you have read into it what is not there.

    I will leave this with you.
    In Christ Jesus
  19. Acknowledged.
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