Making Sense Of It All

Discussion in 'Bible Study' started by SueJLove, Oct 8, 2013.

  1. Tuesday, October 08, 2013, 4:30 a.m. – the Lord Jesus woke me with the song “Who Believes?” playing in my mind. Speak, Lord, your words to my heart. I read Romans 6 (ESV).

    To believe in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior of our lives means to have faith in all of whom he was and is, and in all that he did and said. To believe in the name of Jesus means to believe in his divine character, and his will and purpose for our lives. To have faith that Jesus Christ died on the cross for our sins, so we could go free from slavery to sin, means to walk in that freedom and to no longer (in lifestyle) walk according to the ways of the flesh. Faith in God, though, does not mean perfection; otherwise we would not need all of these wonderful words of encouragement to spur us on to live holy and godly lives in Christ.

    There are many professing Christians who believe God’s grace is a free license to keep on sinning without condemnation. May that never be! I believe one of the big reasons this false teaching has spread throughout evangelical Christianity today is that a misconception of God’s grace is being taught. Many are teaching God’s grace absent of repentance and obedience to Christ. “Faith” then becomes an emotional feeling or decision, or a mere intellectual acknowledgment of what Jesus Christ did for us in dying for our sins on a cross, because Romans 6, in principle, is not being taught in the gospel presentation. People are not being told that coming to Christ means that they must die with Christ to their sins, and that we must be then raised with him to walk in newness of life, not in cleaned-up old lives.

    Wow! I wish that the evangelical church here in America would go back to this central message of the gospel. Not all have abandoned the true faith, but many have, and it is disheartening. When we come to faith in Jesus Christ our old life of living for self and sin is brought to death so that we will no longer be enslaved to sin. Amen! That is GRACE! That is HOPE! Anything short of that is neither grace nor hope, for it still leaves us in our sin. If, by true faith and God’s grace, we have truly died to our old lives of sin, then we have been set free, not from ever sinning again, but from its grip, its hold, and its control over our lives. We are no longer enslaved to sin. Amen! Hallelujah! That is the awesome message of God’s grace! What good is a get-out-of-jail-free card if you are still bound in your sin? Yet, death to sin is not the end of the story. We are made alive to God in Christ to walk in freedom from sin, to have eternal life with God, and to walk in Christ’s righteousness and holiness, all in the power of the working of the Holy Spirit of God within us, and not in our own flesh.

    Coming to Christ, nonetheless, does not mean we have lost the propensity to sin or that we will never be tempted by it again. I wish that were so, but it is not. I so look forward to when that will be the case. Even Jesus Christ, though sinless, was tempted in all ways in which we are tempted. As long as we live on this earth in these flesh bodies we will still battle with sin, but we should no longer allow sin to reign in our mortal bodies again, i.e. sin should no longer have dominion (control) over us to where we feel as though we just can’t help it. This needs to be taught! I used to believe that there was still a question of who would win the battle, thinking Satan still had some control over me or that he was too powerful for me, but when we truly understand all that God’s grace provided for us, and that Jesus Christ already won this battle, then “Wow!” what a difference that makes! Jesus has already given us all we need for life and godliness. We just need to daily tap into his divine grace, strength and power and allow him to work his will and his ways in and through our lives instead of us continuing to yield control of our lives over to the flesh and to Satan.

    I believe this whole matter of law and grace is a confusing subject for those of us who did not grow up under the law in quite the same way as did the Jewish believers in Christ. Yet, the principle of law and grace still applies to all of us, because we were all, at one time, under the law. So, what does it really mean to be no longer under the law but under grace? Well, for one, it means that, in Christ, we are no longer under condemnation, i.e. the ultimate penalty of sin (eternal damnation) is no longer applied to us, because Jesus Christ’s blood sacrifice for our sins paid the price for our sin so we could go free. Amen! It also means that, wherein the law pointed out our sin, which is good, and it led us to Christ, it is powerless to save us from our sins. In other words, even if we could keep the whole letter of the law, which none of us could, it cannot save us. It only serves to condemn us.

    Yet, that is not the end of it. In Romans 3:31 we read: “Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law.” As followers of Jesus Christ, we are not underneath all the old ceremonial Jewish laws. I don’t believe that is the law being spoken of here. I believe the law we are to uphold has more to do with the Ten Commandments, i.e. faith in Jesus Christ does not free us to do whatever we please. Yet, what Jesus Christ did was take the Ten Commandments and he summarized them into two laws: 1) You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. 2) And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. These laws we are to uphold (sustain; advocate; encourage). Yet, we don’t have to follow them with absolute perfection or we are “out.”

    Yet, does this mean we no longer obey the law? Scripture teaches that obedience to Christ and to his commands is an essential element to true abiding faith. In fact, it teaches here that obedience to Christ leads to righteousness, and that faith in Jesus Christ means we are no longer slaves to sin, but we have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which we are committed. Yet, this matter of obedience is confusing to some believers, for it is reminiscent to them of a life bound by following the letter of the law and of legalism, and so they reject it. Yet, scripture clearly teaches that obedience is required. So, how do we reconcile this? I believe it goes back to understanding God’s grace.

    God’s grace not only brought us into relationship with God via Jesus’ shed blood on the cross for our sins and via his resurrection back to life, but it provided the way for us to be free from slavery to sin – from walking in the flesh – and free to walk in Christ’s righteousness and holiness – to walking in the Spirit. This is obedience, i.e. God does not just zap us and “poof” we are now living and walking in his righteousness and we no longer have any choice in the matter. We are not puppets on a string and no longer have minds and wills that can still choose sin. Jesus said if any of us would come after him, we must deny (disallow) our self-life, die daily to sin and self, and follow (obey) him. Each day that we choose to allow Jesus Christ to live his life out through us, instead of stepping back into walking in the ways and patterns of our old flesh life, we are walking in obedience. Yet, it is his Spirit’s work within us that gives us the power, strength and ability to obey.

    Different translations word verse 20 in different ways, but I believe most all have the same or similar meaning. I believe this is a very important verse to understand. When we allow ourselves to come back underneath the control of sin to where we obey its evil desires, we are thus free from the control of righteousness. In other words, we can’t live in both worlds at the same time. We can’t live for the flesh, the world, and our evil desires, and live and walk in Christ’s righteousness simultaneously. I am not saying that walking in the Spirit means absolute sinless perfection. It does not. Yet, it should mean that we are sensitive to the Holy Spirit’s voice, and that we should respond immediately to the Spirit’s voice when he convicts us of sin in our hearts, and that we should confess our sin, and turn from it, and we should continue walking in faith and in the Spirit of God.

    Yet, I do know, from personal experience, that it is possible for a believer in Jesus, at some point in his or her life, to get caught up in the ways of the world and the flesh and to follow after those things once again that Christ Jesus died from which to set us free. And, I can tell you that there is no fruit gained from the things I am now ashamed of, though now set free, but only the regret that I wasted that time I could have been living for the Lord, and did not. Yet, Jesus’ grace lifted me out of that pit, and he put me on the right path again. Praise Jesus! I love his amazing grace!

    What this passage of scripture is saying to us, I believe, is to think about where we were before Jesus saved us, to consider carefully what his grace truly means in our lives and in our walk of faith, and to take into account the price Jesus paid for us so we would be free from slavery to sin. I don’t want to ever go back! I pray I never will again. There is never any benefit to sin. Yet, to walk in freedom in Christ and in his Spirit is awesome! It is the best life ever! How can we who died to sin still live in it? It makes no sense at all!

    Who Believes? / An Original Work / October 3, 2013

    Based off Isaiah 53

    Gospel message, who believes?
    Jesus Christ died on a tree,
    Saving us from all our sin,
    So we might be cleansed within.

    Had no beauty found in Him,
    That we should desire Him.
    Man of sorrows, suffering;
    Crushed for our iniquities.

    Surely He has borne our griefs;
    From our sadness, brings relief.
    Bore the stripes; forsaken, He,
    So forgiven we might be.

    We, like sheep, have gone astray,
    Each of us turned his own way.
    Jesus calls, “Repent today;
    My commandments, now obey.”

    Jesus said, to come to him,
    We must die to all our sin.
    Crucified with Him, we live,
    Walking in His righteousness.

    Suff’ring servants, we will be,
    Taking His identity on us,
    When confessing Him
    As our Savior, Lord and King.
    Major likes this.
  2. #2 texascowgirl, Oct 10, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
    we still sin daily. We were only forgiven but thanks to Jesus the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God Rom 8:21 . When Jesus died he reconciled us all back to God and because of that we will all be saved. There is an age or time period for sin and when its over we are going to be saved. Remember Jesus is savior of the world not only some of it.

    Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God BY THE DEATH OF HIS SON, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

    All mankind is saved regardless of what the false hellfire teachers are teaching. They were warned in the bible to not turn the kingdom of heaven against men. But they don't listen. Hellfire teachings are turning men against the kingdom of heaven but they don't care, they love it. Why? because they are enmity against God and remember God put lying spirits in the mouths of prophets and they have gone out into the world.

    They should teach what the bible says, the many who were made sinners will be made righteous. Jesus is not going to set the men he made righteous on fire in a hellfire. How many is the many that were made sinners? All mankind is the answer.
  3. Texascowgirl.............I am sure that you are aware of your "agenda". We all have them and yours is now very obvious.
    You are trying to teach "Universalism".

    You just stated in comment # 2..............
    " When Jesus died he reconciled us all back to God and because of that we will all be saved. There is an age or time period for sin and when its over we are going to be saved. Remember Jesus is savior of the world not only some of it".

    Now, before we go to far and you begin to get excited and call me names, allow me to make it crystal clear that there are no Scriptures that teach or even imply that ALL people will be saved. There are some Scriptures that can be twisted and turned to imply such a thing but that is because the one who wants everyone to believe it, makes it say that. That my dear is the failure to be learned in the Scriptures and to know what they are saying and to whom they are pointed.

    Now as for the teaching on "hell fire" that you are you suggest that Luke 16 be removed from the Scriptures? Do we remove Revelation 19:20 and 20:13-14. What about Deut. 32:22 and Psalms 9:17? Do we just throw those verses into the trash because some people refuse to accept them????

    Universalism is a false teaching and is totally un-Biblical!
  4. What im showing is the word of God written in the bible. Now I don't care if you call it universalism or anyhting else because what it is, is the word of God, not my word but his. I did not write any of those verses in the bible. and Yes there is scripture that teaches all will be saved in fact there is a 100 or so of them but they are denied by Christians who were taught by lying deceiving preachers. I don't suggest to throw any scriputres out of the bible but I do suggest you get the correct context of the scriputres that you are deceived by.
  5. NOPE! You are trying to export one of the doctrines of devils.

    You have not posted any Scripture for a basis of truth because there are none to post.

    In fact, for anyone to believe that everyone will be saved in the end, is to make God a liar and the work of Jesus invalid.
    JustPassingThru, LysanderShapiro and Mr. Darby says Amen and like this.
  6. I'd love to hear which verses teach this. Perhaps it could be further discussed.
  7. Sorry brother........but there are NO verses for her to post because there are none in the Scriptures.

    ps...............I am glad you put the very lovely lady back in your avatar. Now if there was something you could do with the other side of that picture we would be cooking with gas! (lol).
  8. Thanks Mr. D and ya brothers!
  9. You know that and I know that. But I'd like to hear her defense for it. I don't anticipate agreeing, but is like to hear it.

    And yes...I always ruin our pictures :p or perhaps she enhances my pictures
  10. Since her information is gone from the members list...........I would say that we will not see anything from her for a defense.
  11. #11 JustPassingThru, Oct 14, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2013
    So, if this responder is gone we need to clear up the false teaching she posted, bragging that she didn't care if she was banned, her posts would remain for all to see.

    1. The poster did not believe in a literal Hell even though Jesus taught more about Hell than He did about Heaven and gave us an inside picture in Luke 16 as to what it is like.

    2. She said she was speaking in the name of the Lord.

    3. She was guilty of preaching another Gospel, different than the Gospel we believe in 1 Cor 15 :3, 4.

    4. Then according to Gal 1:7-9 she is accursed!

    Jesus said we would know false teachers by their fruits Mat 7:16-20, everything this poster posted is from a false teacher, ...the flock beware.

    Elders are charged to protect the Lord's flock.



  12. Gene, the person you are speaking of is not the OP but a responder.​
  13. I'm deeply sorry sue, I apologize, too many threads to keep track of, I've gone back and made the correction, ...I thinks it's time for me to go watch the sun set over the coconut palms.


  14. Thank you. :)

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