And a lion has the free will not to eat meat.
Irresistible Grace & People "falling Away" From Christianity. How Does This Happen?
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And a lion has the free will not to eat meat.
Are you comparing a human made in the image of God to a animal?
To translate in other words, this would mean that salvation is not in the hands of God, but in the hands of man.. Which is what we are saying is not true..
Where does the bible teach "irresistible" grace? It does not...and grace is given to the humble not to the proud ...a person in "gay pride" cannot receive the grace of God.I met a "woman" who identifies as such when he is actually a pre-op transsexual. We began talking because he saw the tiny dove pendant I had on my necklace and presumed I was Christian.
Long story short, he said he identified himself now as an atheist. But had formerly been Christian but had fallen away from the faith.
This got me curious and so here I am.
When there is such a thing as irresistible grace how does someone fall away? Is it that they were not in grace in the first place? But simply held faith in the institution of Christianity?
And on that note, when irresistible grace is bestowed by God's predestination through the Holy Spirit, what does that mean as to not only the message of the cross, that Jesus sacrifice saved the whole world, especially those that believe, but for those who are not appointed irresistible grace?
Does it mean God predestined some people to die unsaved? How does irresistible grace apply when Jesus saved the whole world?
Thank you for your sincere replies and patience with my questions. Had I not met this young man today I don't think I would have arrived at them.God Bless.
Lets me say it another way. God wants to start a baseball team, so he says to everyone, "who wants to be on my team? Raise your hand if you want to join my team" Every who wants to be on his team raises their hands. Then God says, "OK, everybody with your hands raised, you are on my team"
Notice, nobody can be on God's team until God first decides to start a team. Then nobody can be on his team until he chooses them.
So, Everything starts and ends with God. If you never raise your hand, you can not join his team.
Bad typology...Salvation is like a army that is surrounded and doomed to destruction, they surrender their own will to that which is greater... They don't go home bragging about free-will they go home declaring the mercy of those who allowed them to live.Lets me say it another way. God wants to start a baseball team, so he says to everyone, "who wants to be on my team? Raise your hand if you want to join my team" Every who wants to be on his team raises their hands. The God says, "OK, everybody with your hands raised, you are on my team"
Notice, nobody can be on God's team until God first decides to start a team. Then nobody can be on his team until he chooses them.
So, Everything starts and ends with God. If you never raise your hand, you can not join his team.
Wouldn,t you first have to exercise your free will to join the army so you can be surrounded so you can receive mercy?
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you ever heard of the draft? and don't miss the point and truth that salvation is by Gods will, and man surrenders to that will. The term free-will is silly in context of the gospel.
How does one surrender to the will of God without making a choice?
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"choice'' in itself does not mean a person has free-will....do you want to die by hanging or gun shot? Your still dead and have no "free-will" a child may have more than one toy to choose, but they are still under the will of their parents...This free-will stuff is just unbiblical!
Surrender or die...is a choice but NOT free-will!
"choice'' in itself does not mean a person has free-will....do you want to die by hanging or gun shot? Your still dead and have no "free-will" a child may have more than one toy to choose, but they are still under the will of their parents...This free-will stuff is just unbiblical!
OK, so we don't have free will. Our will was the results of someone paying the price so we can choose. Dose that sound better?
Yes I don't mean to be contentious but you know as well as I that we are surrendering our will to His more and more as we grow in Christ and when we get into our "own" thinking and desires we are always in error. I don't like the term because it is not biblical and it does not help believers understand what God desires of us.
Why not? Doesn't the bible compare us to sheep?
Are you saying animals are like robots and don't have a choice?
Don't forget a stubborn mule also...Why not? Doesn't the bible compare us to sheep?
Are you saying animals are like robots and don't have a choice?
And a cow can eat this grass or that grass? What does that mean? A choice does not mean anything as it relates to the condition of man?
Animals operate on instinct, not logic, and they are irrational, unreasonable, and without reason, unlike man who was created in the image of God. However, man without the Spirit of God is not unlike the animal kingdom where he is led by his flesh, and his thinking is always on evil.Why not? Doesn't the bible compare us to sheep?
Are you saying animals are like robots and don't have a choice?
2Pe 2:9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment until the day of judgment,
2Pe 2:10 and especially those who indulge in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority. Bold and willful, they do not tremble as they blaspheme the glorious ones,
2Pe 2:11 whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them before the Lord.
2Pe 2:12 But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction,
Exactly. I'm talking about man without the spirit of God.
And your point is?
If you are referring to the fact that man can not make a choice for God without the Spirit of God, that is correct. Unless the Lord first reveals himself to man he would not have a choice. This is why it says...
Tit 2:11, For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
The problem has never been with man not knowing God is real as his grace has appeared to all men, and any man who he who does not believe that, God calls him a liar!!! The problem is in his choice.
1Jn 5:10,, He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
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