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Indwelling Holy Spirit In Old Testament

Discussion in 'Bible Study' started by Ravindran, Jun 9, 2014.

  1. There is absolutely no question that Holy Spirit indwells in New Testament believers.. How about days before Pentecost? Were OT believers indwelt by Holy Spirit? They were all saved by faith.. And they had faith in Lord only because of work of Holy Spirit.. I think we all can agree? If so, did the Holy Spirit continue to indwell in them? I have my personal view (with Scriptural understanding).. I will come to that later.. I think this is a good topic to discuss around Pentecost time :)
     
  2. According to the Creed, the Holy Spirit "spoke to the Prophets".
    How He went about speaking to them is open to interpretation.
     
  3. That part I do agree.. However, I am more specifically asking about Spirit of God coming upon men.. We see Samson.. Then those 2 guys who build tabernacle.. 70 people chosen at the time of Moses.. Spirit of God even coming upon Saul.. But there were all temporary.. We see David praying to God, asking not to take away the Holy Spirit from him..
     
    Abdicate and TezriLi say Amen and like this.
  4. Gotta go, but where does the Scripture say that they were given the Spirit temporarily? I ask because I have never read that and don't know.
     
  5. In the time before Pentecost, Holy Spirit moved on people to effect a purpose of God through them, but He did not dwell in them.

    John 14:15-26 shows us where Jesus is foretelling of the coming Holy Spirit who will indwell His followers:

    Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
    15 “If you love me, obey my commandments. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Advocate, who will never leave you. 17 He is the Holy Spirit, who leads into all truth. The world cannot receive him, because it isn’t looking for him and doesn’t recognize him. But you know him, because he lives with you now and later will be in you. 18 No, I will not abandon you as orphans—I will come to you. 19 Soon the world will no longer see me, but you will see me. Since I live, you also will live. 20 When I am raised to life again, you will know that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21 Those who accept my commandments and obey them are the ones who love me. And because they love me, my Father will love them. And I will love them and reveal myself to each of them.”

    22 Judas (not Judas Iscariot, but the other disciple with that name) said to him, “Lord, why are you going to reveal yourself only to us and not to the world at large?”

    23 Jesus replied, “All who love me will do what I say. My Father will love them, and we will come and make our home with each of them. 24 Anyone who doesn’t love me will not obey me. And remember, my words are not my own. What I am telling you is from the Father who sent me. 25 I am telling you these things now while I am still with you. 26 But when the Father sends the Advocate as my representative—that is, the Holy Spirit—he will teach you everything and will remind you of everything I have told you.
     
  6. When you look at Judges and read verses about Samson, you will see multiple times the Spirit of the Lord came upon him.. If it came multiple times, then the understanding would be that it was taken away after the specific purpose was accomplished..
     
  7. Good point! But why would David pray to the Lord to not take away the Holy Spirit from him? I think there are many verses which clearly indicate Holy Spirit being present among the Israelites. The only question is, was Holy Spirit within them?

    Another question is, today Holy Spirit performs sanctification in the life of a believer.. If this is the work of Holy Spirit, then it was certainly happening in the life of OT believers also.. How else they could have been sanctified?

    For some this might be something that does not matter.. I think it does matter for us! Because if Holy Spirit helped OT saints to perform such mighty acts, the same Holy Spirit has been "poured" out on us.. How much we should be accomplishing! Not in terms of miracles.. In terms of glorifying God..
     
  8. Ravindran, I agree with you; Samson was one the the Spirit of the LORD was upon. The LORD was also upon the first king of Israel Saul who was anointed by Samuel in first Samuel chapter nine. The LORD was with Saul all the while he reignedfor forty two years. If we skip ahead to chapter fifteen God rjected Saul, and left him, because he did not follow his directions. He was to destory the Amalekites because of what they had done to the people of Israel. Instead of killing all the men, women, children, and livestock; Saul took their king Agag captive, and kept all of their best livestock for themselves.
    So yes the spirit of the LORD came upon them but also God withdrew from them when they did the wrong things.
     
  9. At work. Can only remember in KJVese. The gifts and the callings of G-d are without repentance. Where does the Scripture say that He withdrew His H Spirit after a work was accomplished? We modern believers are also given more and varying degrees of His Spirit as we need Him, but G-d does not take away in order to give more.
     
  10. I believe that Holy Spirit accompanied David from without, but was not indwelling. God had His holy place within the Tabernacle and it was not the human heart---yet.

    Old Covenant believers were cleansed and sanctified by their sacrifices---by what they had to do by law---and lasted only as long as they kept from sinning. It's "old vs. new", "demand vs. supply" The law DEMANDED them to act for righteous standing, whereas today we have God's grace that SUPPLIES our continual sanctification. I do not believe Holy Spirit's work was to sanctify them, at least not in the same way He does now.

    So true---and including the miraculous!
     
  11. I sure hope that you are the type of friend who can allow another friend to disagree yet remain friends, Euphemia. There have been many times when I have written nothing when I disagreed -- sometimes out of concern for the other person, sometimes because I felt like it wasn't important enough to write anything, sometimes because I KNOW I am not always right, and other times because I was just too lazy. But I seriously want to take issue with something in this post. Okay? I disagree, but I don't dislike you or anything, as can be thought on such a limited media as this one. :) Taking an early break to say this because I think it's important.

    The sacrifices never cleansed, sanctified, saved anyone. Some people sacrificed because they had faith in the G-d who told them to do it, thus learning about the sacrifice of the coming Messiah. Some people sacrificed because they saw society as commanding it. Some sacrificed because that was what their families had always done, so it was habit. And there were other reasons, including absolutely wrong reasons.

    The Scriptures say that there is only one way of salvation: our Messiah. That's it. It has been that way from the beginning and will remain that way forever. Just as the people in the older Scriptures had a limited idea of our Messiah's sacrifice then, we have a different limitation they did not have, because they saw the beast being sacrificed, often raised the beast being sacrificed, and often participated in the beast's sacrifice, leading it toward the place of sacrifice, laying their hands upon the beast, seeing the blood, often being splattered with the blood. And often, after all that, they ate part of the sacrificed beast. What a lesson that many modern peoples don't understand, can't even imagine.

    Sacrifice is done out of obedience, not for salvation. Only G-d given faith can save.
     
  12. I'm a good friend to have because I choose to love even when there is a disagreement.

    Before the Messiah came, God's way for His precious people to be made right with Him was to present all manner of sacrifices. That perfect, unblemished lamb, whose blood was shed for the person's sin was the exchange of sin for righteousness. The person would walk away cleansed, but that cleansing only lasted until he sinned again and back to the priests he went with his offering. Now, we have the perfect Lamb of God, whose precious, perfect blood was shed for us all....and once for all.

    The OT way was the foreshadowing of the REAL---Jesus Christ, our Messiah.
     
  13. Add me to the list of good friends who will disagree with you!!

    I think the sacrifices did not have any sanctifying power.. I think that is what Paul was stressing a lot.. Also the author of Hebrews.. Before Christ, the only way a person was set right before God was through faith.. And faith alone.. God was not looking at the act of sacrifice.. But at the heart of person producing the sacrifice.. David captured it amazingly..

    "For You do not delight in sacrifice, otherwise I would give it; You are not pleased with burnt offering. The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit; A broken and a contrite heart, O God, You will not despise."

    I am of the conviction that the OT saints were also sanctified by Holy Spirit only.. Sanctification of a person can be brought only by Holy Spirit.. That is why Jesus questioned Nicodemus why he was surprised to hear that a person must be born again by the Spirit.. OT saints were not filled with Holy Spirit always.. They were filled for specific purposes of God.. But in these last days, Holy Spirit has been poured out on us.. We can be filled always..
     
  14. How about Saul? But I see the point you are making..

    Can I ask you a question? Anyway, I am going to ask and not wait for your permission :) Why do you always type G-d instead of God?
     
  15. Maybe we need to do a word study on sanctification, as I know that God called His people holy. He is the one who made them holy and He is the one who set out certain ordinances so that they could achieve that state of holiness before Him. The heart being one of faith is definitely necessary.

    It was the blood that cleansed them, not Holy Spirit, and that cleansing of sin is what was the forerunner of our salvation and our sanctification by the work of the blood of Jesus and Holy Spirit who seals our salvation, and fills us to overflowing with the presence of God.
     
  16. YEA! :D
    Perhaps this may be explained to me by knowing if you are Arminian or Reformed . . . . That way, we woould have a platform from which to have a better understanding of one another. I am Reformed. Well, as far as I understand it, anyway . . . .
     
  17. Think about the movie, Fiddler On the Roof. Think of Chaim Topol as Tevye. Think of him singing "TRADITION!"
    :D
     
    DavidG likes this.
  18. I am a born again Christian who loves the word of God. No other label for me, thanks!
     
  19. I haven't seen the movie :) You might have to use some other analogy..
     
    TezriLi likes this.
  20. Reformed huh.. I see.. I try to avoid denominational labels.. I am a mix of everything.. Believe in pre-destination and election.. Believe gifts are there for today also.. But not in the typical charismatic way.. I attend Assemblies of God Church.. Do not believe in Covenant theology.. More of a leaky dispensationalist..

    In short, a born again Christian :)
     
    TezriLi likes this.

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