Glomung
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Sin that causes spiritual death.
as stated above Mortal Sin is “sin causing spiritual death,” and Venial Sin is “sin that can be forgiven".
If I were to commit suicide, would I go to hell?
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as stated above Mortal Sin is “sin causing spiritual death,” and Venial Sin is “sin that can be forgiven".
Glomung
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It would be more honest for you to say that the meaning well understood by others is refused by you.
My dear mother was extremely bi-polar. She lived with my wife and I her last 10 years and when she was in the "down" cycle, even with meds, she always had the urge to do away with herself. She was as good a Christian as any one on this web site or any others for that matter.
All sin can be forgiven. The only sin causing spiritual death is rejection of Jesus Christ, our salvation.
That would be a lie, of course. Most people cannot make heads nor tails out of this and a number of other scriptural passages.
That is sad, Major, and I am certain that you know that a sickness or disease doesn't negate someone's salvation. Those that think so have a lot to learn, yet.
These verses in 1 John 5:16-17 do not support the distinction that Catholic dogma places on venial and mortal sin although it may seem that way superficially. These verses in context of the entire bible can be broken down as such: in the bible there is only one type of sin that does not lead to death for a Christian believer only, and that is the sin that Jesus atones for through His sacrifice at the cross. This includes every sin known to humanity with the exception of one, that is the one unforgivable sin which is also known as the unpardonable sin. The unpardonable sin will always lead to death. Our Lord says it best:
"
28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation." Mark 3:28-29
And if we understand what blaspheming the Holy Spirit means, and I can elaborate on that if anyone cares to know, you can truly understand why that sin cannot be forgiven nor should you pray that such a sin is forgiven.
Blessings,
MoG
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Glomung
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All that is cute, but wrong.
Actually, he is correct. What is being touted in this thread is Catholic dogma concerning sin and it is not congruent with what God says in His word.
Here is my thought on it: if Jesus Himself actually told us there is only one unpardonable sin, how in the world can we still be debating this? It doesn't get much more straightforward (considering this wasn't even in a parable!) then a direct quote from the Lord himself. 
Of course that brings up the next question: how in the world does someone actually do -that- so we can all -avoid- it? I've heard tons of theories throughout my life. Everything from it reflecting anyone who has not yet accepted Jesus (which would indeed prevent them from faith but which would make this sound a tad too mellow-dramatic for Jesus) to anyone who has ever been in a church, thought they believed, and walked away from a time. (i.e. that "knock at the door" is a one time only offer; this seems to contradict the amount of effort we are told that God puts forth to find us, and the idea that he will keep looking.)
In the context of this thread, is anyone going to try and say that suicide is essentially giving the Holy Spirit the boot? I certainly hope that interpretation is not what Jesus meant, and I think of it was a sin which was this straight forward (to name, not to understand / treat / analyze / etc. obviously!) that he would've spelled it out for us. (Further, I stand by what I said earlier with regard to this topic.)
I'm not sure if looking at this will risk derailing the thread, but it is definitely something I looked at and went "Huh?" over when I was reading the gospels last month.
Of course that brings up the next question: how in the world does someone actually do -that- so we can all -avoid- it? I've heard tons of theories throughout my life. Everything from it reflecting anyone who has not yet accepted Jesus (which would indeed prevent them from faith but which would make this sound a tad too mellow-dramatic for Jesus) to anyone who has ever been in a church, thought they believed, and walked away from a time. (i.e. that "knock at the door" is a one time only offer; this seems to contradict the amount of effort we are told that God puts forth to find us, and the idea that he will keep looking.)
In the context of this thread, is anyone going to try and say that suicide is essentially giving the Holy Spirit the boot? I certainly hope that interpretation is not what Jesus meant, and I think of it was a sin which was this straight forward (to name, not to understand / treat / analyze / etc. obviously!) that he would've spelled it out for us. (Further, I stand by what I said earlier with regard to this topic.)
I'm not sure if looking at this will risk derailing the thread, but it is definitely something I looked at and went "Huh?" over when I was reading the gospels last month.
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This says it all!
We are all Christians here, we all want to meet God the Father but it has to be on His terms, not ours.
1. You are not discerning properly. There were two states in death OT. ONE in Hades and ONE in Abrahams bosom.
Continue in mortal sin OT or NT and your home is Hell.
2. It is very different. As I have already explained.
The only ticket to hell kj is not ACCEPTING Jesus as your Lord and Savior. Nothing else will land you a ticket to hell. This is the only way to end up in hell - not having the Blood of Christ covering us....For the record kj - God never sends any one to hell - people do that on their own and we are with out excuse
God Bless
Jim
Of course I agree with that Jim. It is as though you are just not grasping what accepting and rejecting Jesus involves. We don't reject Jesus by not hearing the gospel or saying 'I reject Jesus'. We reject Jesus by loving what is evil. Mortal sins = loving what is evil. Paul explains this properly and urges us to discern better then the world in 1 Cor 5 and 6.
Then we don't accept Jesus as though its some magical lines we recite. Jesus only comes in when we open the door to Him. We open the door to Him when we repent. We only repent because we hate our evil / what is evil. Ie continue in mortal sin and you were either not a Christian or have shipwrecked your Christianity.
Yes. God created a home for wolves. Venial sinners are not wolves. Adam and Eve deserved death but not hell for their disobedience. Cain thought many evil thoughts but it was only when he murdered that God paid him a visit.
Dude get a grip here. rofl
You do NOT have to love what is evil to reject Christ.
The church is full of people who have not accepted Christ but do good and do good in His name and believe it is enough. Where does the evil play in here bud ? They still will not bypass hell if they do not ask Christ into their hearts.....
It is not that hard to see this - it is simple really.
1. That sin we commit right before we die
.2. I believe it is inline with all Paul's warnings to us Christians. Paul never singled out Christian X as saved and Christian Y as unsaved. Paul was being respectful. That is why we will forever debate OSAS
. A human cannot see the depths of a heart, only works. But God knows who is His and who isn't. So the sin unto death is clearly rejection of Him. Rejection of Him is full measure when our sin is full measure. The Amorites were not destroyed because their sin was not full measure Gen 15:16. Sodom was because their sin was full measure.Ananias and Sapphira should be compared with Judas. A single action that reflects a state of the heart being so lost / a depth of evil intent that causes our love of sin / evil to be '''full measure'''.
Jim you need to discern better. On the one hand we have the verse you referring to Matt 7:22 Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles.
On the other we have James 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.
Now look at those verses properly. Matt 7:22 = I prophesied....I drove out demons.....I performed great miracles....= all works that appeal to pride / push our vanity = I am God's man of the hour = I am prophet so and so = I am doctor so and so...
Jesus would NEVER EVER IN A MILLION GAZILLION years say ''I never knew you' to the Christian that has a testimony of helping orphans, widows and is keeping himself unspotted from the world.
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Here is my thought on it: if Jesus Himself actually told us there is only one unpardonable sin, how in the world can we still be debating this? It doesn't get much more straightforward (considering this wasn't even in a parable!) then a direct quote from the Lord himself.
Of course that brings up the next question: how in the world does someone actually do -that- so we can all -avoid- it? I've heard tons of theories throughout my life. Everything from it reflecting anyone who has not yet accepted Jesus (which would indeed prevent them from faith but which would make this sound a tad too mellow-dramatic for Jesus) to anyone who has ever been in a church, thought they believed, and walked away from a time. (i.e. that "knock at the door" is a one time only offer; this seems to contradict the amount of effort we are told that God puts forth to find us, and the idea that he will keep looking.)
In the context of this thread, is anyone going to try and say certainly hope that interpretation is not what Jesus meant, and I think of it was a sin which was this straight forward (to name, not to understand / treat / analyze / etc. obviously!) that he would've spelled it out for us. (Further, I stand by what I said earlier with regard to this topic.)
I'm not sure if looking at this will risk derailing the thread, but it is definitely something I looked at and went "Huh?" over when I was reading the gospels last month.
Great question! The unforgivable sin is in Mark 3:29, blaspheming the Holy Spirit. To understand why that is unpardonable, you need to understand the function of the Holy Spirit (or Comforter.)
The Holy Spirit:
1.) Helps us understand prophecy and guides us unto all truth(John 16:13)
2.) He teaches (Luke 12:12)
3.) He comforts (John 14:16)
4.) He bears witness of Jesus (John 15:26)
5.) He convicts the world of sin (John 16:8)
6.) He dwells within us that we may live a Holy Life (Romans 8:9)
7.) He seals us (Eph 4:30)
Therefore, to blaspheme the Holy Spirit is to reject His influence, thereby also rejecting truth and ultimately Christ and salvation. If you do not want to commit the unpardonable sin, do not reject the truth when He brings conviction to your heart. The devils job is to get you to do just that and he does that often though professed believers or the ideas of men.
Blessings,
MoG
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Of course that is true. My point was that even the very best Christian can and will have health issues that cam cause them to want to kill themselves.
And THAT is the unpardonable sin!!!
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