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if god made satan

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by thomas 7, Nov 24, 2011.

  1. why didnt he just destroy him when lucifer became envious of god instead of kick him out of heaven just destroy him then there would not of been any badness in the world and satan would not have tempted adam or eve maybe the world could be different now
  2. Perhaps if Eve wasn't around men would be holier. But then who would wash the dishes? :)

    Eph 1:3-4

    When we see that we were planned to be 'in Christ' before the foundations of the world, we see that God knew Adam / mankind would fail! God is using the devil. The devil just 'sped up' the inevitable rebellion of man.

    The question should be, why are we created with the ability to rebel against God?
  3. Hi Thomas,

    We need to understand that Satan cannot FORCE anybody to be evil or to sin any more than the Lord can FORCE people to be good. The point of creating beings of freewill is to allow THEM to choose what they will do (but face the consequences of their choice also). Remember it was not only Satan who rebelled against the Lord but a third of ALL the angels also. We KNOW angels have freewill just as we do because you cannot rebel except that you have the freewill ability to CHOOSE to rebel. Two thirds of the Angels chose NOT to rebel.

    But we need to understand also that all this is not about ridding the EARTH of evil (otherwise why exile Satan and the other fallen angels HERE?). It is actually about ridding the REST of the universe of the evil that is upon the Earth. Earth is death row for the evil in the universe. That is why Satan and the rebellious Angels have been exiled here and why those who choose evil will never leave here but will perish from the universe along with the Earth itself.

    Those who will be permitted to join the rest of the universe and be saved from the Earth before its destruction are those who of their OWN freewill choose to turn away from sin and evil and, of their own freewill choose the righteousness of the Lord. BUT it is a choice that WILL be put to the test to ensure it is a genuine choice made with ALL our heart and mind and soul that even Satan himself cannot turn us away from.

    There has already been one war and rebellion in Heaven. The Lord will not invite back into it those who are likely to start another one. The Lord will test and judge for Himself the genuiness, steadfastness, and depth of the love you have for Him and His righteousness.

    Understand that Heaven is not inherited by those who claim innocence of sin, but by those who admit guilt of sin but desire by the grace and mercy of the Lord - forgivness - and the willingness to be changed and reborn innocent.

    Hope this helps explain it a little.


  4. Because god doesn't want robot he wants us to love him because we choose to not due to forcefulness. To the user asking the question, perhaps the lord allowed sin and the pain it brings so we will appreciate heaven to the fullest. How can you know happiness without experiencing despair and saddness? Also. God isn't responsible for our actions and the mess that comes with it , yet he is still so kind to clean up out mess.
    Huntingteckel and God is Love say Amen and like this.
  5. Hi KJ

    That last question is a good one. The answer lies in what it is the Lord is actually seeking and we find that in Rev 21:3

    Rev 21:3 "And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God."

    A God and HIS people living together, sharing a RELATIONSHIP OF LOVE AND FAITH.

    But a relationship of love and faith can only exist between beings who have the freewill of choice to enter that relationship. Take the example of two men each of who has a bird. One man must keep his in a cage at all times lest it fly away. The other man does not even own a cage. His bird stays with him and sits on his shoulder. Free to fly away at any time but never choosing to do so.

    One man has a pet - the other man has a RELATIONSHIP.

    It is actually impossible to have a relationship with somebody who does not have the power or ability to make their own decisions. It is like having a relationship with your own left leg. It is just you having a relationship with ... you in another guise!

    The Lord is seeking those who by their OWN freewill DESIRE that which HE desires - a God and HIS people/ a people and THEIR god, living together as one because that is what they all WANT to do and CHOOSE to do by their OWN freewill.

    There will be nobody in Heaven who does not WANT to be there. There will be nobody in the Kingdom of Heaven who does not WANT Jehovah as their God or Christ Jesus to rule over them as their sovereign Lord and King. But it only works if we all have the freewill to choose what it is WE WANT.
    Huntingteckel likes this.
  6. Freedom of choice!!!
  7. Is that the only reason why you feel God made woman?? I know your joking though but oh well, this is off topic so ignore my post :)
  8. Amen Jake I know he may be joking but women weren't created to wash dishes or be bare foot and pregnant atleast not me.
    Huntingteckel, God is Love, seneca and 1 other person say Amen and like this.
  9. This is a good example!
  10. Totally with you on this one, its no joke. I mean we as men wouldn't completely realize it unless we were in that sort of a position. But me on the other hand, doesn't need to go through all that to realize :)
  11. The spirit is indestructible. It is created with eternity inherent in it, that's why God did not just destroy Satan. I also believe God's intention in creating us is not to have robots who have no choice but to obey his will. I mean have you ever tried fellowshipping with a robot? It's sweeter when you offer your love/friendship to someone who has the willpower to refuse or accept you and he or she chooses to aceept your friendship.
  12. [​IMG]

    God has sure cleaned up more messes "I" made than I care to remember.
  13. Hi Thomas,

    Good question.

    We could all try and understand why God did not destroy Satan when he rebelled but we do not really know the answer.

    A few things we do know is that Satan and the other angels who also rebelled where thrown out of heaven - they lost their heavenly positions of worshiping God. The book of Jude even explains that some where cast into dungeons of sorts - Jude 1:6. In the final time Satan and the rest of the rebellious angels will be destroyed in the lake of fire - Rev. 20:10. So God will judge Satan but why He left him around to deceive man we can only speculate - maybe he is here to test us.

    Interestingly enough Hell was not created for man it was created as a place of torment and punishment for Satan. Rebellious man has also found a final resting place in hell but the good news is that only through Jesus can we be declared righteous and exhalted to live forever in the presence of God.
  14. Perhaps a discussion for another thread? :)

    A woman barefoot and preganant is sexy! ;)
  15. We can't put God in a box. He can do anything.
  16. Jude 1:6 is not seperating the fallen angels from fallen angels. It is seperating fallen angels from angels with God.
  17. Sorry, dont understand what you are trying to say.
  18. Perhaps un-intentional confusion :), Jude 1:6 is talking of all fallen angels leaving their first estate why you say some?
  19. Quite simply because the passage in Jude is not definitive and is not the only passage in the Bible referring to fallen angels. The passage simply says "those" angels which could infer that there are other angels (fallen or not) which are not in prison. We know Satan is a fallen angel yet he seemingly walks free over the earth. Scripture refers to him as the ruler of this world - so he is not bound in chains so we know that all fallen angels are not in dungeons as we speak. Then there is also the frequent referals to demons in the NT which through the narrative take posession of people - so they are certainly not in prison, but are demons and fallen angels the same thing? I do not think this thread is the place to discuss this controversial topic of which the Bible does not really shed much light upon. I was just trying to answer the original question in this thread.

    What we do know about Satan is that he will be judged and will be cast into the lake of fire for all eternity.
  20. It would seem unfair of God to place some in dungeons and others not. Perhaps the devil would place some in dungeons, but I don't really care to even discuss this on another thread :).


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