How Does One Keep The Sabbath And Does It Apply To The New Covenant

[Candelario Mario Villa]

What do you know of the concept of Theosis? That once we are born eternal and made partakers of the Divine nature, that the new birth and process of conformance to the image of Christ makes us beni-elohim....? If so and since we then walk in two realms and have authority (though delegated) in two realms why do you suppose most Christians still focus on the temporal nature and not the divine? The whole of creation is waiting for the revealing of the sons of God...now that Christ won it back should we not take dominion over this realm in His name? This has very much to do with the divine nature...
I just think we should engage in prayer war against the principalities that govern our leaders and cities, pray for our neighborhoods declaring His authority over them, speaking to the problem and using the sword pro-actively as well as engaging in service, and though I know many of us do just that, many Christians seem to have no idea...how can we reach our own and get them active...(for we wrestle not against flesh and blood)...
They do not understand that now we have been made gods, not The Eternal Deity, but elohim none the less. So how should we live this here and now? What are your thoughts?

______________________________________________

"What is man that you are mindful of him? and the son of man that you visit him? For you have made him a little lower than
[the] El-ohim (not angels), and have crowned him with glory and honor."

The Lord Jesus was not made lower than the angels, for angels were subject unto him: but he was made less than El-ohim
because he partook of flesh and blood and was subject to death.

 

[Man-ofGod]

I want to add one other point to my previous post. There is not question that the apostles and laity (Jews and Gentile) did worship on the 7th day Sabbath, please see:

Acts 17:2
Acts 13:13, 14
Acts 16:13
Acts 18:4
Acts 13:42,44
Acts 18:4

And of course, Jesus Himself followed this custom (Luke 4:16).

God Bless,
MoG

 

[Abdicate]

The Jews meet on the Sabbath and they, being Jews and Christians, knew they could preach to the Jews only on the Sabbath. They also met on the first day of the week to worship together as Christians. Don't make it out to be more than it was. There is no law, don't make new ones... To me, all these verses show the birth of the 2-day weekend. Preach to the Jew on the Sabbath and worship with the Saints on Sunday and tell of the miracles of events on the Sabbath. Nothing more, nothing less. You've been set free from the law, don't allow yourselves to be put back under bondage.

2 Timothy 4:1-5 (KJV) I charge [thee] therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

 

[Mitspa]

Here is a "thus saith the Lord" New Covenant
Ga 3:1 ¶ O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you (EGW) that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified?
2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have you suffered so many things in vain--if indeed it was in vain?
5 Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? --
6 ¶ just as Abraham "believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness."
7 Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham.
8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, "In you all the nations shall be blessed."
9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them."
11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for "the just shall live by faith."


God could not have said these things any more "evident" over and over in the New Testament in absolute terms .So those who claim they honor Gods word, by keeping "parts" of the law are blind to the truth.

2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ.
15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.

Does the law just have power to blind the Jew? No, it blinds all who look to it.

 

[Brother Paul]

Brother MoG I would never try and persuade you to stop your tradition. I am just saying there is plenty of evidence to suggest the importance of the 1st day to God (the day God Himself chose to fill the Ekklesia the "called out" body with the Holy Spirit sanctifying THEM making the Ekklesia gathered on the 1st day "Holy"). The OT is replete with examples of the impoprtance of 1st days and 1st days as Sabbaths as well.

So I am not saying that God did not make the 7th day Holy (God forbid) or that that was ever changed in God's heart or mind (only the practice was changed politically, which is meaningless to me). However, the "Lord's Day" is not that day. It is the day that Christ rose from the dead just as the Apostles taught the earliest church (centuries before any Popes) which we have a continuous unbroken tradition of practice to demonstrate (that is the Ekklesia, His Holy body). That the day we of the New Covenant were instructed to gather for corporate worship was the 1sdt day. Now add to that the FACT that nowhere is it commanded that one must do this on the 7th day. So gathering on the 1st day is perfectly sound and right in God's eyes. So for Uriah or Ellen to make such unfounded outlandish accusations, as if speaking for God (which He demonstrated they did not), that after 1844 or 1868 that anyone who did not "keep the Sabbath" (which meant practice the unbiblical fashion of Sabbath Keeping they were proposing) was shut out from the Kingdom is absurd (if not arrogant).

We know the Sabbath command was part of the Old Covenant given at Horeb to the Israelites (and not even to their fathers) because the Bible tells us this, but that says nothing about how SDAs claim it is to be observed (or why). It is not binding on us nor a requirement from God upon us who have entered His rest. So all your intentions to persuade have been demonstrated to be false...no it was not what was practiced until changed by some Pope (you were lied to), it was not "the Lord's Day" (another lie you have been told) and keeping the Sabbath as SDAs do was never required of anyone (another lie) nor will entering the Lord's rest in Christ as opposed to this non-Biblically prescribed set of practices keep anyone of the Kingdom (so another lie). The 4th commandment is not "the greatest commandment" (another lie), and Christ did not return either of the two times predicted (another lie), and no Investigative Judgment is necessary because His death burial and resurrection was sufficient (Hebrews 10).

When I consider all this I can only pray for you. Not for your salvation because that is God's doing. I realize you accept the one God in three persons and that the Son came to ransom you from bondage to sin and His blood and resurrection had set you free but I will pray for you anyway because many of us (as I once was by Calvinism) are PERSUADED by denominational arguments that appear to be sound (them using scriptures to persuade) but realize this (and this is not saying we can or should intentionally disobey God) if commandment keeping is the way one os made right with God then Christ died in vain.

In His love

Paul

 

[Brother Paul]

______________________________________________

"What is man that you are mindful of him? and the son of man that you visit him? For you have made him a little lower than
[the] El-ohim (not angels), and have crowned him with glory and honor."

The Lord Jesus was not made lower than the angels, for angels were subject unto him: but he was made less than El-ohim
because he partook of flesh and blood and was subject to death.

This was a different thread....but God bless

 

[Brother Paul]

I want to add one other point to my previous post. There is not question that the apostles and laity (Jews and Gentile) did worship on the 7th day Sabbath, please see:

Acts 17:2
Acts 13:13, 14
Acts 16:13
Acts 18:4
Acts 13:42,44
Acts 18:4

And of course, Jesus Himself followed this custom (Luke 4:16).

God Bless,
MoG

And of course, Jesus Himself followed this custom (Luke 4:16).

Yes true that had become a custom for the Jews (not even all Israelites) after the Babylonian Captivity...but they also kept the Feast of Dedication, and wore Tallith's in the synagogue, as was their custom, so by your logic you should also be doing this...

Are you? NO! Point settled...

 

[Brother Paul]

The Jews meet on the Sabbath and they, being Jews and Christians, knew they could preach to the Jews only on the Sabbath. They also met on the first day of the week to worship together as Christians. Don't make it out to be more than it was. There is no law, don't make new ones... To me, all these verses show the birth of the 2-day weekend. Preach to the Jew on the Sabbath and worship with the Saints on Sunday and tell of the miracles of events on the Sabbath. Nothing more, nothing less. You've been set free from the law, don't allow yourselves to be put back under bondage.

2 Timothy 4:1-5 (KJV) I charge [thee] therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

Amen!

 

[Brother Paul]

Here is a "thus saith the Lord" New Covenant
Ga 3:1 ¶ O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you (EGW) that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified?
2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have you suffered so many things in vain--if indeed it was in vain?
5 Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? --
6 ¶ just as Abraham "believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness."
7 Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham.
8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, "In you all the nations shall be blessed."
9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them."
11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for "the just shall live by faith."

God could not have said these things any more "evident" over and over in the New Testament in absolute terms .So those who claim they honor Gods word, by keeping "parts" of the law are blind to the truth.

2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ.
15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.

Does the law just have power to blind the Jew? No, it blinds all who look to it.

Amen!

 

[Brother Paul]

Why is it that so many insist “to have our eyes opened” we must partake of their fruit? In other words to understand God’s word correctly we must read it in light of some outside source?

Jews – the Talmud

Roman Catholics – the interpretations of the Teaching Magisterium

Calvinists – the Institutes of religion

Mormons – The Book of Mormon and the Pearl of great Price

SDAs – the writings of E. G. White

The JWs – the Watchtower Society Publications

And so on…

Am I seeing this accurately?

 

[Candelario Mario Villa]

Why is it that so many insist “to have our eyes opened” we must partake of their fruit? In other words to understand God’s word correctly we must read it in light of some outside source?
Jews – the Talmud
Roman Catholics – the interpretations of the Teaching Magisterium
Calvinists – the Institutes of religion
Mormons – The Book of Mormon and the Pearl of great Price
SDAs – the writings of E. G. White
The JWs – the Watchtower Society Publications
And so on…

Am I seeing this accurately?

_____________________________________

That is very observant, Beloved. "...let them return untoyou, but do not return unto them."

 

[Mitspa]

Why is it that so many insist “to have our eyes opened” we must partake of their fruit? In other words to understand God’s word correctly we must read it in light of some outside source?

Jews – the Talmud

Roman Catholics – the interpretations of the Teaching Magisterium

Calvinists – the Institutes of religion

Mormons – The Book of Mormon and the Pearl of great Price

SDAs – the writings of E. G. White

The JWs – the Watchtower Society Publications

And so on…

Am I seeing this accurately?

It is always the same "did God really say" Is it every jot and tittle, ALL THINGS written in the book of the law? All heresy takes portions of the law and uses that as a false foundation to give the impression of righteousness. Satans most powerful and effective ministers always use a cloak of righteousness. The power satan has over mankind is "sin" if he can get a righteous person of faith, to turn back into any form of self-righteousness, he will defeat Gods righteousness working on that believers behalf. When the Lord disarmed satan (accuser) it was by taking the law (ministry of condemnation) out of the way, nailing it to the Cross. Now did he nail only portions of the law? Or "every jot and tittle" What did He the Lord -God in the flesh- say? Not one jot or tittle would pass until it all was fulfilled. He fulfilled it on His Cross.

If those who claim to "keep" portions of the law, if they would keep the laws true standard, they would soon become very aware of just how wretched and sinful they are, but they dishonor the law by bringing it down to these carnal levels, where they may compare themselves to others and control those in ignorance. God is not mocked, these people will not rejoice in the Day of judgment. They are lawless, they dishonor Gods law and above all they dishonor Christ Jesus and his Cross. They are the enemies of His Cross.

 

[Man-ofGod]

Brother MoG I would never try and persuade you to stop your tradition. I am just saying there is plenty of evidence to suggest the importance of the 1st day to God (the day God Himself chose to fill the Ekklesia the "called out" body with the Holy Spirit sanctifying THEM making the Ekklesia gathered on the 1st day "Holy"). The OT is replete with examples of the impoprtance of 1st days and 1st days as Sabbaths as well.

So I am not saying that God did not make the 7th day Holy (God forbid) or that that was ever changed in God's heart or mind (only the practice was changed politically, which is meaningless to me). However, the "Lord's Day" is not that day. It is the day that Christ rose from the dead just as the Apostles taught the earliest church (centuries before any Popes) which we have a continuous unbroken tradition of practice to demonstrate (that is the Ekklesia, His Holy body). That the day we of the New Covenant were instructed to gather for corporate worship was the 1sdt day. Now add to that the FACT that nowhere is it commanded that one must do this on the 7th day. So gathering on the 1st day is perfectly sound and right in God's eyes. So for Uriah or Ellen to make such unfounded outlandish accusations, as if speaking for God (which He demonstrated they did not), that after 1844 or 1868 that anyone who did not "keep the Sabbath" (which meant practice the unbiblical fashion of Sabbath Keeping they were proposing) was shut out from the Kingdom is absurd (if not arrogant).

We know the Sabbath command was part of the Old Covenant given at Horeb to the Israelites (and not even to their fathers) because the Bible tells us this, but that says nothing about how SDAs claim it is to be observed (or why). It is not binding on us nor a requirement from God upon us who have entered His rest. So all your intentions to persuade have been demonstrated to be false...no it was not what was practiced until changed by some Pope (you were lied to), it was not "the Lord's Day" (another lie you have been told) and keeping the Sabbath as SDAs do was never required of anyone (another lie) nor will entering the Lord's rest in Christ as opposed to this non-Biblically prescribed set of practices keep anyone of the Kingdom (so another lie). The 4th commandment is not "the greatest commandment" (another lie), and Christ did not return either of the two times predicted (another lie), and no Investigative Judgment is necessary because His death burial and resurrection was sufficient (Hebrews 10).

When I consider all this I can only pray for you. Not for your salvation because that is God's doing. I realize you accept the one God in three persons and that the Son came to ransom you from bondage to sin and His blood and resurrection had set you free but I will pray for you anyway because many of us (as I once was by Calvinism) are PERSUADED by denominational arguments that appear to be sound (them using scriptures to persuade) but realize this (and this is not saying we can or should intentionally disobey God) if commandment keeping is the way one os made right with God then Christ died in vain.

In His love

Paul

Woah slow down You said a lot there lol. Your premise has been that SDA doctrine teaches that Sunday keepers are lost because they do not engage in corporate worship on the Sabbath is simply not the case. I am not sure why you bring up Uriah Smith, he does not claim inspiration and he has been wrong before. As far as Ellen White, we will touch on that subject in its own time.

These arguments of yours are mostly straw man issues and are part of the mainstream slander that exist. If your trying to persuade me of anything, you will never do it by misrepresenting the antagonist position. You have to research with a fair mind to represent the facts properly (not easy to do). I do believe YOU THINK you have accurately stated the facts, but that is simply not the case. I understand your passion and I probably would be passionate too, if some of whatt you said was true . But I assure you, much of it is not.

Thank you for your prayers, I need them. Also I appreciated your mini-testimony. Denominationalism does often lead people to adopt errors in doctrine. But that is not the only trap Satan lays at our feet. He has many tricks up his sleeve. God Bless, MoG.

 

[Brother Paul]

Woah slow down You said a lot there lol. Your premise has been that SDA doctrine teaches that Sunday keepers are lost because they do not engage in corporate worship on the Sabbath is simply not the case. I am not sure why you bring up Uriah Smith, he does not claim inspiration and he has been wrong before. As far as Ellen White, we will touch on that subject in its own time.

These arguments of yours are mostly straw man issues and are part of the mainstream slander that exist. If your trying to persuade me of anything, you will never do it by misrepresenting the antagonist position. You have to research with a fair mind to represent the facts properly (not easy to do). I do believe YOU THINK you have accurately stated the facts, but that is simply not the case. I understand your passion and I probably would be passionate too, if some of whatt you said was true . But I assure you, much of it is not.

Thank you for your prayers, I need them. Also I appreciated your mini-testimony. Denominationalism does often lead people to adopt errors in doctrine. But that is not the only trap Satan lays at our feet. He has many tricks up his sleeve. God Bless, MoG.

Well...when I quoted her words they were her words from her writings and as I said before I have read much of her stuff and owned most of her works so I am not at all ignorant of her doctrines nor merely persuaded by public opinion. Her 5 Volume Set which includes Patriarchs and Prophets, Prophets and Kings, and so on (?) is amazing...it took about a year to read it thoroughly...she was an incredible writer, but theologically (as well as historically) she was incorrect in many places. Now one can say this is my opinion and surely it is but it is not an opinion based on others opinions. and Uriah was very influential on Ellen as were others (including Miller and her own husband)...so my OPINION (which I admit) is not part of the mainstream slander any more than the factual quotations you made from RC sources are not accurate. Any group who insists to me that I can only understand any part (even prophecy which the SDA view has led so many astray in) of the scriptures through reading some outside person or source is to me automatically amiss. God does not direct people to write things contradictory to His word. Later revelation (of it adds to or takes away from) is always questionable to me.

For example, I have heard many arguments and read many scriptures which could imply the "soul sleep" position (though think the Mount of Transfiguration alone dissolves that argument). and so I can see Christians believing that, but the "Annihilationist" position is so thoroughly refuted by the words of Christ alone (which Ellen taught and pushed) that it merits no defense (though I would be prepared to offer one). She was just in error in so many places (though no one has all the truth save God, for one day we WILL know even as we are fully known but not yet) I cannot count them all. But as for this issue we are discussing here I think it has already been refuted and that you actually know it. But nonetheless observing the Sabbath is not a problem for me. You observe it in your unbiblical custom and I in mine...

Shabbat Shalom MoG

 

[Man-ofGod]

Thank you brother Paul,

I suggest we take a break and praise the Lord Jesus for His amazing grace ! I would invite anyone to come who wants to keep the Sabbath Holy. It starts and sundown and ends at sunset tomorrow Just abstain from all secular activities and study Gods word, sing songs, go out with the family in His wonderful creation, meditate on all things pure and Holy and spend time with Jesus Himself. He will be there You might learn to love it. Doesn't hurt to try. God Bless!

Blessings,
MoG

 

[Cosmicwaffle]

There is nothing wrong with recognizing the Sabbath, but as Christians we are not required to keep the Sabbath laws. The first question I ask is this... How are you saved? Is it by belief or works of the law? Paul says in Galatians 3:3 that our works, no matter how good, do not perfect our salvation. While it is perfectly fine as I said before to recognize and worship on Saturday, it is not a law Christians are REQUIRED, like the Jews were, to keep. I don't know about you, but keeping the forth commandment is NO easy task! Can't kindle a fire, cook food, or even pick up sticks! Christ is our rest, and a reminder that we are no longer sons of the bondwoman, but of the free.

 

[Mitspa]

Thank you brother Paul,

I suggest we take a break and praise the Lord Jesus for His amazing grace ! I would invite anyone to come who wants to keep the Sabbath Holy. It starts and sundown and ends at sunset tomorrow Just abstain from all secular activities and study Gods word, sing songs, go out with the family in His wonderful creation, meditate on all things pure and Holy and spend time with Jesus Himself. He will be there You might learn to love it. Doesn't hurt to try. God Bless!

Blessings,
MoG

Sounds like what I do everyday? I suggest that some need the real stuff, "you might learn to love it"

 

[Man-ofGod]

There is nothing wrong with recognizing the Sabbath, but as Christians we are not required to keep the Sabbath laws. The first question I ask is this... How are you saved? Is it by belief or works of the law? Paul says in Galatians 3:3 that our works, no matter how good, do not perfect our salvation. While it is perfectly fine as I said before to recognize and worship on Saturday, it is not a law Christians are REQUIRED, like the Jews were, to keep. I don't know about you, but keeping the forth commandment is NO easy task! Can't kindle a fire, cook food, or even pick up sticks! Christ is our rest, and a reminder that we are no longer sons of the bondwoman, but of the free.

Welcome to the discussion Cosmicwaffle (like the name!),


We are not saved by the Sabbath commandment anymore then we are saved by not killing and not committing adultery (the 10 commandments), both of which we know King David has done. Yet he (David an OT Jew) is saved by the grace of God (2 sam 12:13). It was always grace and it always will be grace that saves us. Therefore, we keep the commandments (aka establish the law Rom 3:31) not to be saved but simply because we are saved. But Heb 10:26 says "if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins" and in 1 John 3:4 it says "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law."

I say this lovingly. You decide if those are my words or Gods words.

With that said, the discussion of the law took place in a earlier segment but I completely expect to have to rinse repeat this topic sought of speak as I understand many new faces will enter the discussion as the thread matures. If you are interested you can see the discussion between me and Abdicate starting here at bottom part of thread. Just look for where Abdicate enters. (think it is about 2 threads long but are short post). Any questions, let me know.

God Bless you!!!,
MoG

 

[Man-ofGod]

Sounds like what I do everyday? I suggest that some need the real stuff, "you might learn to love it"

I am glad you have that opportunity to do spend your whole day with Jesus every day! Me, I do my morning devotions then I am off to work. Pray at lunch and study in the evening. I do what I can. I am just glad I can have the whole 24 hour period for the Lord on the day He set aside. It was made for us (mark 2:27) We have to praise the Lord for that.

 

[Mitspa]

Welcome to the discussion Cosmicwaffle (like the name!),


We are not saved by the Sabbath commandment anymore then we are saved by not killing and not committing adultery (the 10 commandments), both of which we know King David has done. Yet he (David an OT Jew) is saved by the grace of God (2 sam 12:13). It was always grace and it always will be grace that saves us. Therefore, we keep the commandments (aka establish the law Rom 3:31) not to be saved but simply because we are saved. But Heb 10:26 says "if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins" and in 1 John 3:4 it says "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law."

I say this lovingly. You decide if those are my words or Gods words.

With that said, the discussion of the law took place in a earlier segment but I completely expect to have to rinse repeat this topic sought of speak as I understand many new faces will enter the discussion as the thread matures. If you are interested you can see the discussion between me and Abdicate starting here at bottom part of thread. Just look for where Abdicate enters. (think it is about 2 threads long but are short post). Any questions, let me know.

God Bless you!!!,
MoG

Well the rebuke of "willful" sin is to those who have forsaken grace and turn back to the law (the strength of sin). All sin comes from self-will, if one teaches this error of translation? I would ask them "is your sin willful"? The context is that it is the Fathers "will" that we be justified in Christ, by his blood. Those who return to the law (which all of the book of Hebrews is about) have rejected grace and made common His blood. This is the "willful" sin in Heb. 10. Which those who attempt to justify themselves by the law (Sabbath etc..) are very ones for whom this warning was intended. (the word "if" is not in this passage, "if" is a clear word in the Greek) The "sin" is the condition of sin, not an "act". Those who go back to the law are in "willful" sin.

Now John also goes on to say that "in Him we cannot sin"- we cannot break the law. Only those under the law can transgress the law.