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God's inner conflict

Discussion in 'Doctrinal Discussions' started by KingJ, Sep 25, 2014.

  1. #1 KingJ, Sep 25, 2014
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2014
    Luke 22:42 ''Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done''.

    Why was God saying this to Himself? I believe it is because He has an inner conflict, namely: Love for His creation VS Hatred of sin.

    The cross is proof that God's love for His creation is greater then His hatred of sin. He sweat blood in anticipation of our sin coming upon Him. He was conflicted!

    All scripture that appears as though 'God changed His mind' suddenly makes sense. Let's take Moses and the golden calf as an example. God wanted to destroy the Jews worshipping it. Moses pleaded with God. God relented. Did God change His mind? Respecting Moses's wishes is not God changing His mind. It is evidence of God's love for Moses being greater then His hatred of the sin / Jews worshipping golden calf.

    God's love for us all > hatred of sin translates into a God that would do absolutely any and everything He can to justify, spare and save us. Which then translates into eternal separation from Him simply being, us literally not wanting to be with Him.

    As John 3:19 says ''This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.'' We are eternally separated from God, not because of our sins. But because we love darkness. We hate the light. We hate God. God loves His enemies, they hate Him.

    I am certain that when God made us He was also conflicted on whether to make some from a lump of clay unto dishonour and some from a lump of clay unto honour. Being omniscient and omnipotent He could and we would have absolutely no say. But then we are assuming God's love for us < Hatred of sin / evil / wicked thoughts / wicked intentions.

    So this rhema for me is proof that God upholds who He is to the maximum. God is true to Himself at a level that we cannot comprehend. God of the universe made Himself a lamb to the slaughter because He loves us more then what He hates most.
     
    Major and C1oudwatch3r say Amen and like this.
  2. This is an excellent essay. Are you or have you ever been a preacher?
     
    Ravindran and Major say Amen and like this.
  3. He has been doing that everyday right here on the internet!!!!
     
  4. Agreed! Good stuff.

    IMO the "cup" in your text refers to the coming death with all of its physical pain and spiritual agonies.
    Christ's human nature, though without sin, did apparently fear death, yet more so than other men because He was to bear the sins of the entire world, suffer and temporarily lose the fellowship He had with the Father.
     
  5. Well, Christ was saying it to God. I don't understand when people call Christ God, it says he is God's son, not God himself.
     
  6. Agreed! It was what we never saw. People have suffered worse and not come close to sweating blood.
     
    Major likes this.
  7. Thanks for compliment. We have open ministry at my church and elders over seeing. We are all called to be preachers. Some of your posts would do well in open ministry.
     
    Major likes this.
  8. It is easy to read it that way. That is why we need to allow scripture to correct / give context on scripture. We can't isolate verses 2 Tim 3:16.

    There is also scripture that says Jesus is God Matt 1:23, Isa 9:6, Rev 1:17-18, Rev 2:8, Isa 44:6, 2 Pet 1:1, John 1:1....there is much more.
     
    Major and C1oudwatch3r say Amen and like this.
  9. Open ministry? What does that mean exactly? Do you mean that several elders/members are invited to preach instead of just one pastor?

    As for me, I am female and not called to preach or minister, other than within certain parameters of family and friends. I have been nervous about some of my posts here overstepping those boundaries and considered withdrawing a bit. Sometimes I can't keep my mouth shut when it comes to talking about Jesus, and I need to learn to pray about things more and less spouting...LOL

    Thank you, kind sir.
     
  10. God the Father is God.
    Jesus the Son of God is God.
    The Holy Spirit is God.
    This is the basis of the Trinitarian view, One God who reveals Himself in three persons.
     
    Major likes this.
  11. You know... as I think about topics like this.... I am reminded that none of us really understand what perfect unity is like..... Many of us are married - and the scripture declares us "One Flesh" - united... but many times, it sure doesn't feel like "We are one".....

    So... We think about Conflict - setting two wills against eachother..... but we must realize that Jesus never set his will against God the Father.... They were united in will.....

    So... While I believe that Jesus experienced the full spectrum of human emotion - he did not set his Will against God... There was not "Conflict" in that sense.....

    We also read scriptures such as "God Repented that he had created man" and we think that God wished he had never created us because of the trouble we cause.. and we interpret this to mean that God decided He had made a mistake..... but I think there is something else going on....

    Remember - this is exactly the plan that God set in motion from the beginning....
     
    Major and C1oudwatch3r say Amen and like this.
  12. You are doing just fine my dear! Keep it up!!!!!
     
  13. John 1:1-5......
    "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life,] and the life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it."
     
  14. In my opinion, Jesus is not God His father, He is a God like his Father exactly the same in every respect of personality and power but lacking only absolute final authority. In my opinion, at the dawn of time before anything, when God came to exist He existed as a single entity, like a glass of water, but divided Himself into three parts or three glasses of water, all exactly equal and the same except designated as Father, Son, Holy Spirit. But this is only conjecture since we can't know till we actually get to heaven. It may be that all three have exactly the same dark matter structure but differ in physical dimensions? eg God is 1 trillion x1000000 cubic metres in size, the Holy Spirit is 1 billion x10000000 cubic meters and Jesus is only 1 million x1000000 cubic meters of dark matter. However, Jesus was able to remove the bulk of his divine nature in order to occupy a baby size.
    If your brain can accomadate a legion of demons then demons and you must only have an actual atomic size of less than a marble? in compressed format.
    Sorry sounds weird, that's how I think.
    In Revelation 1 God showed Jesus what was going to happen, Jesus then sent his angel to John, then John reveals it to us. Jesus does not know the when, hence Jesus is not the distinct person of God, he is the same as God, but as far as access to God Jesus has been appointed by God as the only door to God, not mohammed, not Ghandi, not Buddha, not good living, only Jesus.
    When Jesus says I and the Father are one he means, we are exactly the same, think exactly the same, share everything but have the capacity for independent actions.
     
    Major likes this.
  15. I do not desire to speak for King3 but he may attend a brethren Church (or variety thereof) where any MAN can stand and preach or share as the Spirit moves...women however are usually totally silent in such congregations (within limits)...the two I have attended the men are well dressed in suits and the women are dressed like they just got off the wagon train of 19th century America (this is my one problem with these congregations) and though a non-essential I think it a bit extreme (bunned hair, homely long dresses, no make-up whatsoever, and so on)...I would not want to judge them for this but women like to look good for church as well as men, and they do it to bring glory to God...so I hope King addresses your question.

    You are free here...in Christ there is neither male or female, superior or inferior, slave or free....all are one in Christ. Therefore YOU are also the light of the world so do not take your candle and hide it under a bushel basket I am sure Dad (ABBA) has given you something to contribute
     
    Major likes this.
  16. Thank you for your kind words, Brother Paul. I have been thinking about going to a brethren church lately, mostly because there are so many of them in this area. I kind of steered away from them when I was looking for a church, but I don't know why. I know nothing about them so I was being prejudiced, I guess. I would not mind their clothes as long as they don't mind mine. I am modest and I would think that would be enough.
     
    Major likes this.
  17. Lol. The woman at my church just wear head coverings. Otherwise their nice modest dress would be what they would wear to any fancy occasion.
     
  18. It depends a lot on the elders in charge.

    I really do like the church mechanics. It obeys scripture to the T. Elders always present. All the types of meetings...communion and open ministry, gospel, prayer, Holy Spirit prayer, bible-study, fellowship.

    Only the men are allowed to teach as brother Paul pointed out. But woman can share and pray. The men that teach tripe are corrected after the meeting by the elders. Any member in a mortal sin is placed under discipline and cannot share, pray or teach.
     
  19. Now ALL of what you mentioned here is Biblically acceptable to me. I would think that a church with such active male members would be a sign of a healthy church.
     
    Major, Robine and KingJ says Amen and like this.
  20. Ah! Much better...I actually like the head covering thing...even on Muslim women...in the early church this is how women presented themselves
     

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