1. Hello Guest! You are browsing the forums as a guest; you will have limited permissions as a guest so we advise registering to enjoy the forums fully. Remember: we are a Christian ONLY site - any user who is not Christian will not be approved. Blessings, Christian Forum Site Staff
    Dismiss Notice

Forgiveness And Being A Doormat

Discussion in 'Marriage and Relationships' started by jmilly, May 5, 2014.

  1. One thing I have trouble figuring out is the idea of forgiveness and the idea of recidivism. Suppose somebody hurts me, and I forgive them. And then it happens again. And again.

    I know that We hurt Jesus with our sins, and we ask for forgiveness and then go back and do it again.

    I know it's hypocritical for me to ask about this then. But my question is more along the lines of: how do we forgive yet not become a doormat?

    For instance, there's a person in my life I am not talking to. I try to tell myself I am over it. But I'm definitely avoiding them because I'm scared they will do it again and nothing has changed.

    I just don't know how to both forgive and not get taken advantage of or mistreated over and over again. I miss my friend but I am not in the mood to be treated like c$&p any time soon either. And also I tend to remind myself of the hurt they caused as a way to continue the hiatus. So that makes me feel like I haven't forgiven truly. But it's a coping mechanism /defense mechanism.
    When I forgave in the past it turned out that the person would just keep treating me in the same objectionable manner again. It just seems like the people who get mad and hold grudges and whatnot always end up "winning". And I'm always apologizing and forgiving. For once I want somebody to show they actually care about maintaining a relationship with me.


    Sorry that sort of trailed off topic there. My apologies.
     
  2. Sometimes it 's best not to be around a certain person if they keep treating you wrongly. Part of our forgiving someone sometimes demands that we stay away from them so as not to be hurt again. People do seem to take advantage also of our forgiveness and kind nature. We can keep on forgiving but it does no good if the other person doesn't change.
    And it's not a bad thing to remember the hurts if it reminds us not to get in a certain situation again.
     
  3. Sometimes we are told to avoid people:

    1 Corinthians 5:11 NASB
    But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler--not even to eat with such a one.

    2 Timothy 3:2-5 NASB
    For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, [3] unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good, [4] treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, [5] holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.

    And also:

    Psalm 34:14 NASB
    Depart from evil and do good; Seek peace and pursue it.

    You can't seek peace if you feel you have to be around vexatious people.

    This is a favorite topic of mine. There are many who preach doormat theology and even sell their books on the subject. I don't believe forgiveness is being a doormat as many preach.
     
  4. Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?”

    Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.

    “Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. As he began the settlement, a man who owed him ten thousand bags of gold was brought to him. Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt.

    “At this the servant fell on his knees before him. ‘Be patient with me,’ he begged, ‘and I will pay back everything.’ The servant’s master took pity on him, canceled the debt and let him go.

    “But when that servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred silver coins.He grabbed him and began to choke him. ‘Pay back what you owe me!’ he demanded.

    “His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, ‘Be patient with me, and I will pay it back.’

    “But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. When the other servants saw what had happened, they were outraged and went and told their master everything that had happened.

    “Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’ In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.

    (And the moral of the story?)

    “This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart.”

    So I take this to mean forgive everyone for everything. Who cares if they keep doing it to you, forgive them. The most important thing to take from this is not to let un-forgiveness affect your heart, because your heavenly Father will judge accordingly.
     
    ElliDV likes this.
  5. #5 jmilly, May 6, 2014
    Last edited: May 6, 2014
    Thanks
    But doesn't it make for an unhealthy relationship if you are unhappy in n abusive relationship?
    Or with somebody is a relentless manipulator? Or saboteur ?
    I'm not asking in an argumentative way. I'm truly wondering. It just seems wrong to continue to expose myself to that and be at risk? A woman forgive a physically abusive boyfriend so many times until he kills her.... What is the route the Bible would suggest in such a situation?
    Thanks :)
     
  6. Hi Jmilly! I completely understand how you feel. I come from a family that is abusive and manipulative, possibly even evil from time to time. I've learned that forgiveness and trust do not necessarily go in hand. I have forgiven my family, but I refuse to give them another opening to hurt me. I treat them with respect and honor, but I do not speak to them unless I have no other alternative.

    While reading through the Bible, I have noticed that Jesus frequently refuses to take any guff from people; He even makes some people very angry when he refuses to bend to them. If Jesus was blameless and pure, then His actions were blameless and pure. You can stand your ground and require respect from people without sinning.
     
  7. Thanks :)
    I am intrigued. Can you explain one example (or more) where Jesus refuses to bend to people?
    Thank you
     
  8. I understand what you are saying and thinking. In my humble opinion, I think if a person is making choices because of the will of God, then God will protect. And if a person gets into a situation and is hurt because they were following the will of God then more blessings to them.

    Take Christ for example. If he was always worried about being hurt, then he would of never been crucified. Then he would of saved his life and what would that of been like for the rest of us? Sometimes the will of God requires us to get hurt. But I mean every situation is different.

    If a girl is getting abused by her boyfriend, then I wouldn't think that is the will of God. If her boyfriend is abusing her, she's not married to the dude, so she should run from him and never talk to him again.
     
    ElliDV likes this.
  9. Jesus refused to answer many questions and kept talking about what he wanted to talk about. Mark 10 is a good example. The man that came to him asking what he thought about his relative doing him wrong, Jesus said....... What do I have to do with thee? and went on about something else.

    Many instances Jesus kept speaking though nobody understood and the scripture says they asked him later about it. Mark 4, they asked and Jesus said........ Do you not know this parable, then how will you know all parables?"

    He was speaking about sowing the Word of God, and expounded more greatly to them for their sake.

    Sister, now listen to me.

    Forgiving someone does not mean they have the same place in your life they did before.

    You can forgive the one who stole from the collection plate at church, but that does not mean they are allowed to continue to take collections.

    When the term forgiven was used in the Word, it means to not strike back or consider what is owed. It does not mean you give them the same place in your life to harm you again. They must first earn your trust back,then the place may be given.

    You can forgive someone and never speak to them again, because scripture defines being forgiven to not ask again or expect back again what is due.

    Someone who is unfaithful in my life gets cut off. God is not the God of the unfaithful, nor does God want hindrances in our life.
     
  10. Yeah, Jesus was the man! Here is some examples where our Lord refused to bend:

    The time when they were questioning him, and he told them why don't you ask the world what I said.. Then that one dude punched him in the face

    "Meanwhile, the high priest questioned Jesus about his disciples and his teaching.

    20 “I have spoken openly to the world,” Jesus replied. “I always taught in synagoguesor at the temple, where all the Jews come together. I said nothing in secret. 21 Why question me? Ask those who heard me. Surely they know what I said.”

    22 When Jesus said this, one of the officials nearby slapped him in the face. “Is this the way you answer the high priest?” he demanded.

    23 “If I said something wrong,” Jesus replied, “testify as to what is wrong. But if I spoke the truth, why did you strike me?” 24 Then Annas sent him bound to Caiaphasthe high priest."

    Even his disciples new Jesus was the type not to bend. Or else why would they ask Jesus this:

    “Lord, do you want us to call fire down from heaven to destroy them?”

    Jesus wouldn't even bend for the wind:

    He got up, rebuked the wind and said to the waves, "Quiet! Be still!" Then the wind died down and it was completely calm.
     
    ElliDV likes this.
  11. forgiveness and reconciliation are not the "same" thing. I am busy now, but I will elaborate later.
     
  12. I've found a few verses that might be helpful!

    Matthew 12:24, 34-39 says that Jesus called them evil and a brood of vipers when they accused him of using demonic power. The pharisees then request a sign from Jesus. He responds by denying them their request and again implying that they are evil and perverse.

    Matthew 13:54-57 tells us that Jesus offended the people through His teachings. Jesus clearly knows thoughts, and he presumably knows everything there is to know about everything, being God incarnate. This means that He was fully aware that his words would be offensive to them.

    Matthew 15:1-14 Jesus calls the Pharisees hypocrites, and admits being aware of offending them.

    Matthew 16:1-4 Jesus again calls them hypocrites and wicked, and then leaves their presence.

    Matthew 21:23-27 Jesus applies leverage to the chief priests and elders, and then refuses to answer their question when they aren't forthcoming with Him.

    John 2:15 Jesus brandishes a whip and chases out merchants camping out in the temple.

    Jesus told us that the most important commands were to love the Lord with all our hearts, and to love our neighbors as ourselves. I have come to believe that loving someone doesn't necessarily mean doing what's the most comfortable or calming for them, but what may be best for them.

    A wife to a drug addict may be making her husband more comfortable by supplying him with the drugs, but it shows more love for her to deny him access to the drugs, and to help him recover, even though he will feel angry, helpless, and will go through the agony of withdrawal. Similarly, a manipulative family must not be allowed or encouraged to continue with their machinations, instead it shows more love to correct them, or to reject their behavior; tolerate them, not their behavior.

    How are you feeling about all this, my friend?
     
  13. I will just add my points here.. I think it is important to look at what forgiveness.. Most of the people think forgiveness means just forgetting everything as though it has never happened.. Forgiveness is not that.. I think the best definition of forgiveness would come from Cross.. Father did not just forget the sin of mankind and say it's okay.. The sin was paid on the cross.. Forgiveness is acknowledging it has happened and not paying back the due penalty.. So to forgive a person does not mean simply press rewind button and everything would be same as how it was before.. Let's take this hypothegical example.. A father has 2 daughter.. One guy cheats one of the daughters.. The father forgives him.. The guy tries to cheat the other daughter.. Should the father say "I have forgiven him and have forgot whatever has happened and give him another chance". Absolutely no! Though the father should not arrange from mafia to take care of the guy, it does not mean he should allow it to happen again and again..
     
  14. That is pretty good............ So if I come over your house and leave with your TV, then You would forgive me, but there would be a good chance that I might not be invited over anymore?

    My Grandpa use to say.......... Do me dirty, it's your fault. Do me dirty again and it's my fault.
     
    God_be_with_you likes this.
  15. Right.. I would go by Jesus' advice

    “If your brother or sister sins against you, rebuke them; and if they repent, forgive them. Even if they sin against you seven times in a day and seven times come back to you saying ‘I repent,’ you must forgive them.”

    The important point I see is if they are willing to accept the mistake.. I don't think forgiveness is conditional.. We should forgive someone unconditionally.. That is what Bible teaches at other places.. What we allow next to happen would be conditional.. Because if they don't accept their mistakes or repent, then it is written on the wall that the same is going to happen again!

    Letting a former thief repenting his sins is very different from letting an unrepentant sinner inside the house.
     
  16. My pastor was talking about forgiveness in one of his sermons and he had a great example. "The pastor and deacons of the church hired a new treasurer. The man was a great christian man and did a great job. After several years of service the man they hired started stealing money. The deacons and pastor couldnt believe that he would do such a thing yet money kept coming up missing. They did an investigation and found that he was truely stealing from the church. They confronted the treasurer and he confessed saying his family was struggling financially. The church released him of his duties and forgave him. They did not give him his job back.

    Moral of the story is you can forgive but you also need to be wise and if hes a habitual offender than maybe its better to just stay away. But do so under the right reasons. If you truely havent forgiven him you will just harbor hate in your heart. You can love someone and hope them well but u dont have to trust. Protect your heart. God has someone planned for you. His answer to your prayers at this time just might be "not right now" when u stop looking is when he will bring the one. And trust me you will know when he does.
     
  17. Just to look at it from a different perspective, not saying I agree or disagree here, but wouldn't it be interesting if God said I forgive you guys, but I'm going to be wise and send you to hell still. Because you've always been a sinner and stole.. How do I know you're not going to go into heaven and start stealing from the angels?
     
    ElliDV likes this.
  18. But what if they do not repent? What if they deny the "sin" or downplay it?
    It seems rare these days to get a good old genuine apology... That's what you mean by repent, right?
     
  19. I saw a reality tv show about restaurant owners spying on their employees to see if they were good or not. This one had a manager who was stealing meat. He would take the meat and go and sell it to another guy.

    When I was watching the show I thought this guy is fired for sure, but what the owner did surprised me. At first when he confronted the guy, the guy was all defensive, but when they showed all the evidence he couldn't deny it. The guy was so scared, because he thought for sure he would lose his job. Instead the owner told him how he was like family to him.. He asked if he was in need of money, and why he was stealing. The owner ended up not firing the guy, but instead giving him a raise, because he cared for the guy and had compassion towards him and his situation.
     
    ElliDV likes this.
  20. To expect an apology, in my humble opinion is prideful. We forgive for God. Think about when Christ was on the cross. He had been beaten, they were mocking him, and killing him. These people were definitely not repenting, and what did Christ say on the cross, while they were in the middle of committing a horrible sin?

    Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing."
     
    ElliDV and Sal say Amen and like this.

Share This Page